Nutrition: 04:30 in the morning

[Malpiet]

Hi guys

 

So I do my training in the morning, before work meeting my mate @ 04:30 and getting home at about 06:30. This guarantees that I get my session done as work finish time is unpredictable.

 

I dont eat before these sessions so its all "Fasted state" recently Id have a small cup of black coffee before the ride.

 

Is this kind of riding ok, as I havent eaten before the ride? Is the back to back, probably 4 days a week of fasted riding recommended or OK??

 

I normally have supper latest @ 20h00 the night before

 

Thanks!

 

Mopkop

 

I do the exact same rides but twice a week, Sat rides are also fasted until we meet at a coffee shop +-40km into our ride for a quick cuppa. On the odd ride I use half n' High5 ZeroCal tab in a 500ml water (don't think it helps much but does add subtle flavor to the water)

 

I also try to have supper by 7:30 if its a heavy meal, but anything after 8 will have to be nibbly-bits like provita with cheese etc 

[Pure Savage]

All my rides tend to be fasted ones as am too buggered to eat in the morning. 

 

Also hopefully it helps with weight loss.

[s14phoenix]

Train harder ...

 

Ok but nutrition for and during training efforts? Sugars seem to be ok but is there something else I am missing? I use Game @ 2 flat scoops per 750ml.

[Malpiet]

for high intensity efforts you don't want low gi. You want it to be readily accessible by the body, which often means simple carbs unless you're fat adapted. And even then, sometimes for high intensity efforts you need those simple carbs for muscle glycogen replenishment. 

 

So, as with all things - it depends. 

 

All this low gi, high GL, low fat nonsense. 

 

High GI, Low GI is all relevant

 

Low fat on the other hand is irrelevant and should be avoided at all times!!

[J∆kk∆ls]

1 hour rides coffee without food and only water in the bottle. 

2 hour rides coffee with a banana with some mix in the bottle. 

3 hour + rides coffee with breakfast! 

[Captain Fastbastard Mayhem]

When do you okes sleep????? 

 

So what if you don't want to lose weight??? I am maybe lucky that I have very little excess but also struggling to up my power output and ave speed.

 

I don't see a lot on this topic as most is focussed on weight loss. What if you need to build additional muscle and no fat to burn? (and not the gym bunny kind of muscle)

 

Quite simply, you need to eat above your maintenance calorie requirement and train hard. Incorporate some sort of weights into it, as cycling alone won't build muscle to the same extent that a full training regimen will. 

 

That means squats, leg presses, deadlifts, calf raises, core work etc off the bike as well as intervals, HIIT & LISS on the bike. Don't discount the upper body stuff as well - a stronger body is always a good thing. Have a look at Nino Schurter & Emily Batty's training routines on youtube, and then Adam Brayton as well. Gym bunny muscle is still functional, if you do it right. And you don't get huge overnight - it's a long drawn out process. 

 

Essentially - eat more than your daily requirement, but not too much. It's a fine balance, and one that you will have to search for yourself - everyone's total daily calorie burn is different, but aim for 200-300 kcal more than you "need" per day. If you gain weight too fast, dial it back a bit. The better your training and the better your eating, the better your ratio of fat:muscle gains will be. 

 

Also - you NEED PROPER PROTEIN INTAKE. In order to maintain current levels of lean body mass, you'll need between 1.5 & 2g protein per kg of lean body mass. That means you need approx 2 - 2.5g per kg if you're looking to build. 

 

Oh - lean body mass = weight - (weight x bodyfat %)

 

So if you weigh 100 & have 25% body fat, your lean body mass is 100 - (100 x 0.25) = 75kg. Therefore protein = 2 to 2.5 X 75g per day. 

[Veebee]

Ok but nutrition for and during training efforts? Sugars seem to be ok but is there something else I am missing? I use Game @ 2 flat scoops per 750ml.

 

try some oats before a ride, or a rice cake and nutella if you feel the need for more energy.

A pre-ride banana and strong coffee will also give you a nice boost.

[jimmycool]

My strategy is 1 woolies stroop waffle and water as I am leaving the house and then a nice big glass of ice cold full cream milk for recovery as soon as I get home while I wait for the 2 eggs to cook.

