Crank based, single or dual sided vs hub power

[Jehosefat]

Not sure how you work that out but you'd be in the minority of users in having such a large discrepancy in L/R balance. Most people fall within the accuracy of the PM. 

I've got a P2M and a Stages and the numbers they generate correlate very well.

 

Well my L/R balance is usually around 52/48 so if you just doubled the left side you would end up with 104% of actual power. Hence my 4% comment.

[DieselnDust]

Well my L/R balance is usually around 52/48 so if you just doubled the left side you would end up with 104% of actual power. Hence my 4% comment.

 

 

fortunately it doesn't work like that. Your L/R balance will need to be determined for each power zone and endurance in that zone. It drifts for nearly everyone except for very elite athletes but even they fatigue. So if you normalise the L/Rbalance over a long ride you'll probably find yourself evening out because 52/48 is not unusual at all according to the articles written on the matter.

Having a LR Pm is always going to be better to eliminate the slight discrepancy but it's not a massive problem unless you're at the elite end of the field

[Jehosefat]

fortunately it doesn't work like that. Your L/R balance will need to be determined for each power zone and endurance in that zone. It drifts for nearly everyone except for very elite athletes but even they fatigue. So if you normalise the L/Rbalance over a long ride you'll probably find yourself evening out because 52/48 is not unusual at all according to the articles written on the matter.

Having a LR Pm is always going to be better to eliminate the slight discrepancy but it's not a massive problem unless you're at the elite end of the field

 

When I said it was 52/48 I meant that is what is is on average over a long ride. Much closer to 50/50 on the climbs (especially very steep, low cadence climbs) and obviously worse than 52/48 on the flats and downhills. But that's neither here nor there.

 

I'm not saying that it's a big problem, I was just pointing out that using a single sided power meter would result in an estimation error due to leg power imbalances.

[s14phoenix]

Just to clarify I meant the Vector 3 not the 3s - would be pretty pointless getting the 3s over the 4iiii.

 

I want a dual sided and I like the data you get to play with on the Vector 3 pedals.

 

Would like to play with the dual 4iiii and stages dual to see.

 

Seems there is only very select power meters that give you all the data the Garmin duals do to record and review and some can display your data on their app only and then its is only display and not synced to your ride recording for review.

 

I think the market still has lots to upgrade - so we keep buying their latest products...

[DieselnDust]

Just to clarify I meant the Vector 3 not the 3s - would be pretty pointless getting the 3s over the 4iiii.

 

I want a dual sided and I like the data you get to play with on the Vector 3 pedals.

 

Would like to play with the dual 4iiii and stages dual to see.

 

Seems there is only very select power meters that give you all the data the Garmin duals do to record and review and some can display your data on their app only and then its is only display and not synced to your ride recording for review.

 

I think the market still has lots to upgrade - so we keep buying their latest products...

 

 

Yip so Unless you have bottomless pots of money to keep uprgrading just get a good tool and be done with it.

My P2M and Quarq give me total power. I can upgrade the NGeco to give me torque and LR balance and an additional metric but I have such a long way to go before I even consider those metrics as important.

My traiing plan seems to have lot of built in low cadence drills so i may shell out for the torque metric.

But my P_ave and normalised is on the up so I'm happy I'm getting stronger and fitter.

If I replace my groupset maybe I'll update the Stages to a LR unit but I don't want to have a Shimano PM on a SRAM drivetrain bike. Its just wrong

[davidtinker]

 can upgrade the NGeco to give me torque and LR balance and an additional metric

 

You have to upgrade to get torque which they know already? Thats a bit sneaky! I assume they don't give you cadence either or you could easily calculate torque.

 

I have been using a PowerTap hub for years. I was planning to replace with single sided crank based option when it eventually breaks but following this thread it seems I would probably want dual sided which tilts things back in favour of the very cheap hub.

 

Only real disadvantage for me of the hub is that I don't have power in races with my race wheels on.

[s14phoenix]

Yip so Unless you have bottomless pots of money to keep uprgrading just get a good tool and be done with it.

My P2M and Quarq give me total power. I can upgrade the NGeco to give me torque and LR balance and an additional metric but I have such a long way to go before I even consider those metrics as important.

My traiing plan seems to have lot of built in low cadence drills so i may shell out for the torque metric.

But my P_ave and normalised is on the up so I'm happy I'm getting stronger and fitter.

If I replace my groupset maybe I'll update the Stages to a LR unit but I don't want to have a Shimano PM on a SRAM drivetrain bike. Its just wrong

 

same reason I don't want a SRAM PM on a Shimano Drivetrain Bike. Then I have the further OCD issue of it needing to be Dura Ace to match and not Ultegra or others - I spent so long getting my bike onto Dura Ace - I am not going down now

 

The pedal dynamics and power phase is what I like about the Garmin - pity about the product quality...

 

Might just get a 4iiii dual sided for power balance data and be done with it... at least that comes in a Dura Ace 9100 crankset.

[DieselnDust]

You have to upgrade to get torque which they know already? Thats a bit sneaky! I assume they don't give you cadence either or you could easily calculate torque.

 

I have been using a PowerTap hub for years. I was planning to replace with single sided crank based option when it eventually breaks but following this thread it seems I would probably want dual sided which tilts things back in favour of the very cheap hub.

 

Only real disadvantage for me of the hub is that I don't have power in races with my race wheels on.

 

 

 

Yes I can calculate it in a spreadsheet if I want to. It just won't display on the headunit since it won't transmit that data to the headunit. Yes a bit sneaky but I don't think its that iportant.

It does deliver power and cadence.

 

PS: on an MTB the power and cadence are the most important merics I consider.

For road the Quarq gives torque as well so that's fine for me

[davidtinker]

Yes I can calculate it in a spreadsheet if I want to. It just won't display on the headunit since it won't transmit that data to the headunit. Yes a bit sneaky but I don't think its that iportant.

It does deliver power and cadence.

 

Aha. You can still do torque work easily since you normally aim at a specific power and cadence, don't need torque on the head unit for that. And if your data is on Strava you can use Intervals.icu to show you the torque (shameless plug!).

[DieselnDust]

Aha. You can still do torque work easily since you normally aim at a specific power and cadence, don't need torque on the head unit for that. And if your data is on Strava you can use Intervals.icu to show you the torque (shameless plug!).

 

 

Yip thats true and typically how I use the tools now. But you know how it is...

There's that app, next to it the credit card.....

[Frosty]

A nifty little tip I picked up today when updating the firmware on my 4iiii PM. It doesn’t help if one doesn’t test the L/R balance, so I guess it’s back to gym on a more regular basis to test my L/R balance.

 

[Ozzie NL]

You have to upgrade to get torque which they know already? Thats a bit sneaky! I assume they don't give you cadence either or you could easily calculate torque.

 

I have been using a PowerTap hub for years. I was planning to replace with single sided crank based option when it eventually breaks but following this thread it seems I would probably want dual sided which tilts things back in favour of the very cheap hub.

 

Only real disadvantage for me of the hub is that I don't have power in races with my race wheels on.

Life is too short for seperate training and racing wheels.

[davidtinker]

Life is too short for seperate training and racing wheels.

 

My race wheels knock 600g off the weight of my bike and are aero