Do I upgrade to 1x46 or 1x50

[Dicky DQ]

 In what world is going from XT to NX an upgrade..

 

In the real world, but maybe XT is ok, But for XTR to NX it is an upgrade for sure.

[Dicky DQ]

My derailleur will be able to handle the 50t sunrace cassette. dont want to go with a 32t in front, dont want to loose topend. 

Is is Shimano? if so do not believe them.

[Dicky DQ]

MUCH better spacing. Gosh, Shimano got that 11sp cassette horribly wrong. 

He was referring to 50 vs 46, 46 spacing is better than the 50.

[Captain Fastbastard Mayhem]

if 11-46, go for the Sunrace not the XT. The Sunrace is better spaced at the top

 

 

MUCH better spacing. Gosh, Shimano got that 11sp cassette horribly wrong. 

 

 

He was referring to 50 vs 46, 46 spacing is better than the 50.

errrrr.... no he wasn't. The shimano 11sp 11-46 has a horrid 9t gap from 2 to 1. Goes 37-46. Sunrace, however, goes 40-46 from 2 to 1. It's a noticeable change and improvement on shimano's horrid 11sp 11-46

 

Sunrace 11-50 has a 42-50 8t gap. Even a 4t difference can't make it worse than the shimano. 

Edited February 21, 2019 by Captain Fatbastard Mayhem

[DieselnDust]

aaaaaaaahhhhhh Shimano 11s MTB,

the 10speed system with the granny moved to the cassette

[CdT85]

I am currently running a 34T oval NW, paired with a sunrace mx80 11-50 cassette, XT M8000 shifter and SLX M7000 GS RD.

 

Works like a charm and no issues with shifting.

 

Spin out at about 44km/h, and yet to find the climb where I cant climb.

 

Ran a 32T round NW on a 11-42 cassette. Climbing wasnt an issue just got annoyed with spinning out on the flat sections.

[Sbloomer]

For the average joe that rides with his bike from home to the trails, rides the trails up and down and back home again past the coffee shop, I don't see why a 1x system is optimal. Sure it's the current trend and eagle is all the rage now, but a 2x setup with something like a 28/38 crankset and a 11/42 cassette will cover you at the top end as well as when the climbing gets rough.  

 

Exactly... And I paid a hefty price falling for the hype (led by a bike shop looking for a fast buck).  In fact I'm considering cutting my losses and looking for someone who wants to swap...

[matthieup]

Exactly... And I paid a hefty price falling for the hype (led by a bike shop looking for a fast buck).  In fact I'm considering cutting my losses and looking for someone who wants to swap...

 

I actually took my bike in today to put back my 2x11 for the Argus. I'll keep it a bit longer and see how i feel about it on the trails.

I have to be honest, I like only having 1 shifter

[Wimmas]

This trade-off between spinning out and having sufficient gears to climb every mountain is a perennial problem and one the industry is sure to address with an innovative approach.

 

I suspect someone will come up with a product that will allow you to have two chainrings up front (!), say a 38 and a 26, with the ability to change between them whilst riding.

 

On down, flat or gently undulating terrain you could shift onto the "big ring" and never spin out and on the uphill you drop onto the "inner ring" and climb to your heart's content.

 

If it were me, I'd call it "2x" (pronounced two by) and have 10 or 11 closely spaced cogs on the cassette covering say 11-34.

 

Watch this space, it is sure to come....

Huh? My bike is standard a 2x11, 11 - 42 so it is already in existence. Nothing new. I prefer a 2x system.

 

Sent from my WAS-LX1 using Tapatalk

[Sbloomer]

Sarcasm not your strong point   

 

Huh? My bike is standard a 2x11, 11 - 42 so it is already in existence. Nothing new. I prefer a 2x system.

 

[JBK]

I'm loving this thread...

 

I'm still riding 2x10 (11-36) with 24/38 at the front on both my bike and my wife's.

 

I still believe this to the best option out there - quite a statement that, I know.!

 

2x11 offers nothing extra and just adds weight - there's a hefty increase in mass from a 11-36 to a 11-42 / 11-46 cassette. 2x11 bikes increase the small ring from 24 to either 26 or 28 (more added weight), simply 'because you can' because of the larger sprockets at the back so you just land up with hefty duplication of gear ratios that are almost identical.

 

1x11 IMO was a complete waste of time and I cringe when I see new bikes in the shop coming with this gearing - today, these are generally middle range bikes and the poor guy/gal is going to be seriously unhappy very soon and have to change. They come with tiny front chain rings so you have no top-end at all. It was a marketing gimmick for bike manufacturers to offer 'less for more'. Almost everyone I know on this gearing is/was unhappy, even my mates who are really strong as they take on tougher challenges and need more range. Almost everyone I know who bought new top end bikes 2 years ago with 1x11 XTR have changed either to 2x11 or 1x12 beacuse 1x11 just didn't "cover all bases".  

