rattlesnake Posted February 2, 2017 Posted February 2, 2017 On "wheel sucking"...... Peter Sagan, world champion, two years running.Nobody even saw him before 5kms to go. He won. He sat in the bunch. He is 2 time world champion.Some might even call him a legend....
rattlesnake Posted February 2, 2017 Posted February 2, 2017 pe3nguin, on 31 Jan 2017 - 10:59 AM, said:Personal rule: If I can't drop you, I dont deserve to bitch about wheel sucking.If I did just drop you, why the hell would I be thinking about you? `What this gentlemen just said ^^^^^^^And what this guys said
Patchelicious Posted February 2, 2017 Posted February 2, 2017 On "wheel sucking"...... Peter Sagan, world champion, two years running.Nobody even saw him before 5kms to go. He won. He sat in the bunch. He is 2 time world champion.Some might even call him a legend....The mistake you are making is in comparing a UCI Racing category to open seeded groups.
Pure Savage Posted February 2, 2017 Posted February 2, 2017 On "wheel sucking"...... Peter Sagan, world champion, two years running.Nobody even saw him before 5kms to go. He won. He sat in the bunch. He is 2 time world champion.Some might even call him a legend.... True on those occasions, but remember there are lots of other considerations at world champs, like its raced as nations, not trade teams, so Peter only has one other Slovak there to ride for him, you will not see any favourite sitting in the paceline. Then in the classics we saw a lot of him for large portions of these races he won as he demolished his opponents: 1st Tour of Flanders 1st Gent–Wevelgem When you ride someone off your wheel you are the opposite of a wheel sucker.
rattlesnake Posted February 2, 2017 Posted February 2, 2017 True on those occasions, but remember there are lots of other considerations at world champs, like its raced as nations, not trade teams, so Peter only has one other Slovak there to ride for him, you will not see any favourite sitting in the paceline. Then in the classics we saw a lot of him for large portions of these races he won as he demolished his opponents: 1st Tour of Flanders 1st Gent–Wevelgem When you ride someone off your wheel you are the opposite of a wheel sucker. Truth of cycling. Only 1 guy is not a wheel sucker and that's the guy that wins. Everyone else is wheel sucking until they can't hold on anymore.
L46 Posted February 2, 2017 Posted February 2, 2017 I usually start in AL. I have tried to help out at the front, but I am not quite strong enough. As a rule ,if the group splits, and I land up in the chase group, I will be one of two or three guys working on the front to try and catch up with the group. When I fell 26km into the Fast One, I was off the group, and the first rider back up. I rode 10km solo, keeping tabs on my power numbers. I had a lapse in concentration, and slowed down slightly. Two riders passed me. I then turned around and found a group of about 10 to 15 guys behind me.About 4 off us rotated and we picked up quite a few extra riders that had been dropped.About 20km from the end, I decided that if I carry on at this pace I will be in deep poo when the last 5km, pace increase happens, so I rolled back and sat in the group. I am also amazed how many guys will sit in the chase bunch while a couple do the work. Bad luck on the crash, was your time 2h33ish?
Pure Savage Posted February 2, 2017 Posted February 2, 2017 Truth of cycling. Only 1 guy is not a wheel sucker and that's the guy that wins. Everyone else is wheel sucking until they can't hold on anymore.No, I think you dont understand what a wheel sucker is. In a break away group of 5 guys, working together in a paceline there is no wheel sucker. Regardless of who wins. If there are 8 guys and one dude not doing a turn, he is the wheel sucker.
rattlesnake Posted February 2, 2017 Posted February 2, 2017 No, I think you dont understand what a wheel sucker is. In a break away group of 5 guys, working together in a paceline there is no wheel sucker. Regardless of who wins. If there are 8 guys and one dude not doing a turn, he is the wheel sucker. If you're a caveman yes. So you've never seen a break away where one of the guys soft pedals a little to save some energy to break from the break group near the end? Its called tactics. Cycling is a thinking game ... sometimes strong cavemen win.... but only sometimes.
jcza Posted February 2, 2017 Posted February 2, 2017 No, I think you dont understand what a wheel sucker is. In a break away group of 5 guys, working together in a paceline there is no wheel sucker. Regardless of who wins. If there are 8 guys and one dude not doing a turn, he is the wheel sucker. Unless of course in the group of 8 guys one rider has a team mate up the road, in which case he becomes a non-sucking wheel sucker and won't contribute.
Pure Savage Posted February 2, 2017 Posted February 2, 2017 Unless of course in the group of 8 guys one rider has a team mate up the road, in which case he becomes a non-sucking wheel sucker and won't contribute. Agreed. sometimes even if its three riders vs one rider from another team, the one rider is not the wheel sucker as is marking attacks.
