Sticky RS Lyrik Ultimate

[LazyTrailRider]

Suspension guru advice please:

After a lower leg service by my LBS, my 2020 Rockshox Lyrik Ultimate with an estimated 30 hours on felt like it had a lot more stiction than I remember. I took it back immediately, the mech pulled it apart and checked everything again, then added some 0w-30 and butter to the airspring, thinking it could be that.

Still felt the same to me, so I thought “maybe it just needs a ride”. Smashed it down a snake trails run in Tokai, which just confirmed that the buttery small bump sensitivity I had become used to is definitely missing.

See the video below, trying to cycle it as slowly as possible with my normal 58psi. LSC and HSC fully open, rebound as usual somewhere in the middle.

Is stiction like this purely down to bushings and seals, or could it be a damper issue?

(The dodgy sounds are brake pad knock, nothing to do with the fork).

[Jono]

Looks a bit like dry/sticky seals/foam rings and possibly not enough oil in the lowers. Try turning the bike upside down for an hour or so and see if it improves a bit. 

My policy on suspension service is go to a suspension guru (read Stoke) and use the LBS for the rest of the bike.

Edited November 20, 2021 by Jono
Spelling

[LazyTrailRider]

This isn’t the first suspect dry foam rings or seals from what I can tell, everything is freshly buttered. Already tried the upside down trick anyway, no difference.

Going to take it to @droo soon, just curious if anyone else has experienced this…

(Oh, and I agree with you on suspension work, I usually have the LBS do lowers services - they’re simple - and have Stoke do my annual full damper and air can services).

Edited November 20, 2021 by LazyTrailRider

[Bos]

Interesting. But also frustrating

I watched a clip on Instagram from thesuspensionlab NZ where they managed to get a zeb to slide under its own weight. I was like, WTF.. my 2019 pike needs a lot of help, I went looking for solutions.. hub spacing (sanded my hub down) but In my opinion the new airspring definatly has more friction than my old Debonair 2 one. I had a formula 35 fork before and that thing was butter.. more like the Zeb on insta. I could slide it up and down with one finger, when the airspring was open. Also, Rock Shos's dynamic seal grease, is not as smooth as Manitou prep. I just changed over and can notice a marked difference in stiction just from that. 

Anyway, back to your issues.. Did they install new dust wipers? because those might need to be ran in. I doubt its the damper, unless they serviced it, and put heavier weight oil in. with lowers off, you should be able to push the damper rod in and out very easily. 

Last chance.. one of the plunger rods, could be misaligned and not in their actual cup in the bottom of the lower. But I dont think so, as the oil will drain out. 

[thebob]

That does not look right. Check that the seals haven’t been misaligned. The flangeless ones can be pushed in a bit more on one side than another, which would result in a lot of drag.

[LazyTrailRider]

16 hours ago, Bos said:

Interesting. But also frustrating

I watched a clip on Instagram from thesuspensionlab NZ where they managed to get a zeb to slide under its own weight. I was like, WTF.. my 2019 pike needs a lot of help, I went looking for solutions.. hub spacing (sanded my hub down) but In my opinion the new airspring definatly has more friction than my old Debonair 2 one. I had a formula 35 fork before and that thing was butter.. more like the Zeb on insta. I could slide it up and down with one finger, when the airspring was open. Also, Rock Shos's dynamic seal grease, is not as smooth as Manitou prep. I just changed over and can notice a marked difference in stiction just from that. 

Anyway, back to your issues.. Did they install new dust wipers? because those might need to be ran in. I doubt its the damper, unless they serviced it, and put heavier weight oil in. with lowers off, you should be able to push the damper rod in and out very easily. 

Last chance.. one of the plunger rods, could be misaligned and not in their actual cup in the bottom of the lower. But I dont think so, as the oil will drain out. 

Thanks Bos, some good input!

No new seals, and they didn’t touch the damper. Heinrich reckons it could be too much grease, but I don’t have the inclination to open it up.

I’m waiting for a new bike and need to put in a 160mm airspring as part of the swop to the new chassis, so will leave it until then and ask Droo for help if it’s still sticky at that point. Perfectly rideable as is (many people probably wouldn’t even realise), but I know it’s not 100% so it keeps bothering me.

 

 

[Chadvdw67]

My Lyrik select+ did the same thing after I serviced the lowers, not sure what happened, but after 2 or 3 rides it came right, it is now buttery smooth again

[Bos]

 

Might have found the answer to my own question here. I checked the "dynamic seal grease" tub last night and discovered its for rear shocks. Somehow I completely missed it, although its right on the front of the tub. Meh. 

I do wonder how much oring sizes play a role. Like I mentioned, in my specific case, my fork had 2 years of use with the old Debonair B spring, and the new spring only about a year, but there is a marked difference. Im going to get some sram butter and open it back up. Measure all the seals and parts to see where and why there might be differences. Also, If the oring from the old spring installed on the new spring feels better. 

 

Good luck with your fork bro.

[Headshot]

This is all very weird. I've done a few lower self services on various RS forks and never encountered this. Let us know what the cause was if you manage to find out.

[thebob]

The dynamic seal grease is also specced for the forks. If you use it on the air spring seal it says to put 3ml of fork oil above the air piston. Hence I just stick with the good old Slickoleum

[droo]

That fork needs Dynamic grease and 0W30 in the spring, and 0W30 in the lowers.

 

Possible issues - wrong lubricants, wrong lubricant volumes, pinched foam ring, wrong foam ring or wipers not greased. But hard to say without opening it up.

[LazyTrailRider]

23 hours ago, droo said:

That fork needs Dynamic grease and 0W30 in the spring, and 0W30 in the lowers.

 

Possible issues - wrong lubricants, wrong lubricant volumes, pinched foam ring, wrong foam ring or wipers not greased. But hard to say without opening it up.

The LBS is giving me a longer airspring as part of a new bike deal (who knows when the shipment will arrive), I’ll probably be in touch after they’ve swopped it, thanks Droo.

[Meezo]

26 minutes ago, LazyTrailRider said:

The LBS is giving me a longer airspring as part of a new bike deal (who knows when the shipment will arrive), I’ll probably be in touch after they’ve swopped it, thanks Droo.

Was your old spring a 140mm ?

[LazyTrailRider]

6 minutes ago, Meezo said:

Was your old spring a 140mm ?

Nope, 150mm, was not changed through this story.

[LazyTrailRider]

Update: A new airspring (and lowers service again by the LBS while swapping it) has not made any difference. @droo when do you guys open shop after the holidays?

[thebob]

Might be the bushings. I've opened up the ones on my SID and Pike with excellent results. Also helped @Chadvdw67 open up the bushings on his Lyrik. See this thread:

https://www.mtbr.com/threads/tight-bushings-harshness.1129699/