Gen Posted February 12, 2018 Share There in lies the rub. 5 Astana rider failed tests and nobody gets their panties in a knot. And then the Salbutamol reading gets compared to 5 guys taking banned/illegal substances.I recall plenty of us got our panties in a knot over the Astana thing..still don't get how they kept their WT license..oh wait I do.. money honey. Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patchelicious Posted February 12, 2018 Share I recall plenty of us got our panties in a knot over the Astana thing..still don't get how they kept their WT license..oh wait I do.. money honey. Sent from my SM-G950F using TapatalkJa Gen, to same degree as with Sky? If I had the time or energy and I did a Topic and post count on SKY vs Astana, you know which would come out on tops, by miles! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gen Posted February 12, 2018 Share Ja Gen, to same degree as with Sky? If I had the time or energy and I did a Topic and post count on SKY vs Astana, you know which would come out on tops, by miles!But her emails..[emoji6] Same with the dopers of past in any sport..the higher the profile the more publicity and discussion around it..and let's be honest there is nothing more the press like doing than building up an athlete to break them down.. We are still talking about it because the press have nothing else to do but write articles about it..Astana was covered in the media but not to the same extent that this has been covered... there was a big fuss and than nothing and more fuss when they got to keep their license and then nothing since. For instance.. My bother who only watches the TDF phoned me today to speak about Froome's situation...he doesn't cycle, he doesn't watch any other races...I doubt he even knows there is a team Astana.[emoji23][emoji23][emoji23] No one is talking about the Italian ammature team's doping why not.. it's getting coverage in Italy and one other English website wrote and article.. that's it nothing else... why because the English press are only interested in high profile athletes. Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patchelicious Posted February 12, 2018 Share Ja, it’s the press that’s kept this thread going. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gen Posted February 12, 2018 Share Ja, it’s the press that’s kept this thread going.This thread goes quiet and then there is an article and it gets going again. Keep in mind he will start his first race soon so there will be a lit more blah blah in the next few days Also if he is cleared will you yourself give snide comments like you do with Impey? ..I'm just asking seeing as we shoud treat every equal doesn't matter who they are.[emoji6][emoji6] Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patchelicious Posted February 12, 2018 Share This thread goes quiet and then there is an article and it gets going again. Keep in mind he will start his first race soon so there will be a lit more blah blah in the next few days Also if he is cleared will you yourself give snide comments like you do with Impey? ..I'm just asking seeing as we shoud treat every equal doesn't matter who they are.[emoji6][emoji6] Sent from my SM-G950F using TapatalkFirstly, I’m not on trial here, the burden of proof doesn’t lie with me. But to answer your question on the Impey comparison. It’s not about IF he gets cleared or not, but rather how. Not all clearings deserve the same treatment, just as all sanctions deserve the same treatment, these things are not binary. If Froome is credibly cleared by being able to replicate the stuff he needs to replicate and it’s done so credibly, then probably not. But if he is cleared with a questionable excuse, like he got Salbutamol into his system because his inhaler leaked onto his Preparation H, then of course he will get mocked. But it will be stupid on me to take a position on the outcome before we see the outcome. When I make comments about Impey, I’m not mocking him, I’m having a dig at people who are willing at accept questionable excuses because they have bias for the athlete. Hence me previously saying that Froome should just claim he got Salbutamol into his system by taking contaminated gelatin capsules, not because it’s plausible, but because people accepted that when Impey said it. Look cycling is inherently dirty, sports will always be, if Froome cheated then he must get what he deserves. No problem with that, that’s never been my problem. My problem is people who pretend to be impartial and to try and use flimsy arguments to justify an existing bias (positive or negative bias) for an athlete. Froome and SKY deserve to be under the microscope, but why can’t people just admit that much of it has got to do with a simple dislike for the guy or team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Velouria Posted February 12, 2018 Share There in lies the rub. 5 Astana rider failed tests and nobody gets their panties in a knot. And then the Salbutamol reading gets compared to 5 guys taking banned/illegal substances. Oh - and they share a doctor. But if we are comparing Salbutamol infractions, then surely Diego Ulissi is the template for cases like this. His team suspended him immediately, while saying that they would work with him to get to the bottom of the issue. When the UCI started dragging their feet, Lampre raced Ulissi in a one day race, which was enough for the UCI to immediately institute a disciplinary hearing. How long from the positive to the hearing? Three months. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave303e Posted February 12, 2018 Share Look cycling is particularly in the spotlight for being dirty, mainly because there are big sponsors and money involved and there is a lot at stake like selling bikes and gear etc as well as the prestige... Ask anyone about other sports, no one cares how many of the people who "climbed everest" did so only because of a lovely combo of Diamox, dexamethasone and viagra not to mention the hard work of the Sherpas... WADA also don't sit at everest testing people, but they do at cycling events, both are sports are they not? