Titan Racing Pro vs Scott Spark 940

[Darryl Pentz]

I'm looking to upgrade from my old 27.5 Bergamont full sus into the world of carbon, and 29". I'm (currently) a heavy guy. I'm 105kg and 179cm. Hopefully with a recent uptick in my cycling frequency, and some changes to my diet, this will improve in time.

My current choices are between the Titan Racing Cypher Pro and the Scott Spark 940 (upgraded to AXS) that come out at roughly the same price, through the great service and pricing I've gotten at Bike Addict. I spent an hour or two with Ivan at the store on Saturday and suffice to say my head is still spinning from all the many options.

I think I've reduced it to the Titan Racing Cypher Pro (the Team is overkill for me) and the Scott Spark 940 (seems to be the sweet spot for what I want to ride). Ivan set up 2 demo's for me to test outside, and I have to say I was really impressed with the Scott riding experience, esp with the patented 3 way lever on the left. My head says the Titan Racing Cypher is the better option because of the components you get (SID shock vs Pike shock, carbon wheels vs alloy to name two) but my heart really likes the clean and efficient design of the Spark. So I'm leaning towards the Spark. A friend of mine also wondered about the strength (weight rating?) of the carbon wheels with my heavy weight at this point. Alloy might be better for now, with a carbon upgrade when I'm a little lighter.

So I'm just reaching out to the excellent Bike Hub community to see if anybody has any additional thoughts that I might not have considered. 👀

UPDATE: I forgot to add that when looking at all the different brands, I excluded brands that have a vertical rear shock that precludes the option of 2 bottle cages. That would have included Scott prior to the integrated shock, but also includes Trek and Giant, two excellent brands as well. Specialized is a bit out of my budget but also obv an excellent and popular brand. The 2 bottle cage need is because I want to take on some long endurance rides - the 36ONE next year is on my bucket list. I'm of the impression that added weight is better on the bike than on the body, hence the 2 bottle cages. I'm not against a light hydration pack though.

Edited May 30, 2022 by Darryl Pentz

[figjam_sa]

Sid is xc, Pike is trail.... to make it short. 

Not sure what you want to do. I think for riding some trails en messing about you will like the Pike. But as it is the newer Sid it is also a bit beefier than the old one, so also a good choice.

 

I did not go and check the specs on any of these two bikes now.. but pick the bike that speaks to you or feels the most comfortable. 

I don't think there's a bad choice here if these two are the only bikes on the table

 

[devvydoesdonuts]

Howzit Darryl, 

As great as the new Spark looks, personally, I would go for a better spec on components, especially if there is not much difference between the riding experience. I am currently on a full carbon Giant XTC Advanced Pro, and prior to some weight loss this year I was weighing 104kg and I am 174cm tall and I have had zero issues, most carbon bikes and I think rims are rated to about 130kgs or so, so you shouldn't have any issues. Dropping a few kgs will only make you go faster. 

[PhilipV]

If it is the new spark with the hidden shock, that is what I'd choose. It has better geometry (IMHO ) and geometry trumps specs (not a humble opinion.)

But it is more of a light trail bike compared to the Titan, and the Pike is an amazing fork, at a bit of a weight penalty compared to the sid. 

But beware, the Titan will be easier to work on yourself. Scott's obsession with clean looks and integration makes it harder to work on. But if you drop your bike off to change your cables, then it's not your problems. 

Edited May 30, 2022 by PhilipV

[DieselnDust]

I’d opt for the Titan. 
local company that offers superb support and our market comes first for them. We’re not their 1% so spares may be easier to obtain.

the more generic parts spec makes it an easier to live with experience. Sort of like a good looking woman who can use a car jack and change the flat wheel on the family bakkie rather than supermodel that does her make up in the vanity mirror every 4min in traffic.

the geo of the titan is nice middle ground stuff more suitable to our tough trails in SA whereas the Scott is moreEurooe focussed in the it likes the smoother more prepared trails.

then lastly I’d opt for the carbon wheels spec everytime. I’d rather skimp on bars and seat post and get stuff I want there but carbon wheels are pretty much always going to deliver better performance in 2022 than a generic alloy rim.

titan gets my vote 

[MTBRIDER1234]

29 minutes ago, DieselnDust said:

I’d opt for the Titan. 
local company that offers superb support and our market comes first for them. We’re not their 1% so spares may be easier to obtain.

