Do you know what you are covered for / Cyclesure?

[GrantRH]

I am very curious as to whether a Thule bike rack will be viewed as a suitable lock? Surely this is the de-facto standard of bike carrier?

 

That is exactly what I asked my broker to find out. I'll let you know when I get the response.

[Steven Knoetze (sk27)]

2 comments from my side:

 

1. Let's give Hollard time to respond. It speaks to how seriously they are taking this matter that they are involving teams of people to put the best response forward. If they didn't care they would simply have given us a rubbish response. I think Nick has done well to respond thusfar. Many others would simply have ignored the mails and referred you to the Ombudsman.

 

2. I signed up with Cyclesure last week. After reading these threads I raised some concerns about "approved locks" and "forced entry", especially when there are service providers (plumbers, builders etc) on my property from time to time and things sometimes go missing. I am not prepared to pay the premiums if I don't get that basic cover.

 

Look forward to the response...

 

Grant, they have had plenty of time to respond, if they cannot answer simple questions about their own policies wording then it is beyond me!!

[Rata Del Spruit]

I am very curious as to whether a Thule bike rack will be viewed as a suitable lock? Surely this is the de-facto standard of bike carrier?

 

From Hollard's responses so far, it would be.

[Captain Fastbastard Mayhem]

I am very curious as to whether a Thule bike rack will be viewed as a suitable lock? Surely this is the de-facto standard of bike carrier?

 

It is. Was already confirmed earlier in the thread

 

Basically - has to be a recognised bike rack of SABS approved manufacture, with either an integrated locking mechanism, or with a lock & chain of suitable size (12mm diameter cable lock is sufficient and not oversized)

[VicanZA]

A couple of thinks I have learnt

• if you maid/Gardner cleans you out, insurance will not pay.
  
• if the perpetrators have gained access to your house knowingly(if you let them in) insurance will only pay to 10k per item, this includes garden service, repair guys, clean bin guys, estate agent and any other they bring to see you home(steve the shopper).
  

[GrantRH]

Nick, please could you advise on the "forcible entry" exclusion.

 

If I am not covered by people who are legitimately on my property but then steal my bike, I will need to find cover that does cater for this. (I have cameras so I guess I could show a video of the person walking off with my bike)

 

Please also let us know whether the locks that come standard with Thule bike carriers are considered "approved". Most Hubbers use these.

 

Much appreciated.

[rouxtjie]

Thanks for the response Nick.

 

Good news on point1 then....it would seem like cyclesure will pay out in the scene I sketched.

Point 2....Ta, thanks again

Point 3....I urge you to relook this, for everyone incl your own sake...happy clients are paying clients remember. Would it be that hard to explain these changes to schedules / T&C's to clients. A simple phone call explaining in english would go very far. An "opened email" receipt means exactly that...he opened the mail, doesn't mean the client read through changes nevermind understand them.

Point 4...Good stuff, if you want to be a cycling specific insurance company, resolving claims quicker than normal would be a value add, and really differentiate you from the rest...someone posted this before, it only takes a couple of weeks to lose fitness that a cyclist is constantly trying to maintain.

[Mats]

Hi Guys,

 

Just an update.

I have received communication from Cyclesure regarding an ex-gratia payment.

 

I would like to thank Hollard for coming to the hub to assist us. I hope we will see a lot more of you in the future and that you will develop a product that will best suit our specific needs.

 

Thanks to everyone who got involved and offered their support.

It is highly appreciated.

[TALUS]

Hello Hubbers.

 

The most important part of our update is that we have been in written communication with our customer and are waiting for her response. We are still hopeful that the outcome will be positive for everybody.

 

In terms of my previous post, and with the assistance and input of Cyclesure, here are our answers to the issues raised:

1. Bikejacking is in itself a violent act, so if your bike is stolen at gunpoint, at knifepoint or with any threat of violence, you would be covered. No bodily injury is required to prove that a bikejacking incident has occurred (although you would be expected to report the event to the police). Neither Hollard nor Cyclesure has ever rejected any bikejacking claim.
    
    
   
2. The most recent policy wording is available for you to download here: https://dl.dropboxus...in language.pdf
    
    
   
3. In terms of updating policy documents, Cyclesure does so via email. This is trackable in that we know that the email has been received and opened. We currently do not insist on proof that the policyholder has actually read their document. The email that is sent draws the attention of the customer to any important clauses.
    
    
   
4. The obtaining and completion of required documentation is often what determines how long a claim takes to settle. In case of a theft, we need a completed claim form and a police report to be completed. We then appoint an assessor (typically on the same day as receiving the documents), who is tasked with investigating the circumstances of the claim. If a bike is then recovered and damaged, we also need a quotation to repair the damage from any cycling dealer. Although Cyclesure settles 95% of the claims it receives within 24 hours, we are always looking for ways to improve.
   

We'll continue to monitor this thread in the interest of creating a better policy for cyclists.

 

This for 5h of work? In a team? Oooh-eh-eh

[Gen]

Hi Guys,

 

Just an update.

I have received communication from Cyclesure regarding an ex-gratia payment.

 

I would like to thank Hollard for coming to the hub to assist us. I hope we will see a lot more of you in the future and that you will develop a product that will best suit our specific needs.

 

Thanks to everyone who got involved and offered their support.

It is highly appreciated.

 

I am happy for you.

