LCHF - Low Carb High Fat Diet Ver 2

[wonduhboy]

Eventually got my RER and VOmax test results back.

 

VOmax was measured at 49 while the average for males my age is 43-52.

 

The RER results are very interesting to me. I put it into a table with those of Mike Pigg from Phil Maffetone's book as reference. Maffetone's formula was spot on for me at the beginning. I did the normal 180 - age, but added 5 as I've been training for a year when I started Maffetone's method. It brought me to an aerobic threshold of 148. The testing now shows it's 1 lower at 147. What I'm unsure of, is how I will be getting to a threshold of 152 by the end of this year (180-age+10 if I reach two years of training without injury). Right now my RER at 152 is not even close...

 

What is also interesting, is to see how quickly the burning of glucose escalates after exceeding my threshold (147+). Just two beats later I'm burning 70% glucose I was hoping to do a 70.3 triathlon in December at 155-160 effort, but I now think I'll blow up. I'll be burning 1000 calories an hour with 300 coming from fat, and can only replace 400 by digestion. It leaves me with a deficit of 300 per hour, or 1700 over 5:45. My stores will only have about 1500. Maybe gluconeogenesis can provide the shortfall, but it is still risky. It would be better to do 50% of the biking at threshold to make sure I have enough for a run at 155-165 HR.

 

This also strengthens my intention of not excluding carb intake during prolonged exercise. If I go over 2 hours I will take in 300-400 kcal per hour. To leave it to my liver to produce 700 kcal during hour 3 and beyond feels way too taxing.

 

Snytijie, thanks so much for sharing this!

Did you get this info from a normal VO2 max test?

 

Not sure if you gave it to us before, but can you give us some history on when you started LCHF etc?

[igknot]

Continuously eating fatty foods perturbs communication between the gut and brain, which in turn perpetuates a bad diet

 

 

http://www.the-scientist.com/?articles.view/articleNo/37068/title/Why-One-Cream-Cake-Leads-to-Another/

[P.A.K.]

Continuously eating fatty foods perturbs communication between the gut and brain, which in turn perpetuates a bad diet

 

 

http://www.the-scien...ads-to-Another/

A chronic high-fat diet is thought to desensitize the brain to the feeling of satisfaction that one normally gets from a meal, causing a person to overeat in order to achieve the same high again.

No one told my body that...

On the contrary, I now eat much less.

 

In my experience it was sugar and carbs that made me hungry again and again.

 

Unfortunately that article doesn't provide ANY information on the study that was done.

• What was the rodents' diet? What type of fats were it fed?
  
• What is the relationship between the rodents' response to fatty diets and how humans respond to fat?
  
• Rodents are naturally herbivores, humans are not
  
• Who eats cream cake to loose weight?
  

So, don't stress it

[Helpmytrap]

Continuously eating fatty foods perturbs communication between the gut and brain, which in turn perpetuates a bad diet

 

http://www.the-scien...ads-to-Another/

That study is flawed. Never mind that ice-cream is far from high fat, and in the case of this study, some other studies and media, people blame "high fat" foods but are referring to cakes and chips which are high carb. (edit: mainly high sugar which drives appetite.)

 

Plus, they never said any of these mice over ate nor that they gained weight as a result of this "desensitizing of the brain."

Personally I think that you can't take studies conducted on mice that are then projected onto humans as if we are one in the same seriously. Because we are far from the same! Sure in this case both mice and humans have the same response BUT our body is a system, not a single process. Food for thought.

Edited August 19, 2013 by Helpmytrap

[Stevief]

How do i check if im in Ketosis? What do i need and where do i get it?

[Sniffie]

How do i check if im in Ketosis? What do i need and where do i get it?

Test-it 9 Urinalysis test strips. Test for ketosis, glucose and a lot of other stuff in urine. You can pm @flexia. She is on this thread as well.

[htone]

Or just chuck out all the refined carbs (for me, that includes ready-made cereals) once and for all.

 

 

Example: a whole pink grapefruit equates to about 10 - 12 grams of carbs (@ a low GI score of 25). Considering how nutrient-dense a graprefuit is, that's for me a much better source of carbs than porridge, a hotcross bun, etc., ever will be.

 

Strangely enough, I stopped eating any processed foods in October of 2012 and the only processed thing in my kitchen is a few cans of tuna. The Futurelife purchase was an impulse decision and I will actually give the box away rather than use it up, that's how bad the stuff made me feel. It took a while for the penny to drop regarding the sudden energy dips, but it is definitely a direct result of the FL in my breakfast mix. Got a bag of SSN whey today, so that will go into the shake from tomorrow !

[@flexia]

How do i check if im in Ketosis? What do i need and where do i get it?

 

I stock the "Test-it 9 Urinalysis test strips" (aka Ketostix) for R150 per box. Each container has a 100 stix/strips in them. It comes with an explanation sheet of what each colour measures and how to analyse it. If you are not close to Durbvanville to collect it yourself, then I can have it posted to you via the SA Post Office for an additional R80. And... all you need is a full bladder...

 

PM me for further details.

[An3]

Pecan Nuts for sale

 

https://www.bikehub.co.za/index.php?app=hubmarket&module=core&do=view_item&item_id=59268&new=1

[htone]

Eventually got my RER and VOmax test results back.

 

VOmax was measured at 49 while the average for males my age is 43-52.

