Car maintenance

[Skylark]

Take these issues as a sign that this particular service is for the garage to do and not for you, I've been there done that!

 

They'll have a hoist/welders/Porta pack/extension bars with pipe etc and can break themselves on the alter of car maintenance on your behalf. But they'll know what to do, you are not the first guy to strip a sump nut and if the plugs are that tight perhaps better if they loosen them, they might heat the head around the plug to loosen them safely etc.

 

Tazz service isn't expensive at an independent, wouldn't take it to the agents though. Put the bits back together, have a beer and leave it for Monday for the garage.

Edited January 21, 2017 by Skylark

[GrumpyOldGuy]

Just did some googling. Metal expands when heated but becuase bolt is constrained inside the oil sump, it should expand upwards. Then when it cools, the contraction is not constrained and happens all over. So theoretically, the bolt should became slightly smaller and hence easier to get out

This is correct, I am however a little concerned about using a flame under a car - think Ford Kuga. 

 

I know people do it and it may be fine on a wheel stud or something..........but I dont suggest it on an oil pan plug.

 

Your best option is to work carefully and take your time, use the right tools and as little force as possible, you dont want to strip the thread, or worse, break the bolt off.    

[GrumpyOldGuy]

Take these issues as a sign that this particular service is for the garage to do and not for you, I've been there done that!

 

They'll have a hoist/welders/Porta pack/extension bars with pipe etc and can break themselves on the alter of car maintenance on your behalf. But they'll know what to do, you are not the first guy to strip a sump nut and if the plugs are that tight perhaps better if they loosen them, they might heat the head around the plug to loosen them safely etc.

 

Tazz service isn't expensive at an independent, wouldn't take it to the agents though. Put the bits back together, have a beer and leave it for Monday for the garage.

Ha, Ha, ......thats no fun though.

[Kalahari Vegmot]

Ha, Ha, ......thats no fun though.

You don't learn an awful lot like that either...

[AlanD]

I am assuming you mean Arc Weld.? Thats a common engineering "fix" but I would not suggest it, especially on a passenger car, modern cars use various metals and drain plugs are also usually magnetic, so unless you know the metallic structure you are working with you could (probably will) do a lot more harm than good. Arc welding will also risk damaging the many electronic components, so whatever you do, make sure you disconnect the battery completely first.

 

Onto the issue, slotting the head will probably be a waste of time, you will get even less leverage with a screwdriver than a spanner, in general you need to "jar" it loose, this is why an impact driver loosens nuts and bolts easily, its a constant "knocking" as opposed to applying a constant direct force that loosens it. Similar to what Mojoman said.

I however am a little more conservative (sorry Mojo ) so I would try some Q20 or even better WD40 if you can get it, spray it on liberally and leave for a few hours, then apply a Vice grip to the plug head and Tap the vice grip in both directions, left - loosen and right - tighten, keep applying WD40, its a painstaking process but keep at it and this should work the bolt loose.

Remember its "Tap" not "Hammer" I cant repeat it enough, avoid brute force.

 

Dont, I repeat DONT, force the Spark Plugs, clean the spark plug hole well, vacuum or blow it out but it must be clean, apply some WD40 or similar, if you apply a lubricant and the spark well is gritty the lubricant could seep the grit into the spark plug threads when you remove it, not a good thing, - Now, use a proper Spark plug socket (if you dont have one go get it) and a T bar, not those small dedicated spark plug spanners, they are for lawnmowers not cars, Its a bet the mechanic would have put the plugs in with a socket and bar and this why you are struggling, you cannot get sufficient leverage with those basic spanners, now remembering "lefty loosey" and "righty tighty" apply gentle pressure - my bet is it will loosen right out, if not you can apply GENTLE pressure in both directions again until it loosens up.

 

Clean the well properly, dont leave lubricant in the well, if you have some, apply a small dab of Copperslip (just barely coat the threads) to the spark plug threads, this will make them easier to remove next time and re insert.

 

Dont force things, if you strip a cylinder head spark socket its a mission, work gently and slowly and take your time, think about things, you should never need to apply brute force.

 

I wish you luck.

Thanks. I have a that spark plug tool with the red handle, t shaped with the socket at the end. Thats the right tool.

[AlanD]

Take these issues as a sign that this particular service is for the garage to do and not for you, I've been there done that!

 

They'll have a hoist/welders/Porta pack/extension bars with pipe etc and can break themselves on the alter of car maintenance on your behalf. But they'll know what to do, you are not the first guy to strip a sump nut and if the plugs are that tight perhaps better if they loosen them, they might heat the head around the plug to loosen them safely etc.

 

Tazz service isn't expensive at an independent, wouldn't take it to the agents though. Put the bits back together, have a beer and leave it for Monday for the garage.

