Eugéne Alberts Posted August 13, 2019 Posted August 13, 2019 Dear, anyone that knows about these things. When crankset or chainrings are described in ads they are sometimes described as 2x10 or 1x11. Though, I understand what that means(in case someone feels snarky), I don't understand how this applies when they are sold separately. Are cassettes sold to be paired with a specific number of chainrings and vice versa?
Simon Kolin Posted August 13, 2019 Posted August 13, 2019 I don't think a cassette cares about anything other than (a) the about of cable release that allows it to shift correctly. i.e. a Shimano sifter will release the correct amount to shift on a Shimano or Shimano compatible cassette. That's why you can't use (say) Suntour shifters on a Shimano Cassette. Or (2) the Cassette Body groves. Shimano and Campy are very different. Similarly now SRAM are very different to both. That said, I think if an advert describes a cassette as 1x11 or 1x12 it simply denotes the range of teeth you could expect on each cog of the cassette. E.g. 1x11, could be typically 11/46 for MTB. 2x11, could be 11/28 or 11/32, etc for Road. Think that answered your question?
Eugéne Alberts Posted August 13, 2019 Author Posted August 13, 2019 Yip, fairly comprehensively. Thanks, bud. I don't think a cassette cares about anything other than (a) the about of cable release that allows it to shift correctly. i.e. a Shimano sifter will release the correct amount to shift on a Shimano or Shimano compatible cassette. That's why you can't use (say) Suntour shifters on a Shimano Cassette. Or (2) the Cassette Body groves. Shimano and Campy are very different. Similarly now SRAM are very different to both. That said, I think if an advert describes a cassette as 1x11 or 1x12 it simply denotes the range of teeth you could expect on each cog of the cassette. E.g. 1x11, could be typically 11/46 for MTB. 2x11, could be 11/28 or 11/32, etc for Road. Think that answered your question?
Me rida my bicycle Posted August 13, 2019 Posted August 13, 2019 2x10 blades makes sense as to why you would give a description as they are for 2x10 or 2x11 crank/gears. As for 1x blades that matters more on the bcd than the speed as most of them can be used on 9/10/11 or 12spd. I think they are described as 2x10 or 1x11 by sellers as that is as it was used or the intended use.
Ashchest Posted August 13, 2019 Posted August 13, 2019 Wouldn't 1 x 11 or 1 x 10 utilise narrow / wide type rings to hold the chain, where 2 x 10 & 2 x 11's will not utilise narrow wide type because it is designed to be used with front derailleures?
Eugéne Alberts Posted August 13, 2019 Author Posted August 13, 2019 Thanks. 2x10 blades makes sense as to why you would give a description as they are for 2x10 or 2x11 crank/gears. As for 1x blades that matters more on the bcd than the speed as most of them can be used on 9/10/11 or 12spd. I think they are described as 2x10 or 1x11 by sellers as that is as it was used or the intended use.
ChrisF Posted August 13, 2019 Posted August 13, 2019 my random input .... When doing a 3x to 1x conversion (using the old 3x crank) you buy a narrow-wide ring, and it gets fitted to the "mid ring" : Obviously a 1x crank can only fit one ring ..... So what are your options with a 2x crank ??? IF you were to try and use this as a 1x ....- wonder if you find a ring that would fit the mountings of either the small or the large ring .... (or is this the same pcd as the large rings?)- such a mount position may well be too far to either side ..... Long way to say that each is specific to the intended use. disclaimer - all the waffling above is based on limited experience, and I fully expect to be corrected on some items (but hey, thats how we learn)
DieselnDust Posted August 13, 2019 Posted August 13, 2019 Wouldn't 1 x 11 or 1 x 10 utilise narrow / wide type rings to hold the chain, where 2 x 10 & 2 x 11's will not utilise narrow wide type because it is designed to be used with front derailleures? Bingo! its got more to do with the intended drivetrain to be used and the type of teeth on the chainrings
Eugéne Alberts Posted August 13, 2019 Author Posted August 13, 2019 Can you elaborate, please? Only 1x chainrings are narrow wide. Would there be a reason to describe a crankset as x11 or x12 or a cassette as 2x or 1x? Bingo! its got more to do with the intended drivetrain to be used and the type of teeth on the chainrings
ridr Posted August 13, 2019 Posted August 13, 2019 my random input .... When doing a 3x to 1x conversion (using the old 3x crank) you buy a narrow-wide ring, and it gets fitted to the "mid ring" : Mongoose revamp-4.jpg Mongoose revamp-110.jpg Obviously a 1x crank can only fit one ring ..... So what are your options with a 2x crank ??? IF you were to try and use this as a 1x ....- wonder if you find a ring that would fit the mountings of either the small or the large ring .... (or is this the same pcd as the large rings?)- such a mount position may well be too far to either side ..... Long way to say that each is specific to the intended use. disclaimer - all the waffling above is based on limited experience, and I fully expect to be corrected on some items (but hey, thats how we learn) I think the 2x and 3x spiders generally have the same 104BCD where you would mount the 1x conversion on the inside - the 3x also has extra holes for a 64BCD small chainring. EDIT: the 2x also has the 64BCD holes for the small chainring.
