Ride with or against traffic flow? Which is safer and why?

[Big H*]

My boss at the first company I worked at was a victim of a cyclist riding on the wrong side of the road. He was training with his riding buddies cycling from our offices in Town after work from Green Point to Hout Bay. It was rather windy and a group coming from Hout bay decided that they'd rather cycle on the right hand side. My Boss just finished his pull and turned the corner just after 5 Apostles at the back. The group from the front suddenly appeared and the rest of my bosses group avoided contact. He was a second too late and clipped a wheel, got knocked by a car and almost lost his life. He was away from work for 6 months and had to fight for his life. To this day he has no peripheral vision and suffers from head aches and a bad back. For 6 months our business had to do without his very critical input and guidance and his family had to get by without him as well. To this day when I see a cyclist on the wrong side of the road I remember this selfish act by an inconsiderate bunch of knobs. They broke the law because the wind was less of a hassle closer to the mountain and almost killed an innocent man, that would probably have lead to 25 people losing their jobs and a family losing a father and a husband. When I see cyclists coming from the front I make myself and my bike as wide as possible to get these knobs to stop so that I can tell them to **** off to the other side of the road. I have zero tolerance for this as it not only pisses fellow cyclists off, but other road users as well. I have enough trouble trying to keep to the rules of the road and to stay alive while cycling on the road, I don't need these idiots making my life even more difficult.

 

I would say that this is the definitive post to end this absolutely silly debate. In the future any debate with this silly topic should be locked immediately.

Edited November 17, 2013 by Big H*

[Skubarra]

Its'a rabbit-hole, Skubarra.

Get out, man.

 

Haha! You are right 'Dale. Should have know better

 

I'll go look for more interesting threads

[Master-Yoda]

@Skubarra; Ignoring your reply #184 will in fact be my reply. And you still wonder why I previously mentioned as being tired of multi quoting to prove a point, it's pretty pointless as nothing's going to get through that thick black helmet of yours..

 

@Skylark; Claude/ClintZA?? Whatever sparks you having going on in your head best be put to rest. If you’re implying that I'm the same guy that has now simply created a new account then bugger off with that idea, I'm not a young little boy or teenager with pimples on his face that needs to resort to childish games.

 

@Big H*; As garyvdm explained, you are clearly missing the point. You're making the same mistake as others that read and read and read but fail to understand what it is that they're reading or relying to. I am not riding against traffic, this thread/topic/poll refers to a QUESTION and does NOT refer to how I ride my damn bike, do you finally understand what it is that you're commenting on?

 

@GLuvsMtb; I'll be the first to say that I feel sorry for what happened to your boss and that it was most unfortunate, this is a serious matter and especially when someone's life is/was at risk. It should serve as a lesson which others should use as an example so that it does not repeat itself. BUT, you are being misled by 99% of the nonsense that has been discussed in this thread and completely missing my point. What happened to your boss was the cause and effect of cyclists riding against the traffic flow (we all know is illegal) which ended up colliding against another group which was riding with the traffic flow (which is legal). It's obvious who was in the wrong and we are most certainly not debating this. My question does not refer to some riders riding with while others ride against (the flow), it's only logical that there will be a meeting point where someone is going to get hurt. The question that I ask is if I as a rider will have a better chance of avoiding being hit by a vehicle (seeing that 99% of the time I won't be looking back) that is coming from behind or, riding against the traffic flow and see all vehicles coming towards my direction. Now the important point that you're forgetting is that this would obviously have to be in a scenario where it was law to ride against the traffic for ALL cyclist. We could obviously not have some riding on one side while others ride on the other and this would obviously not apply to the way the current traffic law stipulates how cyclists should ride (with the flow). So again, I'm truly sorry for what happened to your boss and hope that you finally understand my point.

[Big H*]

@Skubarra; Ignoring your reply #184 will in fact be my reply. And you still wonder why I previously mentioned as being tired of multi quoting to prove a point, it's pretty pointless as nothing's going to get through that thick black helmet of yours..

 

@Skylark; Claude/ClintZA?? Whatever sparks you having going on in your head best be put to rest. If you’re implying that I'm the same guy that has now simply created a new account then bugger off with that idea, I'm not a young little boy or teenager with pimples on his face that needs to resort to childish games.

 

@Big H*; As garyvdm explained, you are clearly missing the point. You're making the same mistake as others that read and read and read but fail to understand what it is that they're reading or relying to. I am not riding against traffic, this thread/topic/poll refers to a QUESTION and does NOT refer to how I ride my damn bike, do you finally understand what it is that you're commenting on?

