Tumbleweed Posted January 26, 2016 Posted January 26, 2016 technically, nothing that can be used in court. lots of off the record stuff. why does everyone know that group as "the chemical brothers"? they've had that name since long before my saga with them If the statements you made at the time were unlawful, and you couldn't defend them in court, it is fair to describe the lawyer's letter as bullying?
BarHugger Posted January 26, 2016 Posted January 26, 2016 But even the " off the record stuff " could just be pure rumours....jealousy...speculation spread as fact....without any actual and factual proof it's all speculative...a birdie recently informed me of a fella (someone very verbal against these dopers) who happens to be on the juice and it's speculated by a few that this fella is on the juice....but there is no real hard facts surrounding those suspicions.... raptor-22 1
BarHugger Posted January 26, 2016 Posted January 26, 2016 If the statements you made at the time were unlawful, and you couldn't defend them in court, it is fair to describe the lawyer's letter as bullying?If you are heading in the direction which my mind is heading off in....this could be a miraculous day...us agreeing on something..
fandacious Posted January 26, 2016 Posted January 26, 2016 If the statements you made at the time were unlawful, and you couldn't defend them in court, it is fair to describe the lawyer's letter as bullying? I dont think I ever described anyone or anything as bullying. And just because I couldn't defend them in court, doesn't mean I didn't know what I was talking about, or that I was wrong. If i could defend them in court I would have ignored the letter and not retracted. I did retract, knowing full well that the day would soon come when it would all be out in the open anyways, and the lawyers letters would just be another mark against their name. Even if i did have court admissible evidence, its unlikely i would spend my time or money fighting SAIDS battles for them. But I love how most of the outrage is against Jeroen, SAIDS, myself, jules, etc, instead of the lying cheating stealing cyclist who for years has bullied everyone to suit his own agenda. Everytime its a saffer, everyone goes soft, because "he's such a nice guys", and "he only did it because he had to" T-Bob, koukie, Patchelicious and 2 others 5
fandacious Posted January 26, 2016 Posted January 26, 2016 But even the " off the record stuff " could just be pure rumours....jealousy...speculation spread as fact....without any actual and factual proof it's all speculative...a birdie recently informed me of a fella (someone very verbal against these dopers) who happens to be on the juice and it's speculated by a few that this fella is on the juice....but there is no real hard facts surrounding those suspicions.... nah its not just jealous speculation. These guys are so blatant about it (like keeping it in the fridge next to their beer). intern 1
Skubarra Posted January 26, 2016 Posted January 26, 2016 But I love how most of the outrage is against Jeroen, SAIDS, myself, jules, etc, instead of the lying cheating stealing cyclist who for years has bullied everyone to suit his own agenda. THIS! I might not agree with the whole twitter war thing (interesting as it is), but how quickly people forget that the root of all problems & the real bad guys, the okes that are bad for the sport are the DOPERS, not the people calling them out. Some perspective is sorely needed. intern, ahmedbadat and T-Bob 3
Showtime Posted January 26, 2016 Posted January 26, 2016 technically, nothing that can be used in court. lots of off the record stuff. why does everyone know that group as "the chemical brothers"? they've had that name since long before my saga with them It's just a dangerous precedent if we can go around saying so and so quacks like a ..... You too would want the law and the burden of proof to protect you if someone calls you a (enter disgusting criminal activity here) on social media and that is what happened at the time. But I don't want to detract any more from the true topic which is doping.
