Spin or Grind

[The Saint]

So far the training regime has been as follows: Ride three days a week, Monday, Wednesday and Friday for approximately 45-60minutes depending on the route that we choose. Saturday we go a bit longer +/- 2hrs. Tuesday and Thursday are supposed to be the gym days with an upper body and lower body workout. It has taken me so far but intervals seems to be the way to go. How does this look?

 

Monday - Hill repeats

Tuesday - Gym (lower)

Wednesday - Recovery ride easy spin

Thursday - Gym (upper)

Friday - Sprint intervals

Saturday - Endurance

Sunday - Rest

Saturdays and Sundays should be long ride days simply because you have more time. I always recommend 2 rest days in the week but it is not a must. Should you prefer to rest only 1 day I recommend a Monday as Saturdays and Sundays should be longer and harder with Monday recovery and a gradual buildup again from the Tuesday.

[JA-Q001]

Okei. Like stated before. Both ure the same power, meaning watts. You are still displacing the same weight over the same distance in the same time. But, grinding and spinning uses different energy resources. The pros winning tdf do normally spin on longer (15km+) climbs. But on the shorter climbs they do tend to push a heavier gear, using more momentum to get over. They can also wind a shorter climb easier while grinding. If thex had to respond to an attack while spinning on a short climb(common in sa), then they would lose too much time dropping gears. Thats why they are able to grind and work that to a spin when needed.

[Grebel]

Thanks to all of you who replied. It looks as if I am on the right track. I am going to keep on spinning and do a bit more legwork in the gym for those hectic climbs!

 

I have a wife and kids so an open training plan is not really an option. I use the time before work to train while they sleep and do an early ride on Saturday. This leave the rest of the weekend for doing the stuff you can't do during the week because of work commitments and family time on Sunday. Looking at the days I don't really see any other way except for shuffling the weekdays around. My wife would divirce me if I dissapeared for a few hour on Sunday as well...

[Slave]

Couple of years ago I was the one who would argue that grinding big gear up the hill was the way to go.

 

I had this debate on the Hub and everyone tried to convince me that spinning was the way to go.

 

So it took me a long time and lot's of patience and trying for this old dog to learn new tricks, but I say that spinning is much better. I am less winded when I get to the top of a hill. Spinning defintely uses less power and it seriously feels like I have more energy at the end of a ride.

 

Dunno, maybe I am just a dumb old fart and I may be completely wrong. Spinning works for me, but I still like to get up a hill in a slightly heavier gear than most. Defintey lighter than I used to though.

[Zeps]

Jackie Lester Circa '1899' 'If you don't learn to spin you will always be an average cyclist' - Ok I know thats what he told us many many many years ago (can't remember the exact year clearly)

[TNT1]

Couple of years ago I was the one who would argue that grinding big gear up the hill was the way to go.

 

I had this debate on the Hub and everyone tried to convince me that spinning was the way to go.

 

 

I remember that. Still had the 900 year old peugeot at that stage,didn't ya?

[Borriz]

This argument is flawed. Firstly depends on your genetic composition. If you have fast twitch muscle then you would like to sprint and do short distances, if you have slow twitch then you can do climbing and endurance. So your energy consumption per individual depends on this.

However a heaver, grinding, fast twitch muscle person can easily learn to run high cadence. Your body is mechanical. It will take you 3 weeks to go from 80 to 100 cadence. You'll see from you heart rate that it jumps initially as you're not use to running higher cadence. But in 3 weeks time you'll do the cadence but at your earlier grinding heart rate.

 

At the end of the day it depends on the individual and not the argument.

[Dsan]

One shall consult the bible:

Velominati

 

Note Rule #6:

Free your mind and your legs will follow.

[Slave]

I remember that. Still had the 900 year old peugeot at that stage,didn't ya?

 

 

Indeed I did. Only had six gears so I ran out pretty fast. Then I converted it to 8 speed with STi dist-tings despite the BS saying it couldn't be done.

 

Rode it like that for many a moon.

[Tuxstir]

ever wonder why junior gears are small than your normal gears.. its so that they learn to sit and spin.

your normal daily cycling should be spinning with once a week doing a power (aka grinding) session. this works both set of muscles.

so that during a race. you dont end up running out of gears grinding away when the pace picks up and you dont end up spinning away cause you cant push the bigger gears.

its a balance but spinning is way way way more easier on the body than grinding.

[scotty]

I dont really have a choice, for me it granny gear or die.

[Thumper]

I dont really have a choice, for me it granny gear or die.

['Dale]

I grind more recently when I train - to strengthen.

I spin always when I race.

 

Cadence is key and such a personal thang - 85 is my avg and I laaik it there.

 

It is said often that grinding runs down the stamina of a rider down much quicker than spinning.

I say it is a personal thang.

Jan Ullrich was a master grinder.

Lance Armstrong is often referred to as "windmill Lance" as he spins often up to 100 revolutions per minute in the pro peloton.

[obree]

If I remember correctly, the difference arises as a result of the use of different muscle fibres when doing a fast v slow cadence. Fast cadence is fast-twitch muscles, which generally use less blood & oxygen, and recover faster, vs the slow twitch muscles that use a lot more blood & oxygen, and recover alot slower.

 

If you spin faster, it works out that you actually expel the same amount of work, but WORK less for it, if you know what I mean.

 

consider it like hauling a bunch of goods through a pully system:

 

how many times could you lift a weight of 50kg without leverage? possibly 5? 10? 20 at a push? Now do the same with a weight of 10kg. You'll be able to go for MUCH longer, and recover more quickly as well. You'll have to pull faster than the guy moving 50kg at a time, but that won't matter because you'll be doing it far more efficiently than him, at a much lower rate of exertion.

 

I was told its the other way round, fast cadence recruits more slow twitch, slow cadence more fast twitch.

Slow twitch take longer to fatigue that why you can only sprint for 10sec!!!!Cos you are using fast twitch.

It take a long time to "teach" your legs to spin.

Spinning vs Grinding - the power you see on your SRM is the same its the torque that will be lower when you spin, if you dont believe me test for yourself and download into Training Peaks and look at hub or crank torque. Higher torque means more fast twitch recruitment.

[javadude]

The old fogeys used to spend a few weeks on fixed gears with low gearing in the pre season to get some leg speed and perfect their pedal stroke. Only then would they start doing interval training with the heavier gears.

Edited January 20, 2011 by velo

[TNT1]

The old fogeys used to spend a few weeks on fixed gears with low gearing in the pre season to get some leg speed and perfect their pedal stroke. Only then would they start doing interval training with the heavier gears.

 

I used to ride a 44x16 or 44x17 for nearly a month at a time back in the day.