 

@GLuvsMtb; I'll be the first to say that I feel sorry for what happened to your boss and that it was most unfortunate, this is a serious matter and especially when someone's life is/was at risk. It should serve as a lesson which others should use as an example so that it does not repeat itself. BUT, you are being misled by 99% of the nonsense that has been discussed in this thread and completely missing my point. What happened to your boss was the cause and effect of cyclists riding against the traffic flow (we all know is illegal) which ended up colliding against another group which was riding with the traffic flow (which is legal). It's obvious who was in the wrong and we are most certainly not debating this. My question does not refer to some riders riding with while others ride against (the flow), it's only logical that there will be a meeting point where someone is going to get hurt. The question that I ask is if I as a rider will have a better chance of avoiding being hit by a vehicle (seeing that 99% of the time I won't be looking back) that is coming from behind or, riding against the traffic flow and see all vehicles coming towards my direction. Now the important point that you're forgetting is that this would obviously have to be in a scenario where it was law to ride against the traffic for ALL cyclist. We could obviously not have some riding on one side while others ride on the other and this would obviously not apply to the way the current traffic law stipulates how cyclists should ride (with the flow). So again, I'm truly sorry for what happened to your boss and hope that you finally understand my point.

 

Hail Hail all ye...... the most misunderstood man on the Hub lives here..... Hail Hail!!!!!!!

[Witkop]

The question that I ask is if I as a rider will have a better chance of avoiding being hit by a vehicle (seeing that 99% of the time I won't be looking back) that is coming from behind or, riding against the traffic flow and see all vehicles coming towards my direction.

 

I dealt with this some time back. Due to the speed of the vehicle (especially if it wanted to hit you, or because it was not under sober control) you would not be able to react in time even if you saw it coming for you. In fact as you would be moving towards the vehicle at a decent speed and be in the "wrong" place your chances would be further reduced as the motorist would have less time to identify you and because you were "out of place" he would be put under pressure to process your location, thereby hitting you. (This is assuming that you would be cycling above 20km/hr). (And yes you will be splatted by the car and not bumped off the road))

 

So now your question is answered, can you stop being such a troll?

Edited November 18, 2013 by Witkop

[Lucky Luke.]

right side - 2d or not 2d? That is the question.

[GLuvsMtb]

Simple question OP. What do you do at a traffic circle, intersection with or without traffic signals while riding on the wrong side of the road. If you get off and cross like a pedestrian (ie push you bike over) you have a small case. If not, you are a danger to all road users. If all our roads had dedicated shoulders for cycling it MIGHT work, but the bulk of our roads don't cater for cyclists and the shoulder is not a dedicated cycling lane. If I am to cycle on the wrong side of the road, the car that is in the shoulder with another car passing would have less than half the time to react appropriately, never mind my 2000lumens bike light on strobe mode blinding him and the car he is busy passing at 5am on a winter morning. With cars and bicycles co existing in more civilized places in the world on the same side of the road, this question is not even a consideration.

Think about your proposal next time you take part in an organized event (ie a race or charity ride) and tell me whether this still sounds like a good idea.

[Skubarra]

OK I know this horse has been flogged to death, but I think this article in today's news about the 5 joggers who were killed by a drunk driver a while back is relevant.

 

http://www.iol.co.za/news/crime-courts/surviving-jogger-recounts-accident-1.1609030#.UosuD9ISbTo

By that time it was already light and they ran, in single file, towards Lever Road. According to her they ran on the right hand side of the road, so as to face oncoming traffic. They were about 3.5km from where they had started, when the accident occurred at about 5.30am.

“I am not sure what happened. I woke up on the right hand side of the road on the gravel… I could not see the others and I assumed they had continued jogging.

Just confirms what previous posters have been saying about not having enough time to react even when facing oncoming traffic.

[Master-Yoda]

OK I know this horse has been flogged to death, but I think this article in today's news about the 5 joggers who were killed by a drunk driver a while back is relevant.

 

http://www.iol.co.za...30#.UosuD9ISbTo

 

By that time it was already light and they ran, in single file, towards Lever Road. According to her they ran on the right hand side of the road, so as to face oncoming traffic. They were about 3.5km from where they had started, when the accident occurred at about 5.30am.

“I am not sure what happened. I woke up on the right hand side of the road on the gravel… I could not see the others and I assumed they had continued jogging.

Just confirms what previous posters have been saying about not having enough time to react even when facing oncoming traffic.

 

I have 2 questions for you;

1: Was the accident caused by them running against traffic or by a drunk driver?

2: Do you think that the end result would be any different if they were running with the traffic flow and the same drunk driver came from behind?

