Icycling

So maybe the question is not about how much PPA is doing - it is rather about how much more they could be doing for the good of cycling and even including racing cycling! It is a non profit organization and still after several years of doing investing, still investing R220 000 plus in unite trust each month is not really servicing they current embers or cycling to the full!

In PPA funding proposal - they deliberately excluded any of this funding going to racing cycling - yet these fund are coming from a road race the Cape Argus Pick 'n Pay cycle tour - its timed and everyone race we all know that who you kidding if you don't believe that? Have you ever ask a fellow cyclist or ever been asked asked you cycle tour time - why its a race!

Who says it is not PPA function to assist PRO riders? they have chosen not too knowing full well that CSA is not capable - yet in Steve radio interview he stated PPA see some talented riders that they pass onto CSA to take further but with no money and no contribution from PPA to see these talented rider go futher. Its like a parent with enough money to pay school fees but at grade 10 say sorry you must now pay your own school fees and varsity fees - yes the parent says I know I can afford it but you on your own. Then to watch their child not going to school as the child does not have the fund! Personally if I saw that I would really question that parents ability in parenting and certainly would not agree with it!

Think this poll should read: Do motorist still obey the laws? OR Do motorist still stop correctly at stop street? They expect us to ride in the cutter but how often do I see motorist stoping at a stop street with their front bumper behind the line - 50% on avg with their front wheels ahead of the line 35 % and with their back wheels ahead of the line 15%! But yes we cyclist must be in the gutter to swerve into the traffic because of the nature of motorist not obeying the law!

Assuming you have not tried road cycling maybe you should - I do about 500km per week and have done for close to this amount for the last 30 years on avg - I could almost say I have seen it all! But then 5 weeks back I broke my collar bone again - hit some oil, descending Constantia Nek, left on the road by a previous (car) accident that day - without any warning front wheel came out from me and I was sliding into on coming traffic (we at this point had ZERO control), my friend rode over me and ended up stopping with his head against the bumper of the car coming up! But been fairly resilient sportsmen both of us raced in the Cape last week and this week - my friend won last weeks race and was 5th this week. I pulled off with 1 lap to go last week as 4 week is not enough time for a collar bone sprint are pretty hairy! This week I finish and think I am back on track for World Champs in October! The irony of this accident is both the cars coming up the Nek and the car behind us waited for about 30 min to and hour for us to be collected and be on the way to hospital many motorist stopped and asked if all of us were sorted! One of them gave my friend a lift to the hospital about 15km away in the opposite direction to which he was travelleing. The lady coming up the Nek who was on her way to her hair appointment and cancelled it immediately so she could wait to make sure we were looked after! My conclusion on all this was the motorist who saw what happened were in complete shock and suddenly saw 1st hand how venerable cyclist are - and yes we are - non of them were at fault, but I do think these motorist will for now at least offer cyclist they encounter on the roads a little more time / room! Why do I mention this - well as a motorist you only get exposed to about half of what a cyclist deals with from bad weather to bad road (remember our tires are 23mm wide and between back and front have about 3 square centimeter of contact with the road), bad drivers not to mention fatigue after rider over 150km etc! So the next time a motorist brushes past a cyclist remember that cyclist is actually at the mercy of the motorist hands - note my change of pic! I can also say in 30 years of road cycling I have never been hit from behind by a motorist and most of my cycling accidence have not involved cars directly at all - normally in cycle races or like above bad roads!

But thats exactly what you have indicated what you want to see - now maybe through this thread you may see the road through the eye's of a cyclist when next you in your motor vehicle overtaking a cyclist who is a bit further from the payment than you would like that cyclist to be {because you have a red light a head no doubt}!

Now that is very safe cycling and I have no reason not to encourage it! Motorist will only see what they want to see in terms of a cyclist and the danger they face on a daily basis - they tend not to se the complete picture.

When I am a motorist I get annoyed by truck driving slowly / older people etc! I don't deal with my annoyance by try to put that person at risk - they have as much right to be on the road as I do - why suddenly as a cyclist should motorist feel any different? Why should they now take their annoyance out on that person which is causing them to drive slow? Are they so stupid and feel so superior? Motorist cannot insist that a truck drives in the yellow line because you want too pass why should motorist behavior be any different towards cyclist? Are they so stupid and feel so superior? If I am a cyclist am ridding on my own on the SA roads I will always ride where I feel it is safe for me to do so in the left lane, which is within my rights as a road user. This is actually a case of cyclist (including myself) been considerate and ride predominately on the left for predominately inconsiderate motorist. How often it happen to me I will be ride on the left motorist passing etc then a motorist want to turn right - the motorist behind go straight for the payment to try get through a gap which they cannot (its a single lane) - now this motorist has just passed me now blocking my path - WHY because motorist in general are very inconsiderate and probably to dam stupid!