 

1x12 finally bridged the gap on gear ratio range from 2x10, however, only with the 10-50 cassette - be careful of NX as this is only 11-50 which might sound like nothing but you lose massive top-end. With 34/10 your ratio is 3.4 but with 34/11 it is 3.09 - so you lose a massive 10%.

 

On my 2x10 I have a range of 3.46 down to 0.67, almost identical to a 1x12 setup (10-50) with 34 front which will give you 3.4 down to 0.68 obviously with larger jumps between ratios. However, I still have slightly more on the top side. I have mates on 1x12 10-50 now wanting to change their front from 34 to 36 to get more on the top side but on tougher races they'll have to change back to the 34 or suffer.

 

Furthermore, the prices of SRAM 1x12 is simply obscene - I mean talk about "milking a market"..! I can buy 6 brand new 10 SPD XT 11-36 cassettes for the same price as ONE XO1 10-50 cassette - and that's XO, not even the XX1 as I'm comparing XT not XTR.

 

Even better, there are so many people falling for the very successful marketing of 1x12 and selling off their "brand new and never used" spares that I can buy new 11-36 cassettes for less than half the price online (so 12 new cassettes for the price of 1 XO1 12spd)

 

I hear the argument that its "nice to have 1x" and the ridiculous statement that "1x gives me a nice clean cockpit" (I mean really..!!! This is a MTB ffs) but in the last few weeks I've demo'd a bike with 1x and going back to my 2x does not feel archaic, instead it feels just as natural.

 

My 2c worth...

[Chingy182]

I am currently running 34 front and 1x42 at back. Not struggling to much on climbs,but sometimes I need a bit more help. Do I upgrade to 11x46 or 11x50?

Hi Eben

 

I run Exactly the same setup. 34-oval though.

 

I do just fine and enjoy that I actually use all of my gears, but I feel if my fitness drops just 5% then it can turn to torture.

 

I, previously, had the 50t cassette and the last two cogs were 42t then 50t.

I can tell you this much, 50t was as granny as granny could be for me.

I had absolutely zero traction and found it utterly useless on gravel climbs.

[DieselnDust]

I'm loving this thread...

 

I'm still riding 2x10 (11-36) with 24/38 at the front on both my bike and my wife's.

 

I still believe this to the best option out there - quite a statement that, I know.!

 

2x11 offers nothing extra and just adds weight - there's a hefty increase in mass from a 11-36 to a 11-42 / 11-46 cassette. 2x11 bikes increase the small ring from 24 to either 26 or 28 (more added weight), simply 'because you can' because of the larger sprockets at the back so you just land up with hefty duplication of gear ratios that are almost identical.

 

1x11 IMO was a complete waste of time and I cringe when I see new bikes in the shop coming with this gearing - today, these are generally middle range bikes and the poor guy/gal is going to be seriously unhappy very soon and have to change. They come with tiny front chain rings so you have no top-end at all. It was a marketing gimmick for bike manufacturers to offer 'less for more'. Almost everyone I know on this gearing is/was unhappy, even my mates who are really strong as they take on tougher challenges and need more range. Almost everyone I know who bought new top end bikes 2 years ago with 1x11 XTR have changed either to 2x11 or 1x12 beacuse 1x11 just didn't "cover all bases".  

 

1x12 finally bridged the gap on gear ratio range from 2x10, however, only with the 10-50 cassette - be careful of NX as this is only 11-50 which might sound like nothing but you lose massive top-end. With 34/10 your ratio is 3.4 but with 34/11 it is 3.09 - so you lose a massive 10%.

 

On my 2x10 I have a range of 3.46 down to 0.67, almost identical to a 1x12 setup (10-50) with 34 front which will give you 3.4 down to 0.68 obviously with larger jumps between ratios. However, I still have slightly more on the top side. I have mates on 1x12 10-50 now wanting to change their front from 34 to 36 to get more on the top side but on tougher races they'll have to change back to the 34 or suffer.

 

Furthermore, the prices of SRAM 1x12 is simply obscene - I mean talk about "milking a market"..! I can buy 6 brand new 10 SPD XT 11-36 cassettes for the same price as ONE XO1 10-50 cassette - and that's XO, not even the XX1 as I'm comparing XT not XTR.

 

Even better, there are so many people falling for the very successful marketing of 1x12 and selling off their "brand new and never used" spares that I can buy new 11-36 cassettes for less than half the price online (so 12 new cassettes for the price of 1 XO1 12spd)

 

I hear the argument that its "nice to have 1x" and the ridiculous statement that "1x gives me a nice clean cockpit" (I mean really..!!! This is a MTB ffs) but in the last few weeks I've demo'd a bike with 1x and going back to my 2x does not feel archaic, instead it feels just as natural.

