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Accident in the cradle.


FreeSoul

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Sorry but I'm with MTB dude on this one.

 

It was stated very early on by people that were there that the truck driver did not behave inconsiderately or dangerous, yet because a cyclist went down the driver is to blame.

 

do yourself a favour and drive a large truck for a day. The guy has a job to do, from what I understand he was courteous in his actions.

Yes the road were not designed for large trucks there, but his boss gave him orders and he executed them in the best way he could.

 

And then back to the laws.

Who give a flying F___ what the law says, physics rules here. So dont ride like a chop, be aware that you dont own the road (even in the cradle), motorists hate us and that when **** happens you will more than likely be the one to come off second best.

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It's simply not safe to have trucks bicycles going through that section of road during that time on a Saturday as there is no cycle lane. Those roads where in fact built not as a transport corridor, but to serve the tourism needs of the cradle world heritage site.

 

 

Fixed. 

 

 I doubt that the Bicycle riders in this conversation are visiting any of the Tourist sites either

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Could this not maybe have been an accident like the title suggest?

 

 

 

No, The truck driver intentionally drove his truck in the middle of the road.

 

EDIT: Note the Italics for Sarcasm 

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Fixed. 

 

 I doubt that the Bicycle riders in this conversation are visiting any of the Tourist sites either

 

The whole cradle is the tourism site.

 

"The Cradle of Humankind World Heritage Site (COH WHS) is a geospatial tourism project in Gauteng covering an area of 52 000 hectares in the north west of Gauteng Province, with 10% extending into North West Province. It extends across approximately 30 farms, many of which have been sub-divided, in the north western quadrant of Gauteng.

 

Considering the unique environment, the World Heritage Status of the area and the restriction on further development apart from limited tourism development it was concluded that the identified CoHWHS sensitive roads can be treated differently to any other rural provincial road. The Road network that was considered as sensitive consisted of: D1701, D540, D374 and D101 which also formed the proposed cycle route."

 

https://repository.up.ac.za/bitstream/handle/2263/45550/Gusha_Implementation_2014.pdf?sequence=1&isAllowed=y

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It is astonishing that, even when there were Hubber there, who clearly saw what happened, and clearly described exactly what they saw, we still make up our own minds based on selective reasoning and imagination.

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Sorry but I'm with MTB dude on this one.

 

It was stated very early on by people that were there that the truck driver did not behave inconsiderately or dangerous, yet because a cyclist went down the driver is to blame.

 

do yourself a favour and drive a large truck for a day. The guy has a job to do, from what I understand he was courteous in his actions.

Yes the road were not designed for large trucks there, but his boss gave him orders and he executed them in the best way he could.

 

And then back to the laws.

Who give a flying F___ what the law says, physics rules here. So dont ride like a chop, be aware that you dont own the road (even in the cradle), motorists hate us and that when **** happens you will more than likely be the one to come off second best.

 

I am not saying the truck driver did anything on purpose.  I am not saying he was not courteous and it was from the beginning clear he was cautions as well.  But as Patch said there are many factors that came together here and if you look at the little information we have on the thread here, it could have been avoided if maybe waited a few seconds.  My issue cam with as you say MTB dude who immediately put blame on the cyclists and the way he stated it.  There are many facts still missing here even if Hubbers were present.  Yes there was enough space when the truck started his overtaking but then things went wrong.  Had there not been oncomming traffic at all maybe there would have been more space for the truck to move out to the right as things started going pear shaped for the cyclists.

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Terrible accident and I really hope the cyclist is back on his bike riding like before (if not better).

 

Also hope that the truck drivers is okay and doesn't live with guilt for just doing his job..

 

if the truck driver was at fault, I am sure he would have had hell to pay for when the cyclist pulled him off the road..

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It is astonishing that, even when there were Hubber there, who clearly saw what happened, and clearly described exactly what they saw, we still make up our own minds based on selective reasoning and imagination. AND HEARSAY

Fixed.  

 

I find it interesting that many who say that they heard from friends or colleagues of this and that and now start spouting opinion as facts and law, when in fact they were not there and did not see.

 

I was less than 2-3m away from Victors rear wheel so saw clearly what happened. A few seconds later I would have been right on his rear wheel, fortunately for me I was not and had enough time to break/skid and miss the wheel clipping and crashes.  