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gen Posted February 12, 2018 Share Firstly, I’m not on trial here, the burden of proof doesn’t lie with me. But to answer your question on the Impey comparison. It’s not about IF he gets cleared or not, but rather how. Not all clearings deserve the same treatment, just as all sanctions deserve the same treatment, these things are not binary. If Froome is credibly cleared by being able to replicate the stuff he needs to replicate and it’s done so credibly, then probably not. But if he is cleared with a questionable excuse, like he got Salbutamol into his system because his inhaler leaked onto his Preparation H, then of course he will get mocked. But it will be stupid on me to take a position on the outcome before we see the outcome. When I make comments about Impey, I’m not mocking him, I’m having a dig at people who are willing at accept questionable excuses because they have bias for the athlete. Hence me previously saying that Froome should just claim he got Salbutamol into his system by taking contaminated gelatin capsules, not because it’s plausible, but because people accepted that when Impey said it. Look cycling is inherently dirty, sports will always be, if Froome cheated then he must get what he deserves. No problem with that, that’s never been my problem. My problem is people who pretend to be impartial and to try and use flimsy arguments to justify an existing bias (positive or negative bias) for an athlete. Froome and SKY deserve to be under the microscope, but why can’t people just admit that much of it has got to do with a simple dislike for the guy or team.Lol..I get what you are saying I don't know.. I am not a big sky or Froome fan..Froome.grew on me last few years because he showed balls..so I don't dislike him the way I used to. But you keep on saying people should treat everyone the same..that will never happen..it's human nature to like and dislike people..I don't like GVA not because he has a history with a very dodgy Dr but for the way he races and is Sagan's rival.. yet I like Gilbert who also has a history with a dodge dr.. Same with Valverde and Bert I like the way they race and both have served suspensions.. go figure hey.. The bigger story however should be is that Quinatana lost the GC yesterday because he followed the wrong wheel???????????????? Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patchelicious Posted February 12, 2018 Share vino-froome-medals.png Oh - and they share a doctor. But if we are comparing Salbutamol infractions, then surely Diego Ulissi is the template for cases like this. His team suspended him immediately, while saying that they would work with him to get to the bottom of the issue. When the UCI started dragging their feet, Lampre raced Ulissi in a one day race, which was enough for the UCI to immediately institute a disciplinary hearing. How long from the positive to the hearing? Three months.Yes, and they deserve kudos for this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jewbacca Posted February 12, 2018 Share Isn't this similar to when Usain Bolt lost one of his Olympic gold medals because some dude in the 4x100m relay tested positive for some bla bla banned substance so the team was stripped? I mean, I remember Usain Bolt lost his medal, but for the life of me have no idea the dude who was caught. The press wrote about it from the Bolt perspective because he is the top of the food chain. Froomedawg IS the top of the Grande Tour food chain currently so it goes hand in hand with more clicks, more sold newspapers and more ching ching dolla Personally I see every single top rider, road or MTB as guilty of doping and when so and so gets caught it's a shame but not a train smash because, well, name me one top of the food chain bike rider (talking Olympic champ, grande tour or classics consistent performer/winner) who hasn't had a brush with or been incriminated in a doping scandal.... like 4 or 5 tops? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patchelicious Posted February 12, 2018 Share Lol..I get what you are saying I don't know.. I am not a big sky or Froome fan..Froome.grew on me last few years because he showed balls..so I don't dislike him the way I used to. But you keep on saying people should treat everyone the same..that will never happen..it's human nature to like and dislike people..I don't like GVA not because he has a history with a very dodgy Dr but for the way he races and is Sagan's rival.. yet I like Gilbert who also has a history with a dodge dr.. Same with Valverde and Bert I like the way they race and both have served suspensions.. go figure hey.. The bigger story however should be is that Quinatana lost the GC yesterday because he followed the wrong wheel Sent from my SM-G950F using TapatalkAbsolutely, I couldn't agree more. I have no issue with people disliking some people and liking others. Its ok to do this, whats not ok is claiming otherwise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gen Posted February 12, 2018 Share Look cycling is particularly in the spotlight for being dirty, mainly because there are big sponsors and money involved and there is a lot at stake like selling bikes and gear etc as well as the prestige... Ask anyone about other sports, no one cares how many of the people who "climbed everest" did so only because of a lovely combo of Diamox, dexamethasone and viagra not to mention the hard work of the Sherpas... WADA also don't sit at everest testing people, but they do at cycling events, both are sports are they not?Sponsors in cycling is nothing compared to some other sports . The stands will he full in PTA when Gaitlin takes to the start and the people will cheer him on..and he has served 2 bans and is once again under investigation. NFL players actually breath from oxygen tanks next to the field during a game and No one bats an eye. Wengers response to one of his players and a testing issue was..it was a bad day for a test.. Norwegain Olympic team has taken something like 6000 doses of asthma medication to the winter Olympics and then some other goodies too. Yet fans of those sports will say cyclist are all dopers..ag asseblief. No the more I seee the more I will say cycling is possibly one of the cleaner sports. Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rocket-Boy Posted February 12, 2018 Share Anyone know what Mr Froome was doing in SA last week?One of my directors who is a big fan bumped into him at the airport, they were on the same flight to the UK so she said hi. Apparently a very nice chap he is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patchelicious Posted February 12, 2018 Share Anyone know what Mr Froome was doing in SA last week?One of my directors who is a big fan bumped into him at the airport, they were on the same flight to the UK so she said hi. Apparently a very nice chap he is.He was here for a while training. He has a house in SteynCity. When I say training, I think they were actually trying to replicate the Vuelta test findings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milosh Posted February 12, 2018 Share Sponsors in cycling is nothing compared to some other sports . The stands will he full in PTA when Gaitlin takes to the start and the people will cheer him on..and he has served 2 bans and is once again under investigation. NFL players actually breath from oxygen tanks next to the field during a game and No one bats an eye. Wengers response to one of his players and a testing issue was..it was a bad day for a test.. Norwegain Olympic team has taken something like 6000 doses of asthma medication to the winter Olympics and then some other goodies too. Yet fans of those sports will say cyclist are all dopers..ag asseblief. No the more I seee the more I will say cycling is possibly one of the cleaner sports. Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk 6000 doses is 30 inhalers with 200 doses each , so depending on size of team not awfully high Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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