 

My 2c worth...

 

 

 

I see you live in Sandton,.....Come talk to me about 1x when you get to some real MTB trails...

I'm not knocking your choice of 2x10 - it was a great system and as far as I'm concerned its great but when it came out, the same people were ranting and raving about how great 3x8 was and why did we ever need to change. 

The 1x11 step was probably a misstep but It workd great and I never relaly had a problem with the gearing range. 1x12 just gave me a better spread - yes that's called progress. 

So why 1x12 instead of 2x10?

Well for starts the front derailleur limits the width of the BB and requires the seat tube to be designed in a manner that compromises its strength (with 29er bikes). On Some bikes the 2x10 didn't cause too many compromises that the rider disliked but it didn't take a rocket scientist to realise that there was a better way. People who had been riding 1x9, 1x10 and 1x11 (including product marketers and engineers) all realised that there was something to be said for the simplicity.

I still don;t think 2x or 3x is a better system. So many duplicated gears, broken chains and rapidly wearing drivetrains ( i think we have forgotten that a cassette only lasted 2000-3000km in those days and a chain 500-1000km)

 

SRAM NX Eagle is an entry level 12 speed groupset. It's unlikely that the person targeting that purchase is going to be too fussed about topend speed.

[scubes]

You make excellent points and I agree with all of them. Very interesting thread.

 

For me (an amateur MTB trail rider with a day job) I have a 1x11 setup on a 27.5 MTB with a 34 blade upfront and 11-50 on the back. This works for me, a mix of Sram GX and NX and Sunrace.

 

Compared to a 29er with a 1x12 setup and a 32 blade and a 10-50 cassette  - I can climb with the same ease and I lose a bit on the top end which doesn't bother me at all.

 

Compared to your setup (2x10 with 24/38 and 11-36) I can climb with more ease yet you do of course have a higher top end speed available to you. 

 

What will the future hold?

 

I'm loving this thread...

 

I'm still riding 2x10 (11-36) with 24/38 at the front on both my bike and my wife's.

 

I still believe this to the best option out there - quite a statement that, I know.!

 

2x11 offers nothing extra and just adds weight - there's a hefty increase in mass from a 11-36 to a 11-42 / 11-46 cassette. 2x11 bikes increase the small ring from 24 to either 26 or 28 (more added weight), simply 'because you can' because of the larger sprockets at the back so you just land up with hefty duplication of gear ratios that are almost identical.

 

1x11 IMO was a complete waste of time and I cringe when I see new bikes in the shop coming with this gearing - today, these are generally middle range bikes and the poor guy/gal is going to be seriously unhappy very soon and have to change. They come with tiny front chain rings so you have no top-end at all. It was a marketing gimmick for bike manufacturers to offer 'less for more'. Almost everyone I know on this gearing is/was unhappy, even my mates who are really strong as they take on tougher challenges and need more range. Almost everyone I know who bought new top end bikes 2 years ago with 1x11 XTR have changed either to 2x11 or 1x12 beacuse 1x11 just didn't "cover all bases".  

 

1x12 finally bridged the gap on gear ratio range from 2x10, however, only with the 10-50 cassette - be careful of NX as this is only 11-50 which might sound like nothing but you lose massive top-end. With 34/10 your ratio is 3.4 but with 34/11 it is 3.09 - so you lose a massive 10%.

 

On my 2x10 I have a range of 3.46 down to 0.67, almost identical to a 1x12 setup (10-50) with 34 front which will give you 3.4 down to 0.68 obviously with larger jumps between ratios. However, I still have slightly more on the top side. I have mates on 1x12 10-50 now wanting to change their front from 34 to 36 to get more on the top side but on tougher races they'll have to change back to the 34 or suffer.

 

Furthermore, the prices of SRAM 1x12 is simply obscene - I mean talk about "milking a market"..! I can buy 6 brand new 10 SPD XT 11-36 cassettes for the same price as ONE XO1 10-50 cassette - and that's XO, not even the XX1 as I'm comparing XT not XTR.

 

Even better, there are so many people falling for the very successful marketing of 1x12 and selling off their "brand new and never used" spares that I can buy new 11-36 cassettes for less than half the price online (so 12 new cassettes for the price of 1 XO1 12spd)

 

I hear the argument that its "nice to have 1x" and the ridiculous statement that "1x gives me a nice clean cockpit" (I mean really..!!! This is a MTB ffs) but in the last few weeks I've demo'd a bike with 1x and going back to my 2x does not feel archaic, instead it feels just as natural.

 

My 2c worth...

[Li Mu Bai]

I'm loving this thread...