 

As to what transpired at the front of the group I cannot say, maybe the call for single file in the short term pushed the group to 3 abreast and is why some of the group moved left, causing the chain of events .... all I do know is that the breaking caused guys at the back of the group to ride into each other, some going down, some bailing into the bushes, unfortunately Victor loosing control and swerving right into the path of the truck.  A sight and sound I will not forget quickly.

 

As for the rights and wrongs of the road, there is a wide yellow lane on both sides of the road, the driver of the truck pulled out to the middle of the road to pass the group, there was plenty of room for everyone. 

 

If I had been the driver of the truck, I would have driven in the same manner, there was no on-coming traffic, just regular groups of cyclist going up and down to the cave as there always is.

 

I have not heard if the driver has been charged with anything, I would be surprised if he was.

 

My thoughts are not of who was right or wrong, but on Victor making a full recovery and being able to ride with his friends again!

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Group riding is risky - we all know this. Trying to dissect decisions that were made in split seconds at (probably) high speeds is not doing anyone any good. 

 

The lesson here is to lets all be extra careful moving forward as there is a lot of construction happening in the Cradle at present, and maybe ride in smaller groups that are more predictable. 

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In all honesty, I find the Cradle becoming more and more dangerous.

 

There are a lot more Runners, Novice cyclist and Younger riders ridding in the Cradle

 

... and they are all there for the same reason we are ... Tranquility, Safety (slight contradiction there... saying it's dangerous and safe at the same time... aka Oxymoron for the language Nazis out there ;) )  

 

However the runners are running in the bike lanes...(as far as i know they aren't aloud to do this) forcing the cyclist to ride in the road, which is illegal (7)        Whenever a portion of a public road has been set aside for use by persons riding pedal cycles, no person shall ride a pedal cycle on any other portion of such road.

 

At some point a runner will be hit in the bike lane by a cyclist and then there will be a **** load said about how bad cyclist are on TrailHub or www.time-to-run.co.za.

 

Even on the newly finished MTB trails I have almost hit pedestrians walking to work and MTBikers riding the route in reverse...

 

 

Please be careful out there...

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I am not saying the truck driver did anything on purpose.  I am not saying he was not courteous and it was from the beginning clear he was cautions as well.  But as Patch said there are many factors that came together here and if you look at the little information we have on the thread here, it could have been avoided if maybe waited a few seconds.  My issue cam with as you say MTB dude who immediately put blame on the cyclists and the way he stated it.  There are many facts still missing here even if Hubbers were present.  Yes there was enough space when the truck started his overtaking but then things went wrong.  Had there not been oncomming traffic at all maybe there would have been more space for the truck to move out to the right as things started going pear shaped for the cyclists.

That is because the general consensus among cyclists is that we have done nothing wrong, where as its been witnessed and pointed out numerous times that when there is a group riding there will be individuals who ride as if they are immune to the laws of physics.

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Regardless of the accident and the matter at hand

 

Single file and indicate your intention by hand gesture if possible or shouting it in case of emergency action, is the rules. If that basic principles were not followed then you need to take responsibility for your own actions and cant blame a truck when it is where it was supposed to be.

 

The fact that the group (and this has been confirmed by everyone who saw it) was riding up to 3 abreast and then trying to get single file, causing the accident, clearly indicates that the group should have been better disciplined and rode single file 1. for their safety and 2. because its the law

 

Should they have abide by the rules as it was there was no reason for any braking or scurrying to get single file and the accident could/would have been avoided completely.

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In all honesty, I find the Cradle becoming more and more dangerous.

 

There are a lot more Runners, Novice cyclist and Younger riders ridding in the Cradle

 

... and they are all there for the same reason we are ... Tranquility, Safety (slight contradiction there... saying it's dangerous and safe at the same time... aka Oxymoron for the language Nazis out there ;) )  

 

However the runners are running in the bike lanes...(as far as i know they aren't aloud to do this) forcing the cyclist to ride in the road, which is illegal (7)        Whenever a portion of a public road has been set aside for use by persons riding pedal cycles, no person shall ride a pedal cycle on any other portion of such road.

 

At some point a runner will be hit in the bike lane by a cyclist and then there will be a **** load said about how bad cyclist are on TrailHub or www.time-to-run.co.za.