ridr Posted August 13, 2019 Posted August 13, 2019 Can you elaborate, please? Only 1x chainrings are narrow wide. Would there be a reason to describe a crankset as x11 or x12 or a cassette as 2x or 1x? A bike shop questioned me about running an eagle 12 speed chainring with my 11 speed chain and cassette - but if you look at the aftermarket chainrings like Rapide they say they are compatible with 9, 10, 11 or 12 speed chain, so I don't think the chainring makes a difference. The chain and cassette however need to be compatible. (So if you run a 1x or 2x setup up front is irrelevant to the cassette, as long as you run the correct chain for 10, 11 or 12 speed - wouldn't describe a cassette as 1x or 2x.) I agree with you I think if this is what you're getting at: I can't see any significance in stating 1x 10 or 11 or 12 when selling a crankset. 1x should be enough of a description. Not 100% sure about 2x 10 and 11 - but I think you can run 10 or 11 speed chain on either, so also shouldn't be a necessary part of the description. And then obviously you can still change the 104bcd spider to a DM chainring on some cranks or change the 2x setup to a 1x setup on a 104bcd spider (as in pic higher up), so then it doesn't really make a difference if it's advertised as 1x or 2x.
DieselnDust Posted August 13, 2019 Posted August 13, 2019 Dear, anyone that knows about these things. When crankset or chainrings are described in ads they are sometimes described as 2x10 or 1x11.Though, I understand what that means(in case someone feels snarky), I don't understand how this applies when they are sold separately. Are cassettes sold to be paired with a specific number of chainrings and vice versa? Cassettes are sold according to the number of sprockets. They don't care how many chainrings you're using. Chainrings are sold according to the drivetrain and bcd mounting requirements for the crank and the type of teeth; Narrow wide (x1) or conventional involute (for 2x and 3x).BCD (bolr circle diameter) is typically 64mm for the inner most chainring in 3x drivetrains and then either 96mm or 104mm for the middle and outer chainrings of 3x systems or 2x systems. Marketers mention the drivetain configuration on the packaging to make it easy for the layman to select what they need without getting it wrong
DieselnDust Posted August 13, 2019 Posted August 13, 2019 A bike shop questioned me about running an eagle 12 speed chainring with my 11 speed chain and cassette - but if you look at the aftermarket chainrings like Rapide they say they are compatible with 9, 10, 11 or 12 speed chain, so I don't think the chainring makes a difference. The chain and cassette however need to be compatible. (So if you run a 1x or 2x setup up front is irrelevant to the cassette, as long as you run the correct chain for 10, 11 or 12 speed - wouldn't describe a cassette as 1x or 2x.) I agree with you I think if this is what you're getting at: I can't see any significance in stating 1x 10 or 11 or 12 when selling a crankset. 1x should be enough of a description. Not 100% sure about 2x 10 and 11 - but I think you can run 10 or 11 speed chain on either, so also shouldn't be a necessary part of the description. And then obviously you can still change the 104bcd spider to a DM chainring on some cranks or change the 2x setup to a 1x setup on a 104bcd spider (as in pic higher up), so then it doesn't really make a difference if it's advertised as 1x or 2x. a 12speed chain will work on a 10s or 11s system. a 9speed chain won't work on an 11s or 12s systems because its too wide across the pins and outer plates. 12S chains have the same inner spacing as the others they just use thinner outerplates and shorter pins. So they fit onto the teeth of even 9s cassettes but they don't shift very well on 9s systems due to the sprocket spacing.
Hamstring Posted August 14, 2019 Posted August 14, 2019 my random input .... When doing a 3x to 1x conversion (using the old 3x crank) you buy a narrow-wide ring, and it gets fitted to the "mid ring" : Mongoose revamp-4.jpg Mongoose revamp-110.jpg Obviously a 1x crank can only fit one ring ..... So what are your options with a 2x crank ??? IF you were to try and use this as a 1x ....- wonder if you find a ring that would fit the mountings of either the small or the large ring .... (or is this the same pcd as the large rings?)- such a mount position may well be too far to either side ..... Long way to say that each is specific to the intended use. disclaimer - all the waffling above is based on limited experience, and I fully expect to be corrected on some items (but hey, thats how we learn) 32 tooth no man
ChrisF Posted August 14, 2019 Posted August 14, 2019 32 tooth no man Hiehie ..... sure to be changed in due course .... first need to SEE how these legs cope .... Stem has since been shortened. And he can now turn the peddles without rocking too much .... And uses every opportunity to do this on the trainer. He does NOT like a granny gear on the trainer !! But he still need about 20mm in-seam before he can safely stand over the bike though ..... PS - I will monitor his top speed to decide when to up the front ring .... dont want him going too fast, not just yet .... already getting close to 30km/h on a 24'' on the trails !!
ChrisF Posted August 14, 2019 Posted August 14, 2019 I think the 2x and 3x spiders generally have the same 104BCD where you would mount the 1x conversion on the inside - the 3x also has extra holes for a 64BCD small chainring. would be interesting to hear if anybody has done a 1x conversion on a 2x crank ..... how did the allignment work out ?
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