Hairy Posted July 19, 2017 Posted July 19, 2017 People love to bitch and moan and oppose a development without even reading the EIA. Too much emotion and knee-jerk reaction.too many pages to read, would take actual effort to read, and most importantly, comprehend ...... better to just "ring all the alarm bells" and see where they dice fall. Edit .... font amended to comic sans
ChrisF Posted July 19, 2017 Posted July 19, 2017 Thanks what an entry to the forum. Very good advice. Welcome Sue At least you survived this thread ... can only get better from here. Schools, hospitals and services facilities should always be welcomed - at least that is my general approach.... shopping malls and the like are in way over supply .... and arguably could be considered for over use of our resources ..... now there is a can of worms ... just wait while I go get some fresh popcorn ....
Serious Panda Posted July 19, 2017 Posted July 19, 2017 What are you smoking?! New developments are a good opportunity to be more water efficient. Newer homes are far more water and energy efficient than homes built even 20 years ago. I would like to see rain water harvesting, solar geysers, proper insulation and grey water systems become mandatory going forward. It will be a time before regulations like SANS 10400 and SANS 241 catches up with the current situation in terms of energy and water use, but developers have a golden opportunity to build these mechanisms into new developments. I would also like to see a rebate system be put in place for people who have spent the money to install rainwater and grey water harvesting systems. I've spent R50k to date on rainwater and grey water harvesting, and if I can get (say) a 50% rebate, I would be able to improve my system to increase my storage capacity from 4000 lt to 9000 lt and be able to connect my rain water supply to my house water supply for everyday use (we will then have to buy drinking water, but it will be far cheaper than running a household of 6 people on municipal supply). Back on topic - Lets hope the school does get built, and that the developments in the area are greener than what is already in the area. What are you not smoking? it seems you need something to clear the head. You clearly do not understand the seriousness of the situation and the fact that more development = more water demand regardless of the implementation of your suggestions. You should go work for the DA.
GLuvsMtb Posted July 19, 2017 Posted July 19, 2017 What are you not smoking? it seems you need something to clear the head. You clearly do not understand the seriousness of the situation and the fact that more development = more water demand regardless of the implementation of your suggestions. You should go work for the DA.Do you truly think that people will simply not move to the WC if there are no houses? All you end up with is overcrowding of existing dwellings due to rising property prices / rent. Water use per capita will not drop as a result of a moratorium on development. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
Captain Fastbastard Mayhem Posted July 19, 2017 Posted July 19, 2017 Do you truly think that people will simply not move to the WC if there are no houses? All you end up with is overcrowding of existing dwellings due to rising property prices / rent. Water use per capita will not drop as a result of a moratorium on development. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk ProHe's yet to tell us what he thinks will save us from this situation. Just railing against all things which he determines as going against his esteemed opinion.
Hairy Posted July 19, 2017 Posted July 19, 2017 He's yet to tell us what he thinks will save us from this situation. Just railing against all things which he determines as going against his esteemed opinion.an idea .... develop, build infrastructure, good governance, etc in other major cities so that people do not want to leave their home towns / cities in search of "greener pastures" ... seeing as we are in a drought, let's call it "browner pastures".
Skubarra Posted July 19, 2017 Posted July 19, 2017 He's yet to tell us what he thinks will save us from this situation. Just railing against all things which he determines as going against his esteemed opinion. Also still wating for the source of the stats he is basing his esteemed opinion on, probably also just his esteemed opinion
Captain Fastbastard Mayhem Posted July 19, 2017 Posted July 19, 2017 Also still wating for the source of the stats he is basing his esteemed opinion on, probably also just his esteemed opinionNah. Prob just the stats from the city. Maybe.
Edition 507 Posted July 19, 2017 Posted July 19, 2017 Do you truly think that people will simply not move to the WC if there are no houses? All you end up with is overcrowding of existing dwellings due to rising property prices / rent. Water use per capita will not drop as a result of a moratorium on development. Development cannot be stopped, it needs to support population growth, and population growth will come from within CT itself as well, and not solely from migration. The problem CT is facing is one being faced by many other third world cities were finite resources are trying to sustain infinite population growth.