 

I get what you're trying to prove but this is not a valid comparison.

[dirtrider]

OK I know this horse has been flogged to death, but I think this article in today's news about the 5 joggers who were killed by a drunk driver a while back is relevant.

 

http://www.iol.co.za...30#.UosuD9ISbTo

 

By that time it was already light and they ran, in single file, towards Lever Road. According to her they ran on the right hand side of the road, so as to face oncoming traffic. They were about 3.5km from where they had started, when the accident occurred at about 5.30am.

“I am not sure what happened. I woke up on the right hand side of the road on the gravel… I could not see the others and I assumed they had continued jogging.

Just confirms what previous posters have been saying about not having enough time to react even when facing oncoming traffic.

 

And yet I still ride against the traffic every morning !! Oook maar lekker stoopid ?

[Lexx]

This Will never end.. Just close this Topic. I can see that you always wants to get the last word in, and will never agree with anyone....

Admin. Close Please.

[Skubarra]

I have 2 questions for you;

1: Was the accident caused by them running against traffic or by a drunk driver?

2: Do you think that the end result would be any different if they were running with the traffic flow and the same drunk driver came from behind?

 

I get what you're trying to prove but this is not a valid comparison.

 

Dude, I'm happy to agree to disagree on this topic - was just an observation from the days news, use it, don't use it...

Edited November 19, 2013 by Skubarra

[Master-Yoda]

This Will never end.. Just close this Topic. I can see that you always wants to get the last word in, and will never agree with anyone....

Admin. Close Please.

It works both ways, you're just as stubborn now aren't you? At least I'm still asking unanswered questions and seeing this from a different perspective unlike a race horse which only sees what's been put in-front of him. When someone says something that you agree with then it's all good but when someone questions it then it's a problem. I tell you what, if you don't want to comment on it then fine but why would you follow a topic that you're not interested in?

[Master-Yoda]

Dude, I'm happy to agree to disagree on this topic - was just an observation from the days news, use it, don't use it...

Ok cool, then how about agreeing to reply to both questions?

[GLuvsMtb]

Simple question OP. What do you do at a traffic circle, intersection with or without traffic signals while riding on the wrong side of the road. If you get off and cross like a pedestrian (ie push you bike over) you have a small case. If not, you are a danger to all road users. If all our roads had dedicated shoulders for cycling it MIGHT work, but the bulk of our roads don't cater for cyclists and the shoulder is not a dedicated cycling lane. If I am to cycle on the wrong side of the road, the car that is in the shoulder with another car passing would have less than half the time to react appropriately, never mind my 2000lumens bike light on strobe mode blinding him and the car he is busy passing at 5am on a winter morning. With cars and bicycles co existing in more civilized places in the world on the same side of the road, this question is not even a consideration.

Think about your proposal next time you take part in an organized event (ie a race or charity ride) and tell me whether this still sounds like a good idea.

OP?! Share your wisdom please. Just let me get my gopro the first time you hit a traffic circle traveling against the flow of traffic.

Edited November 19, 2013 by GLuvsMtb

[Master-Yoda]

Dude, what's wrong with you? I really don't feel like repeating myself again and again to now also tell you where I do and don't ride but if you must be reminded or if you simply didn't bother to read all posts, then here goes.., a) I asked a question which is not a proposal as you have stated in your comment, b) no one is riding on the right, it's called a poll for a reason and a thread for discussing what ever needs to be discussed, or not.., c) we don't do road biking, d) when we do need to go onto a road, we're talking about roads that are next to farms and not main roads, busy roads and sure as hell not highways and finally.. e) ask me questions that apply to how/where we ride on the road when we have to be on the road and not how you ride on the road (e.i. amount of time, busy/quiet roads/ busy intersections etc..) or how you assume that it would somehow apply to our riding.

 

I suppose that the next thing you're going to say is that those joggers that were killed was because they were running against the traffic flow? What if instead of joggers it had been cyclists, would it have made a difference if they turned around and started running in the other direction and the same driver hit them from behind, would it? And now that I think of it, maybe you're all right, riding against the flow WILL get you killed but then you're all pretty f***d as well if you're on the left because all hope is lost once you throw certain variables into the equation, like a drunk driver coming from behind...

 

Do yourself a favour and search the net and see how many videos you find of cyclists being ridden over by cars from behind and then for cyclists that got hit by cars from the front. Come back when you have those figures and then we can continue our discussion.

 

There, wisdom has been shared now go fetch your GoPro and get those suicide cyclists on camera getting hit left right and centre at those busy intersections..