 

The RER results are very interesting to me. I put it into a table with those of Mike Pigg from Phil Maffetone's book as reference. Maffetone's formula was spot on for me at the beginning. I did the normal 180 - age, but added 5 as I've been training for a year when I started Maffetone's method. It brought me to an aerobic threshold of 148. The testing now shows it's 1 lower at 147. What I'm unsure of, is how I will be getting to a threshold of 152 by the end of this year (180-age+10 if I reach two years of training without injury). Right now my RER at 152 is not even close...

 

What is also interesting, is to see how quickly the burning of glucose escalates after exceeding my threshold (147+). Just two beats later I'm burning 70% glucose I was hoping to do a 70.3 triathlon in December at 155-160 effort, but I now think I'll blow up. I'll be burning 1000 calories an hour with 300 coming from fat, and can only replace 400 by digestion. It leaves me with a deficit of 300 per hour, or 1700 over 5:45. My stores will only have about 1500. Maybe gluconeogenesis can provide the shortfall, but it is still risky. It would be better to do 50% of the biking at threshold to make sure I have enough for a run at 155-165 HR.

 

This also strengthens my intention of not excluding carb intake during prolonged exercise. If I go over 2 hours I will take in 300-400 kcal per hour. To leave it to my liver to produce 700 kcal during hour 3 and beyond feels way too taxing.

 

Snytjie, apologies for the delayed reply, this is a moerofa interesting post !

I am betting on the fact that you could tune up your fat burning engine to make up most of that deficit from fat, leaving you with only a small shortfall of carbs, but that would need time to adapt and you will have to start running for longer and more intense periods without supplementing - but it does not sound as if you have time for this ?

 

If I was you, I would drop Prof Noakes a mail and see - he does actually respond to emails - from the work he has done with Fordyce and Chalupsky I am sure that he will have an opinion that you could use ?

[Snytjie]

Snytijie, thanks so much for sharing this!

Did you get this info from a normal VO2 max test?

 

Not sure if you gave it to us before, but can you give us some history on when you started LCHF etc?

 

Hi,

 

No, it was a VOmax test combined with a Respiratory Exchange Ratio test.

 

I ate high protein/low carb for six months up to November last year, and LCHF since then (9 months now). Trained since April 2012 for triathlon. I lost 14 kgs since starting training/high protein diet, and 4 of those most recently on LCHF. I take on carbs in sessions longer than 2 hours, and with recovery drinks after exercise lasting longer than an hour. I used commercial ones, but nowadays make my own with two raw eggs, 500ml full fat milk, L-glutamine powder and 20g glucose powder. Apart from this, I'm quite strict on LCHF although I stick to carb levels of 80-100g a day. I do sometimes 'cheat', but this is irregular and mostly happens when eating out or visiting friends and family.

[Snytjie]

Snytjie, apologies for the delayed reply, this is a moerofa interesting post !

I am betting on the fact that you could tune up your fat burning engine to make up most of that deficit from fat, leaving you with only a small shortfall of carbs, but that would need time to adapt and you will have to start running for longer and more intense periods without supplementing - but it does not sound as if you have time for this ?

 

If I was you, I would drop Prof Noakes a mail and see - he does actually respond to emails - from the work he has done with Fordyce and Chalupsky I am sure that he will have an opinion that you could use ?

 

I'd like to hear what the good Prof finds in his research. Maybe I'll mail him, but he must be a very busy man.

 

I'd like to tune up the fat burning engine more. As is well known one would still need quite a bit of glucose even if it is revving well. I'm very wary of relying on the gluconeogenesis engine for that glucose. I'm a layman, but I'm sure this process is an emergency response of the body. And during endurance exercise that to me means added stress to an already stressed out body. For now the man Maffetone's method must help to tune the fat burning machine. I can't wait to see what my RER is like after my current over-aerobic threshold training (3 months) and racing season (4 months).

 

I wouldn't mind to be corrected on the gluconeogenesis. There just isn't enough research around to sooth my fears...

[htone]

 

 

I'd like to hear what the good Prof finds in his research. Maybe I'll mail him, but he must be a very busy man.

 

I'd like to tune up the fat burning engine more. As is well known one would still need quite a bit of glucose even if it is revving well. I'm very wary of relying on the gluconeogenesis engine for that glucose. I'm a layman, but I'm sure this process is an emergency response of the body. And during endurance exercise that to me means added stress to an already stressed out body. For now the man Maffetone's method must help to tune the fat burning machine. I can't wait to see what my RER is like after my current over-aerobic threshold training (3 months) and racing season (4 months).

 

I wouldn't mind to be corrected on the gluconeogenesis. There just isn't enough research around to sooth my fears...

Mail him, what can you lose ?

[Man with no name]

I recently mailed him on cholesterol and blood sugar and he gave me a detailed response. Mail him!

[eugenejvn]

Read all about it...News regarding LCHF: http://cyclingtips.com.au/2013/08/high-fat-low-carb-diets-good-for-you-and-your-cycling/

 

Our diet is more and more starting to stick up it's hand in the media. It's almost feeling that those on it are loosing the competitive advantage

 

Thanks to all for sharing your knowledge. I've been on it for 8 months now and even though I'm struggling to loose weight, I definitely feel I've gained endurance and recently power.

[htone]

May I just say that it is great to see both old and new contributors posting on this, probably the most on-topic thread on The Hub ! Keep it going !!!!