fandacious Posted January 26, 2016 Posted January 26, 2016 It's just a dangerous precedent if we can go around saying so and so quacks like a ..... You too would want the law and the burden of proof to protect you if someone calls you a (enter disgusting criminal activity here) on social media and that is what happened at the time. But I don't want to detract any more from the true topic which is doping. FWIW, jules and i never called anyone a doper. I said its very suspicious that DG was busted and then suddenly KE results went to pot. Based on that there was assumed that i was inferring he was doping
Tumbleweed Posted January 26, 2016 Posted January 26, 2016 I dont think I ever described anyone or anything as bullying. And just because I couldn't defend them in court, doesn't mean I didn't know what I was talking about, or that I was wrong. If i could defend them in court I would have ignored the letter and not retracted. I did retract, knowing full well that the day would soon come when it would all be out in the open anyways, and the lawyers letters would just be another mark against their name. Even if i did have court admissible evidence, its unlikely i would spend my time or money fighting SAIDS battles for them. But I love how most of the outrage is against Jeroen, SAIDS, myself, jules, etc, instead of the lying cheating stealing cyclist who for years has bullied everyone to suit his own agenda. Everytime its a saffer, everyone goes soft, because "he's such a nice guys", and "he only did it because he had to" The fact still remains: you made an unlawful statement, which you couldn't back up. Evans' bust now doesn't change that. You say you didn't have any court admissible evidence? That would call into question the reliability of the evidence you did have. Have you presented any of that evidence since now that it is in the open? How would your money and time defending a court action have any bearing on SAIDS' bust of Evans? I think most of the outrage is being directed at Evans. Mousea 1
Andrew Steer Posted January 26, 2016 Posted January 26, 2016 I dont think I ever described anyone or anything as bullying. And just because I couldn't defend them in court, doesn't mean I didn't know what I was talking about, or that I was wrong. If i could defend them in court I would have ignored the letter and not retracted. I did retract, knowing full well that the day would soon come when it would all be out in the open anyways, and the lawyers letters would just be another mark against their name. Even if i did have court admissible evidence, its unlikely i would spend my time or money fighting SAIDS battles for them. But I love how most of the outrage is against Jeroen, SAIDS, myself, jules, etc, instead of the lying cheating stealing cyclist who for years has bullied everyone to suit his own agenda. Everytime its a saffer, everyone goes soft, because "he's such a nice guys", and "he only did it because he had to" I agree largely on all of this, but in my view you also did yourself no favours with the manner in which you tackled Kevins wife on Twitter... she may be naive, she most definitely should not have said anything, but she is also at the end of the day just a wife defending her husband, best friend and father of her kids and their lives of the last decade. Sometimes you do just have to be the bigger person Zatopek, T-Bob, SwissVan and 3 others 6
Andrew Steer Posted January 26, 2016 Posted January 26, 2016 FWIW, jules and i never called anyone a doper. I said its very suspicious that DG was busted and then suddenly KE results went to pot. Based on that there was assumed that i was inferring he was doping Was the comment made on a doping thread? If so, a reasoned person would consider the angle you took as inferring him as being a doper. If it was on a thread "How training with a partner boosts performance..." then you may well have gotten away with you inclination being that KE does not train well alone
BarHugger Posted January 26, 2016 Posted January 26, 2016 nah its not just jealous speculation. These guys are so blatant about it (like keeping it in the fridge next to their beer).I also heard the rumours about the stuff in the fridge...very much as the many stories about the Jozi ICG group....but without actually seeing anything which would make it conclusive...it makes it nothing more than speculation which could lead to defamation....
fandacious Posted January 26, 2016 Posted January 26, 2016 Was the comment made on a doping thread? If so, a reasoned person would consider the angle you took as inferring him as being a doper. If it was on a thread "How training with a partner boosts performance..." then you may well have gotten away with you inclination being that KE does not train well alone comment was made on twitter. I'd point you to it, but its been deleted
fandacious Posted January 26, 2016 Posted January 26, 2016 The fact still remains: you made an unlawful statement, which you couldn't back up. Evans' bust now doesn't change that. You say you didn't have any court admissible evidence? That would call into question the reliability of the evidence you did have. Have you presented any of that evidence since now that it is in the open? How would your money and time defending a court action have any bearing on SAIDS' bust of Evans? I think most of the outrage is being directed at Evans. I made no such statement. I said its amazing that how a SA pro's performance has dropped now that his riding partner has been busted. 1) i never mentioned his name2) I never called him a doper. very few people would have suspected anything if KE hadnt gone on the rampage the way he did. Streissand effect kinda? intern 1
Patchelicious Posted January 26, 2016 Posted January 26, 2016 (edited) comment was made on twitter. I'd point you to it, but its been deleted The comment was refered to in the letter that Jules posted on Twitter.... 2. We have been instructed with the contents of a tweet sent by your Twitter account @jules52, on or about 30 June 2014, as follows: “@Bicycleasshole @zkrige It’s also instructive to look at his results before he found his blood brother, so to speak.” (“the offending tweet”). 3. The offending tweet was posted in response to the following tweet, posted by Zayin Krige (@zkrige): “So, theres a SA pro, who, since his partner got busted for EPO in 2012, suddenly hasn’t been performing. Make me wonder...” Edited January 26, 2016 by Patchelicious
fandacious Posted January 26, 2016 Posted January 26, 2016 (edited) The comment was refered to in the letter that Jules posted on Twitter.... ah right - here it is (got it from my emma letter) “So, theres a SA pro, who, since his partner got busted for EPO in 2012, suddenly hasn’t been performing. Make me wonder...” and “@jules52 @Bicycleasshole what grates me tho, is the “im so shocked” outcry, and the soppy blog posts. FFS. Do we look stupid?” ffs - i predicted the "i'm so shocked" outcry and soppy blog posts in my original tweets. cyclists really are predictable Edited January 26, 2016 by fandacious
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