NotSoBigBen Posted February 16, 2016 Posted February 16, 2016 I usually wash the bikes that I used the previous week on Mondays ..... helps me get through my rest day sanity intact ???? Also an opportunity to give them a quick once over to see if there are any obvious issues .....
RockCoach Posted February 16, 2016 Posted February 16, 2016 aahhhh therein lies the problem Any bikeshop that refers to minor / major services are setting themselves up for failure. The client will immediately think car and assume consumables are included...like with a car service. Go to a mechanic and ask for specific things to be done...stay very far away from major minor type services. We work both ways as most customers aren't quite sure what to specify and tend to want either a major or minor or just a quick check (gear indexing). If you know exactly what you want then we will do that and calculate a labour charge. All bike washes and associated consumables are included in the service cost.
Showtime Posted February 16, 2016 Posted February 16, 2016 Anyone here trained up their domestic manager, garden executive to wash a bike (properly)? I only really pay attention to my drivetrain, a mtb frame can be a bit dirty. BUT it would be quite lekker to get a bike Polish once a week with no extra cost We have some friends who tried that as well. Their domestic manager decided the drivetrains weren't responding fast enough to soap and reverted to pool acid on their shiny Cannondales.
Bloukrans Posted February 16, 2016 Posted February 16, 2016 We have some friends who tried that as well. Their domestic manager decided the drivetrains weren't responding fast enough to soap and reverted to pool acid on their shiny Cannondales. dismissed on the spot??
CAAD4 Posted February 16, 2016 Posted February 16, 2016 dismissed on the spot??Spez commuters perhaps???
GLuvsMtb Posted February 16, 2016 Posted February 16, 2016 We have some friends who tried that as well. Their domestic manager decided the drivetrains weren't responding fast enough to soap and reverted to pool acid on their shiny Cannondales. Give that domestic manager a Bells!
rouxtjie Posted February 16, 2016 Posted February 16, 2016 We work both ways as most customers aren't quite sure what to specify and tend to want either a major or minor or just a quick check (gear indexing). If you know exactly what you want then we will do that and calculate a labour charge. All bike washes and associated consumables are included in the service cost.I agree Sean...the major / minor thing however is a bit grey unless it specifies explicitly what it covers. I think the biggest issue is people tend to equate it to car major service where everything is included....whereas with a bike things like chain / cassette / rings / brakepads / sealant isnt. Then people get upset that it wasnt included but don't have an idea what these "consumeables" cost. Managing expectations are tricky i suspect in the bike industry hence I like to go to a mech and say do X, Y and Z...and only X, Y and Z. No need for wash and lube and gear adjustment.
BarHugger Posted February 16, 2016 Posted February 16, 2016 I agree Sean...the major / minor thing however is a bit grey unless it specifies explicitly what it covers. I think the biggest issue is people tend to equate it to car major service where everything is included....whereas with a bike things like chain / cassette / rings / brakepads / sealant isnt. Then people get upset that it wasnt included but don't have an idea what these "consumeables" cost. Managing expectations are tricky i suspect in the bike industry hence I like to go to a mech and say do X, Y and Z...and only X, Y and Z. No need for wash and lube and gear adjustment.But what if it all gets explained to them beforehand......they will also get to a point where they understand as to what seems to have become an industry standard.....imagine how difficult it will get when they have to have a price for every single thing to be done....you refer to X,Y and Z....that is where the issue might creep in....what are you/me prepared to pay for an X or Y ?I often wonder how some of these shops actually survive....I have seen first hand with a big shop not far from me how people walk in with "can you do this for me quickly" they drop all they do to help what might become an irate customer because he just wants something "small" sorted very quickly....they then take their tools, their time and use their expertise to do this quickly....he then walks away with a thumbs up and they never got a cent....all this whilst a paying clients bike is being put aside....I was that paying guy that waited for them....but I also have much patience.....
rouxtjie Posted February 16, 2016 Posted February 16, 2016 But what if it all gets explained to them beforehand......they will also get to a point where they understand as to what seems to have become an industry standard.....imagine how difficult it will get when they have to have a price for every single thing to be done....you refer to X,Y and Z....that is where the issue might creep in....what are you/me prepared to pay for an X or Y ?I often wonder how some of these shops actually survive....I have seen first hand with a big shop not far from me how people walk in with "can you do this for me quickly" they drop all they do to help what might become an irate customer because he just wants something "small" sorted very quickly....they then take their tools, their time and use their expertise to do this quickly....he then walks away with a thumbs up and they never got a cent....all this whilst a paying clients bike is being put aside....I was that paying guy that waited for them....but I also have much patience.....I think it would be ok then...but they need to understand that major service doens't incl certain bike specific consumables as it does with a car. The avg weekend warrior doesnt, that is probably why we see these bike shops are crap threads. People don't know what things cost, sealant as a great example is moer expensive, shimano mineral oil another. I would prefer a shop to layout specific jobs(labout costs) and materials(manufacturer ranges) and you can cherry pick what you want done with what materials...like a roccomamas menus....you tick what you want and with what toppings and that essentially becomes your jobcard. That way there expectations are clear. I have no problem paying for skilled labour....