the more generic parts spec makes it an easier to live with experience. Sort of like a good looking woman who can use a car jack and change the flat wheel on the family bakkie rather than supermodel that does her make up in the vanity mirror every 4min in traffic.

the geo of the titan is nice middle ground stuff more suitable to our tough trails in SA whereas the Scott is moreEurooe focussed in the it likes the smoother more prepared trails.

then lastly I’d opt for the carbon wheels spec everytime. I’d rather skimp on bars and seat post and get stuff I want there but carbon wheels are pretty much always going to deliver better performance in 2022 than a generic alloy rim.

titan gets my vote 

I would definitely take slacker, longer and lower geo for our trails. When it is rough, you want every extra bit of composure the bike has to offer. Looks like the scott is more versatile and has better geo. But Titan for parts availability an local is lekker!

[ChrisF]

I AM a Scott fan.  Having owned the previous 940, this where my heart is at.

 

Then again, we have a couple of Titan's as well ... EXCELLENT value for money.

 

 

As for the new Scott, with the integrated shock .... A friend bought one.  He LOVES the handling, and how the bike rides.  Bike has just spent yet another week at the dealers ....

1. Dropper was replaced in the first 1000km

2. Front shock leaked oil and was serviced

3. Both and front and rear shock was booked in for this last week stay at the dealers ....

 

Dont know if it is dud .... simply cant get a clear answer from the dealers .....

 

As it is under warantee we cant take it to our prefered bicycle workshop to get to the bottom of this ....

 

 

Something as simple as a rear shock going FULL travel and pushing the rubber of the shaft .... it is a real mission to get in there with two pics to get that rubber band back onto the shaft ....

 

VERY nice bike.  Superb handling .... just hope the dealers fixed it properly this time ....  even more so, would love to find out what caused these issues.

[franna13]

Hi,

Chris is talking about my Scott spark with the shock issues. It is really a stunning bike and it handles very well, I'm thinking of upgrading to the 930 spark just because of the better specs and carbon. 

But I'll stay with my Scott 

[thebob]

I'm going to throw a spanner in the works and say neither. Have a look at the new Trek Top Fuel. My reasons are as such:

1. Much better geometry than either of those bikes

2. In frame storage capability

3. No remote lockouts and the added complexity and maintenance that brings

4. Excellent suspension kinematics making the lockout unnecessary

5. 34.9mm dropper post for better reliability, especially for bigger riders

I owned the new spark for a very brief period of time. Lovely bike, but the integration and proprietary parts mean maintenance is expensive and fiddly. The Titan is a tremendous deal for the spec, but the geometry is not very progressive. Geometry is the most important thing you are buying in my opinion as it is the basis of the whole character of the bike. The seat angle is slack and the head tube angle is steep. Great if you want twitchy handling, not so great of you want stability and confidence. The Trek just ticks all the boxes. I've ridden everything now on my Top Fuel, from the Wolwespruit jump line to the Thaba Trails XCO loop. It handles everything from the big jumps to the nasty technical climbs with aplomb

Edited May 30, 2022 by thebob

[Darryl Pentz]

5 minutes ago, thebob said:

I'm going to throw a spanner in the works and say neither. Have a look at the new Trek Top Fuel. My reasons are as such:

1. Much better geometry than either of those bikes

2. In frame storage capability

3. No remote lockouts and the added complexity and maintenance that brings

4. Excellent suspension kinematics making the lockout unnecessary

5. 34.9mm dropper post for better reliability, especially for bigger riders

I owned the new spark for a very brief period of time. Lovely bike, but the integration and proprietary parts mean maintenance is expensive and fiddly. The Titan is a tremendous deal for the spec, but the geometry is not very progressive. Geometry is the most important thing you are buying. The seat angle is slack and the head tube angle is steep. Great if you want twitchy handling, not so great of you want stability and confidence. The Trek just ticks all the boxes

@thebob you raise a good point that I should have mentioned. I have excluded bikes like Trek and Giant because I want to be able to fit 2 bottles within the frame. It relates to what I'm planning on riding in the future. So unf anything that has a vertical rear shock was excluded. Aside from that though, I completely agree, the Trek is a lovely bike.

[PhilipV]

11 minutes ago, Darryl Pentz said:

@thebob you raise a good point that I should have mentioned. I have excluded bikes like Trek and Giant because I want to be able to fit 2 bottles within the frame. It relates to what I'm planning on riding in the future. So unf anything that has a vertical rear shock was excluded. Aside from that though, I completely agree, the Trek is a lovely bike.

