Gnarly Posted October 22, 2018 Share So we should discount Rossi's first 2 4T titles, only needed to beat his teammate in those and half the field were crappy 2T's still............. Like I said ..... I personally don't rate Doohan. I never said we must discount his wins, wins are wins. I just don't rate him as a legend. I would rate Casey Stoner as more of a legend than Doohan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patchelicious Posted October 22, 2018 Share So you are saying..... Thats not how we should do it. If we do not know what the other personal is saying, rather ask for clarification. Are you saying.......? General comment, for many threads. Captain Fastbastard Mayhem and Steven Knoetze (sk27) 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven Knoetze (sk27) Posted October 22, 2018 Share Like I said ..... I personally don't rate Doohan. I never said we must discount his wins, wins are wins. I just don't rate him as a legend. I would rate Casey Stoner as more of a legend than Doohan. I think it is really hard to compare records over a wide time-span, similar to movie box office figures. They gauge box office figures on revenue and not bums in seats so where Titannic grossed say $10mil in its opening weekend, that equated to say 500mil people seeing it. Now compare that to movies at todays pricing where only 10mil people would represent $10mil revenue. So when you are comparing number of wins in an era where they race 20 races over a year, to a rider where then only raced 10-15, you can see how records can be skewed. So Doohan in 1997 won 12 out of 15 races yet a modern era rider winning 13 races out of 20 would be deemed as more successful......... For me Doohan, is a legend. sawystertrance 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven Knoetze (sk27) Posted October 22, 2018 Share So you are saying..... Thats not how we should do it. If we do not know what the other personal is saying, rather ask for clarification. Are you saying.......? General comment, for many threads. Agreed, was simply posing a point from my point of view. Could've been worded better but the gist was put across. The problem is posts don't convey tone and rereading my post it could be interpreted as "confrontational"possibly when it really wasn't. Apologies. Edited October 22, 2018 by Steven Knoetze (sk27) Patchelicious 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patchelicious Posted October 22, 2018 Share Agreed, was simply posing a point from my point of view. Could've been worded better but the gist was put across. So you are agreeing with me? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven Knoetze (sk27) Posted October 22, 2018 Share So you are agreeing with me? I do yes. Stranger things have happened you know:) I have also learnt to bite my tongue, of late, if you haven't noticed............... Patchelicious 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gnarly Posted October 22, 2018 Share I think it is really hard to compare records over a wide time-span, similar to movie box office figures. They gauge box office figures on revenue and not bums in seats so where Titannic grossed say $10mil in its opening weekend, that equated to say 500mil people seeing it. Now compare that to movies at todays pricing where only 10mil people would represent $10mil revenue. So when you are comparing number of wins in an era where they race 20 races over a year, to a rider where then only raced 10-15, you can see how records can be skewed. So Doohan in 1997 won 12 out of 15 races yet a modern era rider winning 13 races out of 20 would be deemed as more successful......... For me Doohan, is a legend. We agree one hundred percent when comparing number of race wins and records in different era's. A lot more rounds these days as logistics becomes easier as the world becomes so much smaller. Stoner has less championships to Doohan but i still regard him more of a legend, it's the way he won his championships. Not saying Doohan had it to easy, but those Honda's were FAR superior than ANYTHING out there is those days. Doohan and Criville where miles ahead on those things. And Doohan had far superior mental strength over Criville. Steven Knoetze (sk27) and Chris_ 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patchelicious Posted October 22, 2018 Share I do yes. Stranger things have happened you know:) I have also learnt to bite my tongue, of late, if you haven't noticed...............I think its a case of you not getting triggered so easily anymore I'll just have to up my game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven Knoetze (sk27) Posted October 23, 2018 Share I think its a case of you not getting triggered so easily anymore I'll just have to up my game. I actually agree there too, damn can you believe.Find myself typing responses then closing the windows midway. Maybe I am growing up...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sawystertrance Posted October 23, 2018 Share Thing is you guys are shooting at a moving target. In a question of a matter of opinion, you are both right. It's a fact which can't be proved because of different variables so the best you can offer is an opinion. Meaning that you can't be wrong. Steven Knoetze (sk27) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gemmerbal Posted October 23, 2018 Share Doohan is a legend, look at his record and look at what his piers have/had to say about the man. He was made a member of the Order of Australia which is the highest recognition an individual can achieve if I'm not mistaken. If being labelled a legend is based on subjectivity, MM93 will never be a legend in my view. Steven Knoetze (sk27) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven Knoetze (sk27) Posted October 23, 2018 Share Thing is you guys are shooting at a moving target. In a question of a matter of opinion, you are both right. It's a fact which can't be proved because of different variables so the best you can offer is an opinion. Meaning that you can't be wrong. Agreed, 5 yrs ago "anybody/everybody, me" would have said Rossi's records would be unbeatable but now its not looking that way. Doohan is a legend, look at his record and look at what his piers have/had to say about the man. He was made a member of the Order of Australia which is the highest recognition an individual can achieve if I'm not mistaken. If being labelled a legend is based on subjectivity, MM93 will never be a legend in my view. Its your view but would you share why you feel that way about Marquez. Just curious...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gemmerbal Posted October 23, 2018 Share Agreed, 5 yrs ago "anybody/everybody, me" would have said Rossi's records would be unbeatable but now its not looking that way. Its your view but would you share why you feel that way about Marquez. Just curious......I could, let's have a braai and then we discuss Steven Knoetze (sk27) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gemmerbal Posted October 23, 2018 Share In the late 80's and early 90's you either supported Kevin Schwantz or Wayne Rainey. It's one of those things. Respectfully I decline to say more than that for now. Steven Knoetze (sk27) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven Knoetze (sk27) Posted October 23, 2018 Share In the late 80's and early 90's you either supported Kevin Schwantz or Wayne Rainey. It's one of those things. Respectfully I decline to say more than that for now. You can support one rider but still respect anothers achievements though surely?I support Marc (by virtue of inheriting Casey's bike, the rider I supported from 125's), but I still respect Rossi and believe he is a legend based on his achievements........ As an example, doesn't mean I like him though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andymann Posted October 24, 2018 Share In the late 80's and early 90's you either supported Kevin Schwantz or Wayne Rainey. It's one of those things. Respectfully I decline to say more than that for now.Or Randy Mamola! And Eddie Lawson on the Cagiva because everyone loves the underdog! gemmerbal 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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