whats the best lube to use????

[Johan Bornman]

JB - The right lube applied in the incorrect manner can be useless - if you look @ White Lightning and Rock & Roll and all the stuff that you dont like to use...

 

Stop beating about the bush. What is the "incorrect manner".

 

[AndreZA]

JB - The right lube applied in the incorrect manner can be useless - if you look @ White Lightning and Rock?& Roll and all the stuff that you dont like to use...

 

?

 

Stop beating about the bush. What is the "incorrect manner".

 

?

 

 

 

by putting it on your handlebars.

 

 

 

.

[Johan Bornman]

can someone tell me why my MTB drivetrain is much cleaner after a ride then my road bike. I use the same lube on both. Both is ridden in dry conditions.

.

 

Nicely spotted. This is of course true when riding in the dry. In the dry on a MTB, the oil/wax mixes with dust and like dry pizza dough, just flakes off, leaving your chain quite clean.

 

In dry contiditions on a road bike, there is no dust and the oil stays clean and liquid and of course, turns black.

 

The same happens when it is wet incidentally - provided you hose off the MTB chain and remove loose sand before making the observation.

[splat]

JB - The right lube applied in the incorrect manner can be useless - if you look @ White Lightning and Rock & Roll and all the stuff that you dont like to use...

 

Stop beating about the bush. What is the "incorrect manner".

 

 

Lathering it all over the place like you do with the oil you love so much.

[splat]

JB, how does your generously oiled chain cope with muddy conditions?

I just picture the oil mixing with the mud and making a nice gringing paste. My White Lightning is useless and I dont use Squirt (yet), so am still searching for winter chain lube for my mtb.

[Johan Bornman]

JB - The right lube applied in the incorrect manner can be useless - if you look @ White Lightning and Rock & Roll and all the stuff that you dont like to use...

 

Stop beating about the bush. What is the "incorrect manner".

 

 

Lathering it all over the place like you do with the oil you love so much.

 

Thank you, now we can get down to brass tacks.

 

The original statement was that successful lubrication has more to do with the method of application than what you use.

 

Successful lubrication in my book is the maximum reduction of friction using a specific product. Now, whether I lather it on, as you suggest, or put a drop on every second link (as I do), you'll get the same level of lubrication - both successfull, and in contradiction of the original statement.

 

Further, oil for bikes is sold in a little bottle with a dropper, not in a can with a paintbrush. What is so difficult to deduce from that?

 

 

 

 

[splat]

Ok, understanding you a bit better now.

 

Why every second link?

[Underachiever]

Interesting debate:

 

I use Squirt for a number of years now and yes it will not penetrate the chain immediately' date=' but liquid viscosity is a function of temperature, so it penetrates better in hot weather vs. winter.  So I rotate the chain a few times, wait for a few hours and then go ride.  Need to relube about every 300 km or whenever I wash my bike.  Squirt does not like to get wet at all.

 [/quote']

 

I think your observation is flawed.

 

Squirt, after solidifying, does not become liquid again at ambient temperature. You'll have to go into the upper 50 or 60 degrees Celcius to liquify that stuff again. And at the lower end of our ambient temperature it is still a solid. I don't think there is any difference in flow performance between our coldest and hottest days.

 

If it didn't penetrate the chain when you applied it, it will never penetrate the chain, it being a solid after a while. Squirt does achieve some penetration because it is dissolved and flows by capiliary action into cavities where the carrier evaporates and leaves the solid behind. The problem then starts, it cannot re-flow after it was squeezed out of the pressure face.

 

I don't know what you mean by it not liking water. In fact, it is completely impervious to water. This is evident from when you are trying to wash the bike and remove the gunk from your jockey wheel and chain sideplates.

 

Where it really matters, inside, it is long gone by the time you wash your bike. It migrates out and settles where it is not needed and certainly not wanted.

 

In MTB conditions it simply mixes with the dirt and flakes off, but water doesn't play a role in its disappearance.

 

 

 

My observation was 100%.  Your reading skills needs to improve.  I never said that the Squirt solidified. My OBSERVATION during winter was that it seems to flow slower than during a hot summer day. Hence sitting more on the chain initially, and battling to work its way into all the nooks and crannies of the chain. During summer much easier to work with.

 

Being a dry lube is does not like wet weather conditions.  Was re-empasizing the obvious.

 

 

[TNT1]

 

Interesting debate:

 

I use Squirt for a number of years now and yes it will not penetrate the chain immediately' date=' but liquid viscosity is a function of temperature, so it penetrates better in hot weather vs. winter.  So I rotate the chain a few times, wait for a few hours and then go ride.  Need to relube about every 300 km or whenever I wash my bike.  Squirt does not like to get wet at all.

 [/quote']

 

I think your observation is flawed.

 

blah blah

 

 

 

 

Doesn't matter. He rides his bike in the real world, not in your science textbook, and his 20000 odd km cassettes (dunno if you need an apostrophe in there) are testament to the fact that his method/application/observation (insert correct semantic differential as required) works.

 

[Johan Bornman]

Ok' date=' understanding you a bit better now.