Ive always serviced my tazz, its simple and quick and cheaper than taking it in. I have done it for years with mo problems at all. It was the mechanics that worked on my car when my head was replaced that tight tightened everything to hulk strength

[Mojoman]

Ive always serviced my tazz, its simple and quick and cheaper than taking it in. I have done it for years with mo problems at all. It was the mechanics that worked on my car when my head was replaced that tight tightened everything to hulk strength

My dad used to say hand tight then a quarter turn.

 

 

[GrumpyOldGuy]

Thanks. I have a that spark plug tool with the red handle, t shaped with the socket at the end. Thats the right tool.

Alan, dont take it wrongly but if you mean this tool -

 

 

its not for ideal cars, you really just cannot get sufficient leverage on it.

 

The Mechanic who installed the plugs would have used this - 

 

 

and this - 

 

 

that red handled spanner will not allow you sufficient leverage, a proper breaker bar and a socket will allow you to remove the spark plugs easily, the two may knock you back 3/400 bucks (I dont know SA prices anymore) but they will last you a lifetime, believe me, pick up a set at Makro or builders or somewhere and those plugs will be out in a jiffy.

[GrumpyOldGuy]

My dad used to say hand tight then a quarter turn.

 

 

Yah, usually a good rule of thumb.... modern compression washers dont need extreme tension.   

[GrumpyOldGuy]

You don't learn an awful lot like that either...

Indeed, doing it yourself is the the way to learn, theres tons of literature out there so sometimes all it takes is time and if you want to try you can do pretty much everything yourself, plus theres nothing better than that feeling when you overcome all the odds, and get it done successfully yourself.   

[AlanD]

Alan, dont take it wrongly but if you mean this tool -

 

spark plug spanner.jpg

 

its not for ideal cars, you really just cannot get sufficient leverage on it.

 

The Mechanic who installed the plugs would have used this -

 

spark plug socket 2.jpg

 

and this -

 

Breaker bar.jpg

 

that red handled spanner will not allow you sufficient leverage, a proper breaker bar and a socket will allow you to remove the spark plugs easily, the two may knock you back 3/400 bucks (I dont know SA prices anymore) but they will last you a lifetime, believe me, pick up a set at Makro or builders or somewhere and those plugs will be out in a jiffy.

Yup, thats the tool i have and yup, it sure is not enough leverage this time.

 

Might have to get the one you mentioned. Any tool is an invesment so its always worth it. Thanks for the advice.

 

I managed to get some WD40 so will be trying to get the nut off tomorrow with that and the vice grips and tap, tap, tap...do it tap clockwise then anti...and so on?

[dev null]

I bought myself a Gedore socket set 27 years ago for R300. I still have the complete set. In it's blue metal box.

 

Yes, good tools is one of the best investment a man can make.

[Wannabe]

Yah, usually a good rule of thumb.... modern compression washers dont need extreme tension.   

 

Mistake most DIYérs make, over-tightening the spark plugs. I normally put a bit of copperslip on the threads, just turn it in by hand till tight, and then just snug it up with T bar. Not necessary to turn till you are blue in the face.

[GrumpyOldGuy]

Yup, thats the tool i have and yup, it sure is not enough leverage this time.

 

Might have to get the one you mentioned. Any tool is an invesment so its always worth it. Thanks for the advice.

 

I managed to get some WD40 so will be trying to get the nut off tomorrow with that and the vice grips and tap, tap, tap...do it tap clockwise then anti...and so on?

Yes, a nice set of good tools is a solid investment, sometimes its cheaper in a set as Moridin says, but if you dont need them now, buy them as you need them.

 

Put a light smear of Copperslip or any Copper compound on the new spark plug threads, this will make them much easier to remove next time. its excellent stuff and you can use it on almost any bolt and nut on the car or around the house and it will make it a much easier job to remove, it last forever as you only need a light thin smear.

 

Good news that, WD40 is a really good penetrating fluid and lubricant and it will help to ease the lock of the bolt in the threads. 

 

Indeed, tap left, tap right and work the thread loose like that just make sure the vise grips are really solidly gripping the bolt head and not slipping.

 

I agree, its clearly been over tightened and my guess is they used a socket and breaker bar on the sump plug as well. 

 

Good luck, I really hope you get it out.

[GrumpyOldGuy]

I bought myself a Gedore socket set 27 years ago for R300. I still have the complete set. In it's blue metal box.

 

Yes, good tools is one of the best investment a man can make.

Yah, Great tools Gedore, although I must say Makro and Builders used to have an exclusive range of hand tools they sold, I cant remember their name right now but they were also perfectly fine for the average DIY enthusiast, you would be hard pressed to break one.. here they are sold almost exclusively through Sears and called "Craftsman" same manufacturer.   

[dev null]

Yah, Great tools Gedore, although I must say Makro and Builders used to have an exclusive range of hand tools they sold, I cant remember their name right now but they were also perfectly fine for the average DIY enthusiast, you would be hard pressed to break one.. here they are sold almost exclusively through Sears and called "Craftsman" same manufacturer.   

 

AmPro. Those are also fine. I have an AmPro set also, with a full set of their spark plug sockets.