 

What I am not happy about is the fact that it had to become one hell of a struggle to get results.

 

We always seem to be fighting to get things done.. not just with insurance but with general service.

 

 

[Hollard]

Nick, please could you advise on the "forcible entry" exclusion.

 

If I am not covered by people who are legitimately on my property but then steal my bike, I will need to find cover that does cater for this. (I have cameras so I guess I could show a video of the person walking off with my bike)

 

Please also let us know whether the locks that come standard with Thule bike carriers are considered "approved". Most Hubbers use these.

 

Much appreciated.

 

Each and every claim is dealt with on its own merits, and it is very difficult to deal with an infinite number of hypothetical situations. There are circumstances in which you would be covered, and there are circumstances in which you would not be covered, given the situation you describe. The best course of action is to ask your broker or Cyclesure themselves (info@cyclesure.co.za).

 

The locks that come standard with Thule carriers are approved by Cyclesure.

[rouxtjie]

Hi Guys,

 

Just an update.

I have received communication from Cyclesure regarding an ex-gratia payment.

 

I would like to thank Hollard for coming to the hub to assist us. I hope we will see a lot more of you in the future and that you will develop a product that will best suit our specific needs.

 

Thanks to everyone who got involved and offered their support.

It is highly appreciated.

Awesomeness carpet...

[Rata Del Spruit]

Hello Hubbers.

 

The most important part of our update is that we have been in written communication with our customer and are waiting for her response. We are still hopeful that the outcome will be positive for everybody.

 

In terms of my previous post, and with the assistance and input of Cyclesure, here are our answers to the issues raised:

1. 
   
2. In terms of updating policy documents, Cyclesure does so via email. This is trackable in that we know that the email has been received and opened. We currently do not insist on proof that the policyholder has actually read their document. The email that is sent draws the attention of the customer to any important clauses.
   

 

 

Thanks for your responses so far, I think a few Hubbers don't know what to do with the pitchforks they all bought on sale. This is one thing that bugs me with insurers though. Surely there should be an active acceptance of the policy changes from the client? I also think effort should be made to explain the implications of any changes in plain english, i.e. "the difference between your old policy and your new policy is that we require evidence of forced entry. This excludes coercion, such as someone holding you at gunpoint to gain entry but it does mean you can't leave your front gate open and your property unattended"

[Vangar]

Each and every claim is dealt with on its own merits, and it is very difficult to deal with an infinite number of hypothetical situations. There are circumstances in which you would be covered, and there are circumstances in which you would not be covered, given the situation you describe. The best course of action is to ask your broker or Cyclesure themselves (info@cyclesure.co.za).The locks that come standard with Thule carriers are approved by Cyclesure.

Dealbrakers:

1.) Lock lock lock and secure and forced entry. Way too vague and too much space for loopholes. I'm not going to babysit my bike every second of the day it's not locked in a garage. That's what insurance should be for assuming reasonable access control to the property.

2.) It simultaneously states that the Thule locks are fine, and that a cable and padlock still has to be used? Once again vague. Also, the locks on my Menabo Winny carrier are propably not SABS approved, so now I should spend R4000 more minimum to get a Thule?

3.) Theft during an event is not covered unless there is a secure area? What? So I can't leave my bike locked to my car then for fear of the parking lot not being designated a secure area.

 

There are terms and conditions and there are loopholes, these feel like loopholes. Does not sit well enough for me to insure with cyclesure. I'll also be taking a look at my other Hollard policies in much finer detail.

[GrantRH]

Thanks for getting back to me Nick.

 

Point 1: I think this is a pretty general question that everyone is waiting for an answer on. If there is no forcible entry onto your property but the bike is stolen nonetheless, it looks like I am not covered. The same principle applies whether it is a service provider (plumber, electrician etc) or a disgruntled domestic worker who didn't get enough of an xmas bonus. Or for that matter as with the other Hubbers asking about their bike being stolen from their back yard when the are busy cleaning it and attend to something else for a couple of minutes. This is crying for an answer.The latest post from Carpet only deepens my concerns. Ex gratia payment means that it was done out of kindness, but specifically not admitting liability. So what this tells me is that Carpet is fine (which is fantastic news) but anyone else with identical facts probably won't be. If this is the case I would prefer to pay a little more for that piece of mind.

 

2. Good news on the Thule locks.

[Tjokkits]

Each and every claim is dealt with on its own merits, and it is very difficult to deal with an infinite number of hypothetical situations. There are circumstances in which you would be covered, and there are circumstances in which you would not be covered, given the situation you describe. The best course of action is to ask your broker or Cyclesure themselves (info@cyclesure.co.za).

 

The locks that come standard with Thule carriers are approved by Cyclesure.

 

Hi H-Nick, firstly thanks for the trouble of coming onto the site. the above response is however not good enough.. Firstly why should we ask Cyclesure who up until now refused to offer any response or explanation?

 

the examples we are giving are not hypothetical, they are common situations we cyclist find ourselves in due to our activity, and we want clarity whether we are covered or not, even at a price.

 

so we are saying to you that we ride alone and get hijacked and wont offer resistance so have no proof of violence. we are also saying we wash our bikes on our properties at which point its not practical to lock it up, and we are saying we transport our bikes on bike racks with its standard locking systems. are we covered yes or no, and if no, can you look at a product that does take into account cyclist issues.

 

kind regards