Edge_Design Posted January 18, 2017 Posted January 18, 2017 Interesting outcome... the amazing thing with bicycle warranties is that they are solely at the discretion of the supplier and there is very little you can do to argue with their decision. That's not specific to this supplier, but applies to most (if not all) brands.
Skinnyone Posted January 18, 2017 Posted January 18, 2017 Interesting outcome... the amazing thing with bicycle any warranties is that they are solely at the discretion of the supplier and there is very little you can do to argue with their decision. That's not specific to this supplier, but applies to most (if not all) brands.fixed...
gmh Posted January 18, 2017 Posted January 18, 2017 I have a 2012 Foil, and no issues. What I am concerned about is this clamping which is mentioned, I assume it is the bike rack. I have always used a boot mount rack which has two straps to tie down the bike. I recently received a tow bar rack where the bike sits on the platform, and has a single clamp, could this cause problems & stresses on the frame and then this issue occur.
Pure Savage Posted January 18, 2017 Posted January 18, 2017 I have a 2012 Foil, and no issues. What I am concerned about is thisclamping which is mentioned, I assume it is the bike rack. I have always used a boot mount rack which has two straps to tie down the bike. I recently received a tow bar rack where the bike sits on the platform, and has a single clamp, could this cause problems & stresses on the frame and then this issue occur.I have used one of those racks for 5 years, the forses for that clamp are more side to side and the platform carries all the weight. No issues.
Skinnyone Posted January 18, 2017 Posted January 18, 2017 I have used one of those racks for 5 years, the forses for that clamp are more side to side and the platform carries all the weight. No issues.UNless you over tighten the clamp...which can and does happen...
Pure Savage Posted January 18, 2017 Posted January 18, 2017 UNless you over tighten the clamp...which can and does happen... I let a 'family member' load our bikes and he basically stripped the screw he had tightened it so much and it did not damage the Venge. I have replaced the nut in my clamp about 5 times now.
NotSoBigBen Posted January 18, 2017 Posted January 18, 2017 Let us know what your Insurance saysFor some reason he mentioned he would not be going through his insurance ....
Skylark Posted January 18, 2017 Posted January 18, 2017 For some reason he mentioned he would not be going through his insurance ....Why ever not though, if it's insured an incident happened, at least submit a claim and see what they say, unless there is more to the story?
PhilipV Posted January 19, 2017 Posted January 19, 2017 I'd still go the insurance route. The worst they can do is decline it. Plan C is to send it to Bogus Design or one of the carbon kayak specialists to repair the frame. That is the beauty of carbon. It can be repaired.
Patchelicious Posted January 19, 2017 Posted January 19, 2017 so my warranty claim was declined by headoffice. The response was that there was external force applied....which I agree with as I have stated my thigh hit the top tube - what has left a bitter after taste is that they seem to keep referring to a clamp or my handle bars hitting the top tube and that's why its not a warranty claim..... as if it couldn't have been my thigh and implying I am being dishonest about what actually happened. In any event I will not go through my insurance. For interest sake to those that asked - the brand is Scott and the bike was the foil 20. and attached is a image of the crack.Why not?
dirtypot Posted January 19, 2017 Posted January 19, 2017 Reminds me of this Scott warranty claim - https://community.bikehub.co.za/topic/153853-scott-sa-duck-and-diving-the-warranty-claim/?do=findComment&comment=2705864
rudi-h Posted January 19, 2017 Posted January 19, 2017 I make my living out of advising on equipment failures and warranty claims in the mining industry... Firstly, your thigh is not strong or hard enough to crack the top tube of a top end road frame. Are you sure there was not any other incident? No scratchmarks, paint chips or dents close to the fracture area? Maybe share some pics... Then there is the fracture itself. I'm assuming that with a R50k price tag it is an all-carbon frame. Metal is easier, because it is very easy on e.g. an aluminium tube to determine whether the crack was a brittle fracture, fatigue fracture or whatever else by looking purely at the texture and shape of the fracture surface. With carbon, this might take some work, however in most cases with carbon i'd expect a sudden fracture rather than something that happens over time. The next step is to see whether the position of the crack makes sense... This can be done by re-enacting the event to understand where your leg would have hit the frame, and then try to understand through some strength of materials basics where the maximum forces and moments will be. If this correlates 100% to the actual fracture, then you start to have a point... When all this adds up (no previous history or evidence of damages, 100% correlation between where you expect the crack to be and where it actually is based on your cat-eye incident), then it is time to do some tests. Who pays for these in the bicycle industry? That I'm not sure. In mining the testing cost is normally a fraction of the component replacement cost, so we as the mining house often absorb the cost in order to support a much larger warranty claim. In your personal capacity, even R200 on a test that might not fully support your claim could be seen as money wasted towards your replacement bike. I would imagine that the manufacturer would be interested in better understanding where and how frame failures happen, so if you provide a solid technical argument, I would hope that the major manufacturers will be willing to investigate. I had two previous warranty replacements on frames where they cracked on welds over time with heavy riding. In both cases the manufacturer acknowledged that this has happened before and that they have subsequently altered the weld design. I would also read the online forums to gather some evidence of similar occurrences with the same bike type.
Skinnyone Posted January 19, 2017 Posted January 19, 2017 Well put Rudi, I think there is a bit more to this than a simple cateye/bump and knee/thigh striking the tube... Like I have said in previous posts - I have taken a big hammer to old frames (more than one manufacturer) and even in the middle of the frame it takes a mighty blow to inflict damage. Having worked with carbon in its raw state I appreciate its properties and capabilities. Remember that a frame is made up of many layers of carbon laid in such a way to provide stiffness as well as resist impact damage. As a mass produced frame manufacturer, Scott (as well as all the others) build in a safety net of strength to guard against a JRA hit a cateye and my frame broke scenario resulting in lawsuits etc... Most manufacturers will release a service dialogue of noted faults/trends in claims to help warranty agents determine the best solutions for various cases.
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