Cyclists and runners

[lechatnoir]

Let me start out by saying that I almost always ride alone and respect my safety and the safety of those around me. By that I mean that I stick to the left and give room. In return i expect the same. When it comes to cars, I know how to behave (flame suit on) and in return, I expect cars to pass when safe to do so and to give me 1m safety buffer - I know... pigs may fly, but it DOES happen sometimes.

 

Enter runners...

 

I ride the Camps Bay -> Chappies route almost exclusively, and lately, I've (almost) run into a good few runners chuffing along the emergency lane on the ocean side while riding from HB to CB, running against the traffic as they're supposed to. When it's one or two, that's fine. One of the runners will usually drift to their right, giving space. On the downhill bits for the cyclists, that's nice, as we're moving pretty quickly and it's just the safe thing to do. But, when the running group has grown, they fill the entire emergency lane, meaning that cyclists have to drift to THEIR right, into the traffic lane. Not dire when we're doing 60 anyway (downhill), but when you're doing 15 up Suikerbossie, it's not the greatest cycling experience to drift into a traffic lane where motorists are gunning it and are hitting 80kmh. I'm not sure which would be louder.... the crunch of carbon fibre or my pelvis...

 

Do cyclists keep to their left against the shoulder and let the runners face the oncoming cars - that's why they're running facing the traffic in the first place? Or do we say a small prayer and hope for motorists to be vigilant?

 

Or have I opened a can of worms that should stay shut?

[Stretch]

I generally..as a runner on my own...move to the left if there is no traffic and let the cyclist know that he/she must keep their lane. If there is traffic then I will move off the road to the right onto the pavement/verge. In a group we generally shift off the road to the right on the understanding that we can run in dirt but a cyclist can't. on uphills (for the cyclist) i think there is enough time for you both to see each other for everyone to adjust their position to give the cyclist the right of way

 

 

Not all runners are considerate though 

[NotSoBigBen]

Alas a 'group' of runners is no different to a 'group' of cyclists it would seem ..... they will also have their stories to tell I'm sure and it's ONLY Monday demmit  

[Wannabe]

I have exactly the same problem with runners, experienced it again this weekend. Fairly big groups (and also two or three runners only), probably training for the Comrades, occupying the whole of the yellow line, and not giving way to approaching cyclists, forcing us to go into the roadway. This is dangerous, and unneccessary. 

 

A bit of courtesy, please guys.

[eccc whippet]

Mob justice rules...

 

if there is one runner/cyclist it isnt an issue...when it is 2 it gets tricky...but when there is a large bunch...screw everyone else using the road...as illustrated in pics posted on this forum...both cyclists and runners are just as bad as one another...

 

While cycling to Umhlanga a couple weeks back i had to actually go onto the oncoming traffic to pass the runners using the cycling lane...they should add a pic of runners to the cycling lane...to illustrate that the lane is for both runners and cyclist.

 

the best part is when the runners run against the traffic and there is no pavement or space for then to exit the road for cars.

[Sparki 1]

Runners must always give way to cyclist. Runners run against the flow of traffic, hence they can see vehicles approaching and when it's safe etc...This is what I do when I run. However, not all runners are cyclists and hence, when I see a runner approaching, I assume he/she is not a cyclist so I rather slow down and expect an egotistical a-hole approaching and sometimes even come to a complete stop. This way i know I will not get knocked from behind. For my own safety, I avoid routes frequented by runners.

[tubed]

I have run, ridden/ commuted and driven that route for more than 30 years - the volumes of users now just dictate we all respect each other and be considerate courteous

 

I dont see an immediate solution to the section from Llandudno to Bakoven.

 

Runners have a walkway behind the barrier on Suikerbossie - that should solve that part.

 

Many years ago a pedestrian track/ boardwalk was suggested below the road (similar to the Hermanus cliff path walk) - it never happened, neither did the long suggested offroad track linking Suikerbossie and Rontree - I see it is suggested again in the new Sanparks EMP out for comment - both of those ideas had the intention of removing some of the users from the road and putting them in safer areas.

Both of which would have been a world class addition to surely one of the most spectacular routes in the world.

 

I think the city and Sanparks now have much more pressing issues relating to commuters and this project would be seen as pandering to the privileged.

 

In my opinion the streetlights from the bottom of Suikerbossie to Llandudno could have been money far better spend on other aspects of that route.

[shaper]

Personally whether am running or cycling will always take control of the situation.  If am on my bike will always move out and join the traffic, I am moving faster and in the direction of the traffic.  I do not want to wait in the hope that the runner moves either way.

