News bot Posted April 4, 2023 Share Local importer Omnico have just been appointed as the Southern African distributor for Classified and are massively excited about the prospects this technology brings to our market. Today Classifed announce the launch of a mountain bike-specific Powershift hub system. Find out more about the Belgian drivetrain technology company and development of their groundbreaking Powershift hub […]View full article Link to comment https://forum.bikehub.co.za/topic/193832-classified-%E2%80%93-%E2%80%9Cyou%E2%80%99ve-tried-1x-now-try-1-better%E2%80%9D/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jewbacca Posted April 4, 2023 Share Yoh.... Mechanical doping at SS world champs is going to be a thing! This is pretty rad though. I know SRAM used to have a 2 speed hub that shifted automatically based on the rotational speed of the hub shell and CSS also imported an internal 3 speed hub that had an 8 speed cassette on the freehub body, so it's been 'a thing' before. The electronic shifting and more refined system and looks is impressive though. This is an interesting segment in the market and I'm not surprised someone is trying to refine and corner it Edited April 4, 2023 by Jewbacca Typing in the article comment box yields interesting results devvydoesdonuts 1 Link to comment https://forum.bikehub.co.za/topic/193832-classified-%E2%80%93-%E2%80%9Cyou%E2%80%99ve-tried-1x-now-try-1-better%E2%80%9D/#findComment-3917141 Share on other sites More sharing options...
dirtypot Posted April 4, 2023 Share I don\'t really get it for mountain biking - it just seems like an old 2x setup albeit with faster shifting. But I like the idea of this on a single speed setup. That would be fun. Link to comment https://forum.bikehub.co.za/topic/193832-classified-%E2%80%93-%E2%80%9Cyou%E2%80%99ve-tried-1x-now-try-1-better%E2%80%9D/#findComment-3917157 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jewbacca Posted April 4, 2023 Share 21 minutes ago, dirtypot said: I don\'t really get it for mountain biking - it just seems like an old 2x setup albeit with faster shifting. But I like the idea of this on a single speed setup. That would be fun. 'Single speed'..... 🙊 I think this IS a direct replacement for a 2x groupset. They specifically mention gravel bikes It's 1x gear simplicity with either a bail out or a granny. Which ever way you want to wield it I guess. Link to comment https://forum.bikehub.co.za/topic/193832-classified-%E2%80%93-%E2%80%9Cyou%E2%80%99ve-tried-1x-now-try-1-better%E2%80%9D/#findComment-3917167 Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickGM Posted April 4, 2023 Share "this instantaneous ‘Powershift’ can be done under full load of up to 1000 watts." Well I'm sorry but that's a deal-breaker for me. #unit. Edited April 4, 2023 by NickGM formating Fred van Vlaanderen and M L 2 Link to comment https://forum.bikehub.co.za/topic/193832-classified-%E2%80%93-%E2%80%9Cyou%E2%80%99ve-tried-1x-now-try-1-better%E2%80%9D/#findComment-3917170 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Furbz Posted April 4, 2023 Share i've been after classified for over 2 years. think it was first awarded to cape cycles who did nothing with it. (i stand to be corrected) massive delays with ICASA registration to. glad someone has it now and is doing something with the product - not so excited its Omnico as i've had more than a few warranty issues with them. not to mention stock issues. but lets hope thats in the past an extremely cool product and i really think it could revolutionise cycling Link to comment https://forum.bikehub.co.za/topic/193832-classified-%E2%80%93-%E2%80%9Cyou%E2%80%99ve-tried-1x-now-try-1-better%E2%80%9D/#findComment-3917175 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselnDust Posted April 4, 2023 Share Yikes the price is eye watering. Definitely not going to be for a bodge build! However I would definitely like this kit. One could use a 1x specific gravel rear derailleur for clearance and a larger chainring . Efficiency will be somewhere around 93% though due to the drivetrain losses in the epicyclic drive. In the Mtb application this is less of a problem than in a road bike application Jewbacca 1 Link to comment https://forum.bikehub.co.za/topic/193832-classified-%E2%80%93-%E2%80%9Cyou%E2%80%99ve-tried-1x-now-try-1-better%E2%80%9D/#findComment-3917177 Share on other sites More sharing options...