 

I'm still riding 2x10 (11-36) with 24/38 at the front on both my bike and my wife's.

 

I still believe this to the best option out there - quite a statement that, I know.!

 

2x11 offers nothing extra and just adds weight - there's a hefty increase in mass from a 11-36 to a 11-42 / 11-46 cassette. 2x11 bikes increase the small ring from 24 to either 26 or 28 (more added weight), simply 'because you can' because of the larger sprockets at the back so you just land up with hefty duplication of gear ratios that are almost identical.

 

1x11 IMO was a complete waste of time and I cringe when I see new bikes in the shop coming with this gearing - today, these are generally middle range bikes and the poor guy/gal is going to be seriously unhappy very soon and have to change. They come with tiny front chain rings so you have no top-end at all. It was a marketing gimmick for bike manufacturers to offer 'less for more'. Almost everyone I know on this gearing is/was unhappy, even my mates who are really strong as they take on tougher challenges and need more range. Almost everyone I know who bought new top end bikes 2 years ago with 1x11 XTR have changed either to 2x11 or 1x12 beacuse 1x11 just didn't "cover all bases".  

 

1x12 finally bridged the gap on gear ratio range from 2x10, however, only with the 10-50 cassette - be careful of NX as this is only 11-50 which might sound like nothing but you lose massive top-end. With 34/10 your ratio is 3.4 but with 34/11 it is 3.09 - so you lose a massive 10%.

 

On my 2x10 I have a range of 3.46 down to 0.67, almost identical to a 1x12 setup (10-50) with 34 front which will give you 3.4 down to 0.68 obviously with larger jumps between ratios. However, I still have slightly more on the top side. I have mates on 1x12 10-50 now wanting to change their front from 34 to 36 to get more on the top side but on tougher races they'll have to change back to the 34 or suffer.

 

Furthermore, the prices of SRAM 1x12 is simply obscene - I mean talk about "milking a market"..! I can buy 6 brand new 10 SPD XT 11-36 cassettes for the same price as ONE XO1 10-50 cassette - and that's XO, not even the XX1 as I'm comparing XT not XTR.

 

Even better, there are so many people falling for the very successful marketing of 1x12 and selling off their "brand new and never used" spares that I can buy new 11-36 cassettes for less than half the price online (so 12 new cassettes for the price of 1 XO1 12spd)

 

I hear the argument that its "nice to have 1x" and the ridiculous statement that "1x gives me a nice clean cockpit" (I mean really..!!! This is a MTB ffs) but in the last few weeks I've demo'd a bike with 1x and going back to my 2x does not feel archaic, instead it feels just as natural.

 

My 2c worth...

2x if fine till you do that one muddy rainy race and 3 hours in the chainsuck starts to drive you dilly...

 

1x11 isnt so bad really, a 34 11/46 got me up and over Spionkop / Mikes pass just fine.. however when my partner got into his 10 he did start drifting ahead of me in my 11 on the flat grinds, so the difference is noticible

1x is horses for courses - you should match the chainring to the terrain conditions. 32 for hills, 34 flatter. getting the balance right is always tricky.

a 34-10/50 covers most eventualities.

Srams prices are stupid. But comes from their monopoly on the industry and their successful blocking of Sram purchases from international stores. As SA's market is so small, Sram dont really care if the distributor her adds on a nice fat unchallenged markup.

Edited February 22, 2019 by Li Mu Bai

[greg_sa]

I see you live in Sandton,.....Come talk to me about 1x when you get to some real MTB trails...

I'm not knocking your choice of 2x10 - it was a great system and as far as I'm concerned its great but when it came out, the same people were ranting and raving about how great 3x8 was and why did we ever need to change. 

The 1x11 step was probably a misstep but It workd great and I never relaly had a problem with the gearing range. 1x12 just gave me a better spread - yes that's called progress. 

So why 1x12 instead of 2x10?

Well for starts the front derailleur limits the width of the BB and requires the seat tube to be designed in a manner that compromises its strength (with 29er bikes). On Some bikes the 2x10 didn't cause too many compromises that the rider disliked but it didn't take a rocket scientist to realise that there was a better way. People who had been riding 1x9, 1x10 and 1x11 (including product marketers and engineers) all realised that there was something to be said for the simplicity.

I still don;t think 2x or 3x is a better system. So many duplicated gears, broken chains and rapidly wearing drivetrains ( i think we have forgotten that a cassette only lasted 2000-3000km in those days and a chain 500-1000km)

 

SRAM NX Eagle is an entry level 12 speed groupset. It's unlikely that the person targeting that purchase is going to be too fussed about topend speed.

So, on a bike frame than can take 2x10 or 1x12, the advantage is a longer lasting drive train? But at a much higher cost?