[Captain Fastbastard Mayhem]

My strategy is 1 woolies stroop waffle and water as I am leaving the house and then a nice big glass of ice cold full cream milk for recovery as soon as I get home while I wait for the 2 eggs to cook.

oh goodness, those Stroopwafels are glorious!

 

You should try the way the Nederlanders do it... brew a fresh coffee, and stick it on top of the mug to warm up whilst the coffee cools down a bit. Almost melts teh stroop and makes it lekker warm... 

[jimmycool]

oh goodness, those Stroopwafels are glorious!

 

You should try the way the Nederlanders do it... brew a fresh coffee, and stick it on top of the mug to warm up whilst the coffee cools down a bit. Almost melts teh stroop and makes it lekker warm...

 

Oh yes, tell me about it. I spent 6 months in Holland (alas, before I started cycling) and I made my way through FAR too many stroop waffles in just that fashion.

 

I really like them cool and crispy though and making coffee in the morning causes too much of a disturbance in our house so I just grab a cold one and sneak out.

[V12man]

Is this kind of riding ok, as I havent eaten before the ride? Is the back to back, probably 4 days a week of fasted riding recommended or OK??

 

It's fine - just eat something immediately when you get home - doesn't really matter too much what it is as long as it has some carbs, some protein and some fat....  If you don't eat within about 20 - 30 minutes then recovery is somewhat affected.

 

 

 

Ive had this "Tummy bug" now twice in 2 weeks. First it was just The shitsZ and now theres nausea too.

Could this be training related?

Unlikely to be training related - unless you are eating supplements like whey protein/protein powders/meal replacement formulas (many people are sensitive to some supplements).

 

The other alternative for the nausea is that you are just hungry... eat immediately when you get home.

 

I would suggest adding a daily pro-biotic to your morning and evening meals - should help stabilize your gut flora - and that's not a bad thing - there are new studies showing the influence of your biome on performance that look promising.

[Patchelicious]

It's fine - just eat something immediately when you get home - doesn't really matter too much what it is as long as it has some carbs, some protein and some fat.... If you don't eat within about 20 - 30 minutes then recovery is somewhat affected.

 

Unlikely to be training related - unless you are eating supplements like whey protein/protein powders/meal replacement formulas (many people are sensitive to some supplements).

 

The other alternative for the nausea is that you are just hungry... eat immediately when you get home.

 

I would suggest adding a daily pro-biotic to your morning and evening meals - should help stabilize your gut flora - and that's not a bad thing - there are new studies showing the influence of your biome on performance that look promising.

What probiotic would you recommend?

[V12man]

What probiotic would you recommend?

Any 4 or more strain 1 will be fine - they are all fundamentally the same - except for the price tag... Dischem generic or Probiflora or similar will be fine

[New2tri]

This type of training is really good at relatively low intensity, 70-80% max HR.  The caffeine also helps promote energy use from fat stores.  

 

If you up the intensity you will fatigue yourself over time with this "bonk training", and will need to eat something before, during and especially after.  

 

Recovery is very important - you have a 40 minute window when you get off the bike to take in carbs and protein and your body to replenish depleted glycogen stores most efficiently, otherwise your body will metabolize muscle to do this, which you don't want.  Protein recovery shakes, eggs on toast, oats, choc steri-stumpie, cappacino whatever.

 

Also if you don't eat to recover, you will be starving later in the day and eat twice as much.

80% easy...damnnnn. If I go anywhere close to 80% I feel like I want to die if I haven't eaten anything. Early morning sessions under an hour I'm ok but anything over that or any session that requires me up my HR, I need fuel.

 

Guess this will differ from person to person though.

[Omumborombonga]

Dammit. Now I feel like waffles

[V12man]

80% easy...damnnnn. If I go anywhere close to 80% I feel like I want to die if I haven't eaten anything. Early morning sessions under an hour I'm ok but anything over that or any session that requires me up my HR, I need fuel.

 

Guess this will differ from person to person though.

Put a carb drink in your waterbottle and see how that changes...