I disagree 100% Their are some road where it is just no safe to even consider overtaking a cyclist - the road is too narrow and their are pot holes / un ever man holes etc. One stretch of road like this all be it only about 200m would be riding into Muizemberg from Fish hoek. Solid white line just over 2m wide road in terrible condition - NOT safe to over take a cyclist - i ride closer to the white line than the pavement! I always indicate to to the motorist behind and have in 31 years of cycling not had a problem. Like wise I seem never to have a problem when over taking fellow cyclist by using hand signals - its just a pity a car seems never to see the need to use its indicator to over take me as a cyclist - yup that is the law use your indicator when overtaking another vehicle on the the road or changing your line! Most motorist always feel they own the road esp when they in the wrong! unfortunately this can cost lives due to complete in considerate behavior and what to save a couple of sec to get to the next red robot! Sometime its just best to accept motorist predominately speaking are In considerate - IDIOTS! Now in control of a weapon which should not be in their hands - Yup as a cyclist I have disengaged their weapons by removing car keys and handing in at the nearest police station - sudden the motorist has no "power" and realizes how idiotic they really are and what dangers they have created! Offering apologies etc etc etc!

The roads are for all road uses - if as a motorist you cannot respect that then you should not have a license to drive - if you passed your learners and drivers test you should appreciate the laws of the roads. Always remember that cyclist may be a 14 year old who has not done these teats or a cyclist without any form of education. As a motorist you have to take the responsibility as you are required to obey the laws and respect other road users and ensure what you are doing is safe to other road users! I.e. keep following distances etc!

One up too that!

what I am hearing here is motorist get upset when cyclist are been as considerate as most motorist are (lets face it a lot of motorist are very inconsiderate)! Their no law on the road that says a cyclist maybe not ride 1m from the curb it just states stay in the lane and as far left as safe. If a cyclist feel his / her safety factor is 1 m from the curb then motorist should respect that. After all cyclist have the same rights as motorist. Go rant at motorist who sit in the overtaking / fast lane on the free ways and motorist who still insist at overtaking cyclist on narrow road with blind rises and solid line with more than 2 wheels over the solid centre line. Motorist should learn some patients and manors! Yup I too am a motorist!

It was at an AGM about 5 years back - maybe more when the those who came to the AGM were asked to vote. Their was a "sunset clause" which was about to expire at that point PPA need to be part of CSA or not to be part of CSA - the members who attend the AGM decided in the interested of cycling it was better to be part of CSA and the greater sport than just to work in isolation in the WP as a non recognized sporting associaion. Their were some "autonomy right" which were granted in perpetually in this constitution - problem is SACOC has handed CSA with constitutions for all sports and the words in "autonomy" and "in perpetually" do not future in these constitutions and SASCOC seem to believe nobody has the rights to this type of clause! Well thats how I remember it! But line is SACOC is the "law" for sports in RSA and either fit in or fall out - could be one point of view!

After seeing all the donations come in for Maroesjka including some from myself along with giving an airticket to a rider to go to World Mountain Bike Marathon Champs next week. Please consider the junior been selected to go to World track champs all have to come up with I been told R30 000 to go! This is the link to who has been selected: https://www.bikehub.co.za/features/_/track/sa-track-cycling/junior-track-cycling-team-selected-for-worlds-in-glasgow-sco-r705

Not too High Jack this thread - and I too have given R1000 (well Maroesjka get it on Sunday) along with giving an airticket to a rider to go to World Mountain Bike Marathon Champs next week, but their are also some other in need. Currently the junior been selected to go to World track champs all have to come up with I been told R30 000 to go! This is the link to who has been selected: https://www.bikehub.co.za/features/_/track/sa-track-cycling/junior-track-cycling-team-selected-for-worlds-in-glasgow-sco-r705 I know another thread ha been created for donations - but if you know any off these riders or have sen them race maybe consider helping with their funding.

Nice one Wayne! This a true example why CSA needs funding - their will not always be the Wayne's of the world around!

As the CSA F off topic got locked: I have a car which I don't necessary want to drive but need to for work purposes! I need to pay a license - it the rule of the country, you pay and move on! I don't race my car well maybe I do, we are lucky we don'y pay cycle license - we use too it was an allu disc - so to give R75 per annum via and online system to CSA, I don't actually see what the huge fuss is all about. We aren't paying to ride on the road anymore. How many new tubes can you buy with R75.00? If it means some talented young cyclist can go and get some international exposure and my R75 contributed towards that (even if only R1 out of the R75) - well thats OK. Oh S#@t I am looking at the bigger picture and we don't do that here.

And maybe in 2013 this will be what happens - but don't expect the road fun rides to be around much long due to lack of cyclist!