Pure Savage Posted February 2, 2017 Posted February 2, 2017 If you're a caveman yes. So you've never seen a break away where one of the guys soft pedals a little to save some energy to break from the break group near the end? Its called tactics. Cycling is a thinking game ... sometimes strong cavemen win.... but only sometimes. If they are coming through and still taking part in the paceline that would not be wheel sucking. You wouldn't call Alberto Contador a wheel sucker when he get led up the mountains by his team or Kittel on his lead out. A wheel sucker would be a Valverde who just shrugs his shoulders and does zero work on the front. A wheel sucker is not just someone cycling behind someone else.
rattlesnake Posted February 2, 2017 Posted February 2, 2017 If they are coming through and still taking part in the paceline that would not be wheel sucking. You wouldn't call Alberto Contador a wheel sucker when he get led up the mountains by his team or Kittel on his lead out. A wheel sucker would be a Valverde who just shrugs his shoulders and does zero work on the front. A wheel sucker is not just someone cycling behind someone else. Yet Valverde has one of the most impressive Palmares in the pro peloton.... just saying.When the differences in ability between riders in any particular group is so small, tactics are often the differentiator, some might call it wheel sucking, others might call it brilliant tactics. Its very circumstantial. But I'll concede this much, there is a difference between guys sitting wheel just to get accross the line and guys sitting wheel and using the saved energy to be the aggressor at some stage in the race.... but then again where is the cut off.... ? 5kms to go, 500m? or 5m?
Spinnekop Posted February 2, 2017 Posted February 2, 2017 Wheelsuckers........workers....sprinters....winners.....blah blah blah. Unless you are an Elite rider doing it for a profession, "winning" is just the person who is first over a line drawn on the road. You'll soon be forgotton. As I see it.....you have 2 types of riders. Those who sit in the bunch and do nothing and just gets sucked along for the time. They are normally the guys that are first to brag about their good time.This first guy will sometimes win races when he sprints after sitting on his ass for 3 hours racing "clever" in an open seeded bunch (hahahhaha....hahhahaha....BAHAHHAH)But he will not get fitter or stronger and most often he will not have the respect of his fellow rider. The second rider is the one that TRIES to get away. Tries to race positive from the front trying to break or to get a gap or chase down etc. This second guy rarely wins but always try to do something. Anything.This second guy is mostly recognised by his fellow riders as a strong rider that races positive. In the end it is ALL FOR FUN. So if you enjoy to wheelsuck and brag about your funride win and good time.....you go boy. If you love making the racing and being active and try break aways......you go boy. But no use bitching about the other type of rider's strategy. My 2c.
Spinnekop Posted February 2, 2017 Posted February 2, 2017 Yet Valverde has one of the most impressive Palmares in the pro peloton.... just saying. You are confusing funriders with pros again. Big difference to get paid for a win. Then you win at all cost. We funriders are a different animal.
Pure Savage Posted February 2, 2017 Posted February 2, 2017 Yet Valverde has one of the most impressive Palmares in the pro peloton.... just saying.When the differences in ability between riders in any particular group is so small, tactics are often the differentiator, some might call it wheel sucking, others might call it brilliant tactics. Its very circumstantial. But I'll concede this much, there is a difference between guys sitting wheel just to get accross the line and guys sitting wheel and using the saved energy to be the aggressor at some stage in the race.... but then again where is the cut off.... ? 5kms to go, 500m? or 5m? Agreed, its a very fine line to tread. I think the original question was about people just sitting on and getting a free ride the entire fun ride just to sprint for line honors for the F batch. *Rant on* Valverde's blood bad was sitting in Siberia, so will wait till July when they release the results of the blood tests. I just dont trust Mr Peak the whole season. *Rant over*
Pure Savage Posted February 2, 2017 Posted February 2, 2017 Wheelsuckers........workers....sprinters....winners.....blah blah blah. Unless you are an Elite rider doing it for a profession, "winning" is just the person who is first over a line drawn on the road. You'll soon be forgotton. As I see it.....you have 2 types of riders. Those who sit in the bunch and do nothing and just gets sucked along for the time. They are normally the guys that are first to brag about their good time.This first guy will sometimes win races when he sprints after sitting on his ass for 3 hours racing "clever" in an open seeded bunch (hahahhaha....hahhahaha....BAHAHHAH)But he will not get fitter or stronger and most often he will not have the respect of his fellow rider. The second rider is the one that TRIES to get away. Tries to race positive from the front trying to break or to get a gap or chase down etc. This second guy rarely wins but always try to do something. Anything.This second guy is mostly recognised by his fellow riders as a strong rider that races positive. In the end it is ALL FOR FUN. So if you enjoy to wheelsuck and brag about your funride win and good time.....you go boy. If you love making the racing and being active and try break aways......you go boy. But no use bitching about the other type of rider's strategy. My R200 Well put. This is very much what it boils down to. Nobody goes home thinking, wow that guy won the C bunch sprint, they think, yoh, that dude put me in the red zone for 3 hours, what a beast.
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