 

If am running, if I see no traffic will move out, otherwise will pull tight right to give room.

 

As a cyclist, going with the traffic flow, to move into traffic and back into yellow emergency lane takes milliseconds depending on your speed, so fail to see the issue.  Just because you happen to be cycling in the yellow does not make it your exclusive use.  If there had been a parked vehicle or road works or fallen tree you would move out without a thought.... it is how I treat runners as an obstacle and move accordingly and take control of the situation rather than leave it to others.

[Patchelicious]

Problem here in JHB too.

 

A few weeks ago, I was riding to to meet a few mates for a ride from Dunkeld.

I have to use Hans Schoeman St to get there.

 

For those that know it, its a 2 lane road.

 

Going down it, there was a running club (Roodepoort Running Club, I know because I stopped and asked the marshals) coming up it.

They were running 6-7 abreast taking up more than a whole lane, forcing me into the far right hand side of the right hand lane and into the traffic that was also trying to negotiate this all. It was group after group doing this, it wasnt a space thing and that were forced to run 6 abreast, as there was gaps between groups, it was a "lets chat thing."

 

When I commented "come on guys, please give some space", I was met with loud applause, chirping about my mother and my sexuality. Apparently lycra is only for the "moffies", this is news to me, why didnt anybody let me know of this before, swak on you guys!

 

Thing is, there were cars on the road too, and they happily moved out of the way for the cars. So its wasnt a fact that it wasnt possible or even midly difficult to do, it was simply "we wont move for moffie cyclists".

 

I had a similar incident with a group of motorcyclists in the cradle yesterday, a bad one. ( they ended up spitting on me and my wife after they cut us off twice) seems that when people are in a group they act like knobs when they outnumber the others.

 

Anyways, this shouldnt be turning into a "us and them" thing (many cyclists run and many runners cycle anyways), we all need to just give a little space to each other. Be considerate, its simple.

[lechatnoir]

I should have waited till Friday. My apologies!   

[Duane_Bosch]

I should have waited till Friday. My apologies!   

I was on that road on Saturday and there was a huge amount of runners on the road. I think it was a club training run from what I could make out.

 

Usually the runners I encounter on that road are aware and run in single file. Saturday was a bit different with runners running 3 & 4 abreast. But for me it wasn't a huge problem. I just had to stay a little more awake than usual. 

 

And in the grand scheme of things it's awesome to see so many people out doing their thing. Cycling. Running. Diving. Beaching. Coffee Shopping. Even the Harley boys were out in force.

[tubed]

I should have waited till Friday. My apologies!   

you should have added in some taxis (which also use this road now), the GP motorbikes, the walkers with ski poles, the hobos - then you could have had a real Friday mix

[Duane_Bosch]

you should have added in some taxis (which also use this road now), the GP motorbikes, the walkers with ski poles, the hobos - then you could have had a real Friday mix

That road is Raaaaaaaaaaaaaaaad on a fast bike.

[Bloukrans]

Runners or joggers

 

Real cyclists wear baggies

[eccc whippet]

What we should be doing is cyclist and runners joining to make one large voice to the municipalities...to create the change which is required...wider roads and lanes to accommodate both.

 

if they could build a taxi stop on a main highway (N2 Kawamashu) which now encourages pedestrians on the freeway...but the the law states no pedestrians allowed on a freeway.

 

which reminds me...cycling on the freeway...the M19 is clearly marked with freeway signs and all the signs are blue...yet there were more cyclist and runners on the M19 this weekend than I have ever seen...would have been interesting watching the cyclist clocking 100 down the hill with runners coming up the M19...must have something to do with the tour Durban and comrades coming up.

 

a note...the blue sign...green sign comments do not apply to Durban...the M 13 between kloof and hillcrest has blue signs...but it is not classified as a freeway...because there is a sign just before the hillcrest off ramp clearly indicating that the freeway starts just after the hillcrest off ramp...you need to look for the freeway signs.

[raptor-22]

I don' think it's strictly legal for runner to be runningin the service lane after bakoven. Its not a sidewalk and not intended even for pedestrians.

Cyclists by law should not be riding left of the yellow line but we do so for purposes of self preservation.

 

In all instances courtesy should always preside over moral high ground but the stretch from BAkoven to top of Suikerbossie is becoming really dangerous due to the number of running groups running in the service lane against the flow of traffic.

 

The real solution is motorists need to take care. But I can't see this happening until liability for accidents involving motorist cyclist and or runners/pedestrians is shifted to the motorist.

 

On the stretch of raod in question there is one speed camera so its regularly treated as 100km/hr zone especially by some pommie knob in a Audi Q7