Well at least Graeme Joffe can still read between the line and basically with his little knowledge of cycling can still put the blame squarely on SASCOC! But to comment of Steve Hayward: 1. When it came to the kids at 94.7 and day licenses he did not say - no an event has to more than what been commented in this tread 30km long for people to need day licenses - so the kids do not need to pay this fee from what I understand from this thread! 2. He goes on about been a putting on fun rides and by doing this drawing people into the sport - 100% correct. Then if the cyclist has potential and are talented putting them into the CSA structure and WP (what ever province) or national team with the hope 1 day a olympic team - that is great! But how can PPA knowingly do this when they know CSA don't have the finance to develop these cyclist - yes PPA want to turn a blind eye to this, but surely if you started the ball rolling (getting a person {especially the youth} interested in competitive cycling - all fun ride are competitive by nature of them been timed) you obliged to give it the support all the way through (esp. if you have the financial means which PPA do) unless you know another body is able to follow what you started of to the end? This is where I have a huge problem with PPA is as soon as a cyclist shows ability they actually drop them! How can they do that to their members? I a not surprised the likes of Darren Lill (still lives in Cape Town and races) who by the way did their 1st Argus Cycle tour at the age of 7 are no longer a member of PPA - PPA failed him! Like PPA has failed a lot of other cyclist who started in the PPA fun ride system became relatively good and could have gone further but PPA stance on not wanting to invest in the racing members has got to be questions! That's is why CSA need money and surely they should be looking to PPA for this in one form or another be it a grant or a levy on entries into their fun ride, which use public road, which possible SASCOC / CSA, could prevent PPA getting access too! Its not bulling is actually is just saying you started something finish it!

How many lawyers are on the PPA committee at present? 2 or 3!

For more over taking space other road uses should understand: http://sphotos-c.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-prn2/954871_10151429112056577_1792968526_n.jpg

Lets for 1 moment consider what the members of PPA have already voted on a few years back to be in a unified body or not to be in a unified body. The member decided it was better for the sport to be in a unified body. Believe it, it still is and if the current committee cannot accept that you have to ask why and who on the committee is possibly finically benefitting for it directly so or indirectly so! What agendas do the individuals on the committee have? It is a case of making it work what ever government dictates to CSA! Imagine when the rules changed on smoking and business did not make it work - their would be no restaurant, night club or bars still open! Sometime the rules change by government and you have to deal with them! Cycling is far better speaking / campaigning with 1 voice when it get / trying to achieve objectives with the greater part of government from road safety, better infrastructure for cyclist nationally, even on the elite side of the sport see the cyclist being successful on the world stage! PPA realized this what about 14 years back and thus went into negotiation with then the SACF to form a new body called CSA. They realized the new body CSA with many more members PPA themselves in current number bring 18 000 members to the party government could not just be ignored - but with this new stance by PPA, cycling will no doubt be in a worse place than it currently is as highlighted by several people in this thread.

Not sure why what PPA versa what CSA is been compared here? CSA as stated earlier is basically the "governments cycling arm" - granted the "racing" part - and as you stated in the Western Cape governments is doing quite a bit in building bike paths! Granted you cannot expect PPA to fit the bill of government in building infrastructure - their they just don't have enough rands as that would run into 100 of millions - thus the disclaimer (maybe with what ever amount of resource they had they could not have succeeded). But lobbing government thats a different story! Possibly lobbying government through CSA would have more success on a National scale. On the other hand maybe government just want PPA to come to the party in the form of CSA and help with the racing side - possibly a bill they could significantly fit - after all it is governments overall sporting government department dictating to CSA. Government will take care of the rest - no doubt at a very slow pace depending on the province! Possibly 1 of the reasons for PPA getting a TAX concession. Their are a whole lot off issue here and I am not prepared to write a whole paper on this matter!

Did you not see the disclaimer! (maybe with what ever amount of resource they had they could not have succeeded) But their is an event in Australia - similar to the Cycle tour - which all their profits go to employ people just lobby government for cyclist rights and to get better laws / facilities in place for cyclist! They are even suceeding. They don't spend money on unit trust every month!

I started cycling back in 1983 (10 years old at the time) to ride the then Argus Cycle tour - my older brother came home from school and announced he wanted to to this event! So my father who even won the Argus cycle tour and myself decided we would also start cycling! Part of my training and my independence in life became my bicycle - I use to ride to school (this at the time was a big portion of my training), post schooling studies and even to work - I work in the Strand and lived in Constantia! (60km commute each way). I no longer study and work from home - but I still do cycle! I have 2 half sister on my fathers side - he has never let them ride on the roads - as he feels the roads are way to un safe to cycle on - PPA has failed (maybe with what ever amount of resource they had they could not have succeeded) the cycling community in keeping the roads safe, which I agree should be their main Priority! I don't have any children of my own but I do see far fewer kids riding to school and back - if you have children do you allow them to commute via bicycle to school - if not why not?