 

Why every second link?

[/quote']

 

I should have said every second ROLLER, but I think our understanding is in sync.

 

I skip every second roller because a full drop on every roller is too much. It will splatter onto your rims.

 

In fact, a full drop on every second roller is also too much and I restrict the size of the drop by having the oiler nozzle make contact with the roller before I squeeze oil out. That way the drop size is reduced.

 

The oil very quickly distributes evenly over the chain if you turn the cranks, thanks to capilary action that effectively sucks it into the niches in the chain.

 

Even so, you'll quickly have oil on the sideplates as well.

 

Too much oil is just too messy. I'm fastidious.

 

[Shebeen]

 ˙uʍop ǝpısdn uoıʇɐsɹǝʌuoɔ sıɥʇ ƃuıddılɟ ʎllɐǝɹ sı ɹɐɯɯɐɹƃ puɐ ƃuıllǝds pɐq sıɥʇ ɟo llɐ

Now that's cool. Note correct use of apostrophe.

I use Squirt because I got sick of the whole wet lube/dry lube thing and not mixing the two. I think its the best allrounder and it goes on my mtb and roadbike. There might be better options out there, but I'm happy.

 

[Johan Bornman]

 

My observation was 100%.  Your reading skills needs to improve.  I never said that the Squirt solidified. My OBSERVATION during winter was that it seems to flow slower than during a hot summer day. Hence sitting more on the chain initially' date=' and battling to work its way into all the nooks and crannies of the chain. During summer much easier to work with.

 

Being a dry lube is does not like wet weather conditions.  Was re-empasizing the obvious.

 

 

[/quote']

 

I am the one that said Squirt solidifies. Because that's what it does. I get what you're saying about it being like treacle on a cold day but solvents don't display huge changes in viscosity at the temperature ranges humans can tolerate. An example would be the viscosity of paraffin or petrol on a very cold or very hot day.

 

However, I am a firm believer in experiment. I have a small bottle of Squirt in the freezer here at Yellow Saddle Labs. Lets see what the change in viscosity is at 20 degrees and minus 5 (I'll give you a more accurate freezer temp as soon as the thermometer has settled.

 

We're interested in the properties of the stuff out the bottle, not once it has turned into wax.

 

I still don't know why you say Squirt doesn't like wet conditions. Don't anthropomorise the statement but rather describe what happens. I've explained that it is is impervious to water even though it carries the arbritary "Dry" label. "Dry" or "wet" are meaningless terms unless you're referring to true dry, powdered lubricant such as graphite powder.

 

 

[HomerSimpson]

The problems with lubes is that we expect miracles and the manufacturers and their marketing spin doctors sieze this opportunity and feed us the BS that we lap up in a crazed frenzy.

Exactly what I have always thought

I use leftover car oil (from oil changes' date=' the clean stuff) and I can say that it is no worse than the R60 a bottle you pay for in a bike shop. It is no better either though.
[/quote']

 

I really think the best lube is the one you firmly believe is the best.  I have (for the past 8 years) used a very thin lube for both road and MTB.  On occasion I have been in the position where I ran out of my preferred lube and no chance of getting any before the next morning's race.  Simply used ordinary Castrol household oil (R 6.50 for 125 mL at the local Co-op).  Worked fine. 

For me the bottom line is cleaning the chain and drivetrain regularly (and thoroughly).  I'd quote kms achieved per chain and casette for road and MTB but I'm worried that Johan will tell me that it's all anecdotal and lacks factual proof...

HomerSimpson2009-03-11 01:20:02

[Underachiever]

Tell me Johan

 

OT question: Are you from German descent?

[Gert Janse v Rensburg]

JB - The right lube applied in the incorrect manner can be useless - if you look @ White Lightning and Rock & Roll and all the stuff that you dont like to use...

 

Stop beating about the bush. What is the "incorrect manner".

 

 

Lathering it all over the place like you do with the oil you love so much.

 

Thank you' date=' now we can get down to brass tacks.

 

The original statement was that successful lubrication has more to do with the method of application than what you use.

 

Successful lubrication in my book is the maximum reduction of friction using a specific product. Now, whether I lather it on, as you suggest, or put a drop on every second link (as I do), you'll get the same level of lubrication - both successfull, and in contradiction of the original statement.

 

Further, oil for bikes is sold in a little bottle with a dropper, not in a can with a paintbrush. What is so difficult to deduce from that?

 

 

 

 

[/quote']

 

 

 

Is this why you never get good results in MTB races..... cos when you stop youtake like 40mins just to lube every second link.......

 

 

 

 

[Bike Mob]

I used Squirt exclusively at this years sani2C.

 

We had dry district roads, Wet slippery singletrack. Extremely thick mud caked onto tires and throughout drive train. River crossings and then some more dry roads. It was baking hot.

 

All I did was reapply squirt after the river crossings sometimes. In three days I had one tight link, manipulated and lubed at the Nando's stop. Free'd it up nicely.

 

I never missed a shift and my drivetrain is still in pretty good nick.