eddy Posted February 16, 2016 Posted February 16, 2016 . I think the biggest issue is people tend to equate it to car major service where everything is included.... whereas with a bike things like chain / cassette / rings / brakepads / sealant isnt. Then people get upset that it wasnt included but don't have an idea what these "consumeables" cost. You are 100% correct but I would like to add that on most cars (and all under Motor plan) the price of the free or included service components are priced into the selling price of the car, you pay for that upfront. I would be interested to see what the cost implication of a equivalent plan would be on the purchase price of a top-end bike. Maybe double it ?
rouxtjie Posted February 17, 2016 Posted February 17, 2016 You are 100% correct but I would like to add that on most cars (and all under Motor plan) the price of the free or included service components are priced into the selling price of the car, you pay for that upfront. I would be interested to see what the cost implication of a equivalent plan would be on the purchase price of a top-end bike. Maybe double it ?presies....there is no such thing as a free lunch. Hence if i was a bike shop owner I would rather do the specific labour costs + component cost on a job card. But I am not
Eldron Posted February 17, 2016 Posted February 17, 2016 presies....there is no such thing as a free lunch. Hence if i was a bike shop owner I would rather do the specific labour costs + component cost on a job card. But I am notIt's almost impossible to have a one size fits all pricing list. Sealant top up through valve with decent tyres - 15mins.Sealant top up on old tyres with snot balls, clogged valve inserts, dry sealant all over the bead - 1 hour. New casing and cables that are external on frame - 20mins.Same on some internal frames - 90mins with help from a gynaecologist. The key is trained front office staff that can assess a bike on arrival and identify pit falls early on. That's why I enjoy smaller shops that you can have a dialogue with rather than huge stores where staff are under trained and not empowered to do diddly squat.
RockCoach Posted February 17, 2016 Posted February 17, 2016 presies....there is no such thing as a free lunch. Hence if i was a bike shop owner I would rather do the specific labour costs + component cost on a job card. But I am not Most of the time the owner says:"it needs a service, please eliminate all the creaks. I think it's the crank because it happens when I pedal"Bike has done a number of stage races and been through quite a few power washes. How do you cost stripping the whole bike and greasing every pivot and bearing, skewer, chainring bolt, seatpost, pedal etc, etc... Basically a full service labour cost. And no it's not possible to do one thing, build the bike back up and test it. Bring it back and try another thing, the way you home mechanic the bike at home . The average rider is not as passionate about biking as all of us on this forum. They don't care about the ins and outs of it all as long as you can make the bike work again. They don't care what sealant we put in the tyres - as long as it works. They don't know what headset bearings are and why they need to be greased. They don't want to specify all the little bits on their bike which needs attention because they have no idea what they are. For knowledgeable guys like you we will do exactly what you ask for and add then add a labour charge. Because chances are you know how to clean and grease a pivot bolt when it starts making noises and you change your own cables and housing, brake pads etc. You are in the 3% who do but still need the lbs to attend to difficult issues sometimes... which we done for you before
BarHugger Posted February 17, 2016 Posted February 17, 2016 Rouxtjie your idea of a labour cost sounds great....we need to then ascertain what the value of that time allocated will be....Eldron has laid out some time and we all know time is money....my logic then tells me that what your are possibly looking for is a standard hourly rate....this of course can then be spilt in to quarters to determine what a guy would pay for a 15 minute gear adjustment (he will be screwed of course as most people feel that a small job like that should be done at no charge) ....then Robodog talks about the rear suspension service....adding all the hours might just cost a huge amount more than what people are paying now....perhaps that is a way forward...that way the shop owner or mechanic will stop losing money over those "can you quickly do me a favour" jobs......
Eldron Posted February 17, 2016 Posted February 17, 2016 ....my logic then tells me that what your are possibly looking for is a standard hourly rate.... Hourly rate is a tough one - nobody bats an eye (or perhaps they do but don't complain) about car agents selling their technician's time at R500-600/hour. Try that for a bicycle and people have a melt down. This is where the SA industry is half pregnant. People want R600/hour service at R100/hour rate. Until the rate increases and shops can afford "real" mechanics there is going to be a disconnect between service offering and service expectation. There are some awesome mechanics out there but keeping awesome mechanics is tough when the monthly pay is under (estimate) R15k/month. That kind of money is fine for students and youngsters but not enough to buy a house and feed a family. So the trend is to have poor mechanics or students working in bike shops. Self fulfilling prophecy....
RockCoach Posted February 17, 2016 Posted February 17, 2016 Hourly rate is a tough one - nobody bats an eye (or perhaps they do but don't complain) about car agents selling their technician's time at R500-600/hour. Try that for a bicycle and people have a melt down. This is where the SA industry is half pregnant. People want R600/hour service at R100/hour rate. Until the rate increases and shops can afford "real" mechanics there is going to be a disconnect between service offering and service expectation. There are some awesome mechanics out there but keeping awesome mechanics is tough when the monthly pay is under (estimate) R15k/month. That kind of money is fine for students and youngsters but not enough to buy a house and feed a family. So the trend is to have poor mechanics or students working in bike shops. Self fulfilling prophecy.... R15k a month???Can I come work your side please?
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