 

Even on the newly finished MTB trails I have almost hit pedestrians walking to work and MTBikers riding the route in reverse...

 

 

Please be careful out there...

I was wondering about this. The chances are very good for this to happen. I nearly hit a guy already.

 

A cyclist moving at 40 kmh is going to do a lot of damage to a runner. Never mind to himself.

 

I definitely think the amount of runners have increased and there was an event through there on Saturday as well, as there were big bunches of runners. 

 

I have seen trail runners using the MTB trail running in the opposite direction as well. It make a great trail.

 

The cradle is becoming a victim of its own success and TBH i think its going to need some sort of regulation soon especially on Saturday mornings - I was thinking about thi. Possibly get people to ride in one direction and runners to run in the same direction so they are on the other side of the road?

 

Complete closure for 2 Saturdays a month except for residents?

 

Just some ideas.....

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Regardless of the accident and the matter at hand

 

Single file and indicate your intention by hand gesture if possible or shouting it in case of emergency action, is the rules. If that basic principles were not followed then you need to take responsibility for your own actions and cant blame a truck when it is where it was supposed to be.

 

The fact that the group (and this has been confirmed by everyone who saw it) was riding up to 3 abreast and then trying to get single file, causing the accident, clearly indicates that the group should have been better disciplined and rode single file 1. for their safety and 2. because its the law

 

Should they have abide by the rules as it was there was no reason for any breaking or scurrying to get single file and the accident could/would have been avoided completely.

 

Says regardless of the accident, but then goes on to discuss said accident... Not sure if serious. Oh, and

 

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-zknYzUsI7yc/TlzqdT6jkRI/AAAAAAAAAVc/HvSEwU0xZ8c/s320/Beating+the+dead+horse.jpg

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I was less than 2-3m away from Victors rear wheel 

 

My thoughts are not of who was right or wrong, but on Victor making a full recovery and being able to ride with his friends again!

 

NOTE: Italics as I am being sarcastic

 

Was it 2m or 3m... please only state the facts or they could be mist-rued as opinion ;)

 

NOTE: No Italics as I am stating some facts

At 3m behind you would have to be doing less than 5.4km/h  order for you to maintain a safe following distance of 2 seconds. (at 2m behind you would have to be doing 3.6km/h or less) ... and that's a Fact!!! ... you can check the maths ;)

 

NOTE: Italics as I am being sarcastic

 

My opinion is that you were going faster.... if you were going slower you might at well have stayed in bed.

 

I am not trying to 'dis' you are anyone else in the group,I just picked your post in order to do some maths on the following distance and speed ,  I am however trying to highlight that WE put ourselves in Un-safe conditions and then try to pass the blame to someone else when things go wrong...

 

2 more things...

1. I am glad that you were able to control you bike in the skid and came out unscathed ,

2. I couldn't agree more with your last statement "but on Victor making a full recovery and being able to ride with his friends again!"

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Regardless of the accident and the matter at hand

 

Single file and indicate your intention by hand gesture if possible or shouting it in case of emergency action, is the rules. If that basic principles were not followed then you need to take responsibility for your own actions and cant blame a truck when it is where he was supposed to be.

 

The fact that the group (and this has been confirmed by everyone who saw it) was riding up to 3 abreast and then trying to get single file, causing the accident, clearly indicates that the group should have been better disciplined and rode single file 1. for their safety and 2. because its the law

 

Should they have abide by the rules as it was there was no reason for any breaking or scurrying to get single file and the accident could/would have been avoided completely.

So Hein, congrats on pointing out the law. 

 

 

Clearly you have done your fair share of road cycling at the Cradle, you know the infrastructure and understand the dynamics of riding in a group on the road. So what have you found works well when Marshaling a club ride of 50 people or more while keeping everybody safe?

 

Keeping in mind:

- Inexperienced riders all over the road

- Emergency situations, ie: You have dogs and warthogs walking side-by-side and sometimes crossing the road (saw it with my own eyes)

- Runners on the cycle lanes

 

 

Remember, people will stop going there if they need to sit single file all the way through a 30km loop.

 

So maybe we should just stop cycling on the road and convince people to MTB more, aw snap... that was your plan all along...

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