ChrisF Posted July 19, 2017 Posted July 19, 2017 What are you not smoking? it seems you need something to clear the head. You clearly do not understand the seriousness of the situation and the fact that more development = more water demand regardless of the implementation of your suggestions. You should go work for the DA. Okay, so you are serious ..... not just a knee jerk comment ..... So then give it some SERIOUS thought. 1) I dont even think there is an option to stop people moving around inside a country .... 2) LOTS that CAN be done, and SHOULD have been done !! Talking should have stopped months ago !! I get the impression the powers that be were actually counting on a wet season and that the problem will dissapear ... NO, it is not going away !! and it is MUCH worse than most want to hear. 3) So what CAN be done :- stop wasting water on gardens !- restrict water supply to high users - we are talking of a few minutes to fit a washer of a few cents .... this CAN and should have been done long ago- STOP filling swimming pools with municipal water (we have not used a single drop of municipal water since October for our pool - rain water harvesting)- Low flow shower heads is one of the easiest ways to save a LOT of water. (I stopped shaving in the shower, and this reduced my shower time by 60% !!)- dual flow toilet systems ........ these are the easy things ....4) Rain water harvesting to suppliment your usage .... novel idea, but costly and often not practical...... I want to use rain water to be the primary source for our toilets. Due to the way the house was built I can get to the pipes to split the supplies .... either a re-build of two bathrooms, new tiles etc, or run exposed pipes. Much easier to implement these in a new build. 5) Now for your main gripe - new developments - stop this ... and put how many people out of work ???????? New builds are IMPORTANT to keep the economic system ticking over .... Water usage, or rather dealing with the shortage, should be part of the building practices .... Waiting for the SANS codes to be updated is "silly" .... the process takes TOO LONG, and why adapt the NATIONAL standards for a local problem ? THIS is why we have By-Laws ... MUCH easier to update !! And should have been done already. 6) NONE of this addresses the real problem ! Well sort of not ... water wastage CAN and SHOULD be addressed by the former point. But the over population and shortage of water is a long lasting issue. The final answer(s) rests with -7) recycling water .... the technology and infrastructure EXISTS to treat effluent water, then pump it back to the dams, filter and treat again, and it is ready for re-use - as Windhoek has been doing for years ..... but this is not done as it clashes with some religeous beliefs .... 8) desalination .... MANY technological and financial challanges to this !! I do believe some companies have submitted tenders to do this and to sell water to the City ..... THIS may well be the long term answer ..... PROBLEM - I dont see this producing substantial quantities in the next year or two ..... leaving us with a VERY real problem in the short term. For those wondering what the hype is about - THIS is what Theewaterskloof looks like at the moment -
thisismyotherbike Posted July 19, 2017 Posted July 19, 2017 8) desalination .... MANY technological and financial challanges to this !! I do believe some companies have submitted tenders to do this and to sell water to the City ..... THIS may well be the long term answer ..... PROBLEM - I dont see this producing substantial quantities in the next year or two ..... leaving us with a VERY real problem in the short term. Well constructed response. Just lifted out 8) above to comment.... surely this is a simple supply/demand problem? Frankly, given the extent of the problem, water should be significantly more expensive in the Cape relative to the rest of the country? It isn't. You can try and fine/constrict the transgressors, but that policing is costly. Hike the price, the problem should start solving itself. Water saving measures (grey water capture, low flow shower heads etc etc) quickly become better value for money. The cost of water could even be so high as to make investment in desalination economically viable. Don't police, just charge a more representative price. That enables the free market to do its thing and find viable alternatives. Along with this you'd have to remove significant barriers that currently exist, including allowing the private sector to sell water via the public grid. Now the issue becomes more philosophical and inevitably more political.... Is water still a common good? Should access to water be de-democratised? Seeing as it is still being supplied to the impoverished for free, clearly society still sees it as a common good. Should the wealthy have total access to this resource purely because they are willing and able to pay what it is actually worth? I suppose we could start with every individual receiving enough water to reasonably survive, say 20L per day. From there the market sets the price. Government could still subsidise where it has special interests, but the current system where water remains unreasonably inexpensive and people are "asked" to reduce consumption on something that costs them so little is completely unsustainable in the long term.
ChrisF Posted July 19, 2017 Posted July 19, 2017 some pics of Theewaterskloof, taken on Sunday 16 July, AFTER all the rain .... The dam has been SO dry and low for so long that the sand has been blown from the dam onto the road....
ChrisF Posted July 19, 2017 Posted July 19, 2017 I have been taken photos from THIS vantage point for a few months - At its lowest point this is what Theewaterskloof looked like - After the various rains and storms we have had over the last months - Looking closer one notice that the ground is now saturated. The rivers feeding the dam is flowing, but stil SLOW. We need a LOT of rain ....
GLuvsMtb Posted July 19, 2017 Posted July 19, 2017 Do you truly think that people will simply not move to the WC if there are no houses? All you end up with is overcrowding of existing dwellings due to rising property prices / rent. Water use per capita will not drop as a result of a moratorium on development. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk ProTo add: COCT need the Bulk Infrastructure Contribution Levies developers pay to expand, upgrade and maintain Bulk Services. Its been a cash cow for the last 17 odd years and if this is withdrawn from the revenue stream, the increases in property rates and taxes will adversely affect property owners (much like government is reliant on sin tax for revenue). Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
Patchelicious Posted July 19, 2017 Posted July 19, 2017 What are you not smoking? it seems you need something to clear the head. You clearly do not understand the seriousness of the situation and the fact that more development = more water demand regardless of the implementation of your suggestions. You should go work for the DA.I'm not sure what you are getting upset about, at the rate that you are giving yourself ulcers you won't be around when all this devastation takes place.
Patchelicious Posted July 19, 2017 Posted July 19, 2017 He's yet to tell us what he thinks will save us from this situation. Just railing against all things which he determines as going against his esteemed opinion.He has yet to present any solution to any of the multitude of imminent disasters that's been ranted about, from Gordon's firing which was going to tank the rand immediately, to the ANC being to blame for the fact that it's not raining. I've long since given up trying to reason with him, now it's more a stress relief "chatting" to him. Hey, light bulb moment!!! What if the DA installed vertically mounted water pumps, would it solve the drought issue?
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