The questions I should have asked before I waded in with what bike would suit me best is :

 

What kind of riding do you do most? And where do you ride?

What type of rides do you plan to do?

What type of terrain do you see yourself riding most with the new bike?

 

 

Ps: some trail running soft flasks fit in the frame storages. If I was riding a bike with a built-in kosblik I'd do that. Not ideal if you're racing flat out though.

Edited May 30, 2022 by PhilipV

[thebob]

24 minutes ago, Darryl Pentz said:

@thebob you raise a good point that I should have mentioned. I have excluded bikes like Trek and Giant because I want to be able to fit 2 bottles within the frame. It relates to what I'm planning on riding in the future. So unf anything that has a vertical rear shock was excluded. Aside from that though, I completely agree, the Trek is a lovely bike.

100%. Maybe also have a look at the Epic Evo. @figjam_sa has one and has been very impressed with it. Or a Pyga Stage or Stage Max, they can take two bottles in spite of the vertical shock mount

Edited May 30, 2022 by thebob

[Mattman]

49 minutes ago, Darryl Pentz said:

@thebob you raise a good point that I should have mentioned. I have excluded bikes like Trek and Giant because I want to be able to fit 2 bottles within the frame. It relates to what I'm planning on riding in the future. So unf anything that has a vertical rear shock was excluded. Aside from that though, I completely agree, the Trek is a lovely bike.

You can solve this problem by getting the holy rail. I have a 2018 Spark 920, size Large, and with a bit of manoeuvring and the right size bottles, I can get in 2 decent size bottles (a 700ml and 600ml). Rather give it a try before you eliminate many good bike options. 

[El Duderino]

45 minutes ago, thebob said:

100%. Maybe also have a look at the Epic Evo. @figjam_sa has one and has been very impressed with it. Or a Pyga Stage or Stage Max, they can take two bottles in spite of the vertical shock mount

I don't really understand the need for two bottles. If you doing a big day out, or a really long race, just get one of those fancy, lightweight hydration packs from USWE or Camelbak. I don't get the stigma attached to wearing a back pack. Even Matt Beers and Alan Hatherly use them sometimes. You're ruling out some really great bikes for lack of a bottle carrying capacity. I'd definitely pick the 2022 Top Fuel over the other 2 options...and I'd buy a back pack. 😅

[DieselnDust]

lets stop throwing about the term "better geo" please pretty please a drop of brannewyn in the coffee....

Chappies, We're not comparing a 2012 XYZ SAF twitchy race machine that tries to kill you for being a bit underskilled. ( I still like those BTW)....but instead we are comparing bikes with a polony skin of a degree here and a foreskin of a degree there difference, Those differences really just serve to work best with the rear suspension leverage ratio's and the degree of anti-squat in the suspensions. We're not going to separate the bikes into better geo here and or there without much more brannewyn, and a dollap of weekend fight noght around the camp fire, much like Bible of Bikes style.

Now I suspect the OP is wanting to get into some stage racing so support is sort of vital. To me that means a bike that can be serviced by any of the tech back up available at the event, often bike shops. Epic is a different story but there you must take a tub of vaseline along for visit to the maintenance crew.

I would opt for the bike with the most generic parts kit. Suspension that can be serviced by any trained retailer.

In my short list would be 

Titan Racing Cypher

Specialized Epic EVO

Cannondale Scalpel SE Lefty Ocho 120 (easy to work on by anyone who can read the dealrer service manual and has the tools (same requirement for a RS, or FOX or Manitou)

Pyga Stage (120mm)

Giant Anthem (2nd bottle can be mounted in the Live vale battery mount lugs

Santa Cruz Blur TR

 

I would steer clear of a bike that has fancy anything that can only be worked on by the distributor.

As far as handling goes, between the Scott and Titan, the titan wins again

The Twinloc feature of the Scott is nice but a prefer the feel of a three position Fox DPS or tuned SiDluxe to the Nude shocks. I'd give the Scott Spark the edge on descents but the Cypher the edge on climbs

 

Bear in mind we're all different so the only person who can definitively say which bike will ride better under you is YOU

 

[swingTOpeddle]

57 minutes ago, thebob said:

100%. Maybe also have a look at the Epic Evo. @figjam_sa has one and has been very impressed with it. Or a Pyga Stage or Stage Max, they can take two bottles in spite of the vertical shock mount

I sold my 2021 Epic Evo to get the new Titan Cypher Team. Best decision I’ve made cycling related. The amount of high spec kit on the Titans are second to none.