100Tours Posted April 4, 2023 Share Expensive and less efficient? (although once you're in the mud I guess the efficiency thing falls away). I'm sure you'll see a few around, but I suspect you cover the same ground with a 12s or a 13s drivetrain (assuming no-one is going 2x13) - I doubt you get much in added gear range or tighter ratios between 2x11 on a classified hub vs a 1x13. Edited April 4, 2023 by 100Tours Link to comment https://forum.bikehub.co.za/topic/193832-classified-%E2%80%93-%E2%80%9Cyou%E2%80%99ve-tried-1x-now-try-1-better%E2%80%9D/#findComment-3917179 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Furbz Posted April 4, 2023 Share 8 minutes ago, DieselnDust said: Yikes the price is eye watering. Definitely not going to be for a bodge build! However I would definitely like this kit. One could use a 1x specific gravel rear derailleur for clearance and a larger chainring . Efficiency will be somewhere around 93% though due to the drivetrain losses in the epicyclic drive. In the Mtb application this is less of a problem than in a road bike application not sure where you got the efficiency figure from? granted this is their own data - would be interesting to see 3rd party data on it https://www.classified-cycling.cc/stories/classified-drivetrain-efficiency-measurements Link to comment https://forum.bikehub.co.za/topic/193832-classified-%E2%80%93-%E2%80%9Cyou%E2%80%99ve-tried-1x-now-try-1-better%E2%80%9D/#findComment-3917180 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselnDust Posted April 4, 2023 Share 9 minutes ago, Furbz said: not sure where you got the efficiency figure from? granted this is their own data - would be interesting to see 3rd party data on it https://www.classified-cycling.cc/stories/classified-drivetrain-efficiency-measurements their efficiency figures are meaningless because they measure at<50W . Who rode with that little power and torque (rpm is high) epicyclic drives usually have a 2-3% efficiency loss per stage and I assume for a 2 speed system it’s 3stages (sun, planets , ring gear and arm). So best case is 6% loss x chain losses which I assume to be 99% efficient under ideal conditions. 0.99x0.94 =0.9305 or 93.05% efficiency bit like I said on an Mtb we are less Concerned about the efficiency because of the changing conditions the drivetrain operates under in normal working conditions. Just pointing out their efficiency shown is not real world I believe Edited April 4, 2023 by DieselnDust 100Tours and devvydoesdonuts 1 1 Link to comment https://forum.bikehub.co.za/topic/193832-classified-%E2%80%93-%E2%80%9Cyou%E2%80%99ve-tried-1x-now-try-1-better%E2%80%9D/#findComment-3917184 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irvin85 Posted April 4, 2023 Share Can someone explain what this is to the average joe on the street that does not have a masters degree in engineering? Zebra 1 Link to comment https://forum.bikehub.co.za/topic/193832-classified-%E2%80%93-%E2%80%9Cyou%E2%80%99ve-tried-1x-now-try-1-better%E2%80%9D/#findComment-3917187 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Headshot Posted April 4, 2023 Share Hambini has already done a hatchet job and panned the efficiency loss caused by the hub. That said I still don\'t understand what it is :-) DieselnDust 1 Link to comment https://forum.bikehub.co.za/topic/193832-classified-%E2%80%93-%E2%80%9Cyou%E2%80%99ve-tried-1x-now-try-1-better%E2%80%9D/#findComment-3917189 Share on other sites More sharing options...
100Tours Posted April 4, 2023 Share 5 minutes ago, Headshot said: Hambini has already done a hatchet job and panned the efficiency loss caused by the hub. That said I still don\'t understand what it is 🙂 they have hidden an extra (planetary gear) 'gearbox' in between the cassette and the hub. you can either ride this 'fixed' which then works like a normal 1x setup, or 'free' where it adds a step-down ratio between the cassette rotation and the hub rotation (cassette rotates faster than the hub). This acts like being in the small chainring gear. But to Hambini's point you then have an efficiency loss in the new step-down gear. I think he used 97% efficient for the 'fixed' arrangement, and 97% of 97% for the 'free' setting. the extra ~3% loss is about 10w out of your 400W peak power output Edited April 4, 2023 by 100Tours Link to comment https://forum.bikehub.co.za/topic/193832-classified-%E2%80%93-%E2%80%9Cyou%E2%80%99ve-tried-1x-now-try-1-better%E2%80%9D/#findComment-3917191 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselnDust Posted April 4, 2023 Share 7 minutes ago, Irvin85 said: Can someone explain what this is to the average joe on the street that does not have a masters degree in engineering? Basically if the input force is 100N the output gear will deliver a force of 93N. torque is a different matter but basically it will be 93% less than what the calculated value would be for the gear ratio. Link to comment https://forum.bikehub.co.za/topic/193832-classified-%E2%80%93-%E2%80%9Cyou%E2%80%99ve-tried-1x-now-try-1-better%E2%80%9D/#findComment-3917192 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselnDust Posted April 4, 2023 Share 4 minutes ago, Headshot said: Hambini has already done a hatchet job and panned the efficiency loss caused by the hub. That said I still don\'t understand what it is 🙂 Friction losses inside the hub are higher than for a normal chain drive. dasilvarsa 1 Link to comment https://forum.bikehub.co.za/topic/193832-classified-%E2%80%93-%E2%80%9Cyou%E2%80%99ve-tried-1x-now-try-1-better%E2%80%9D/#findComment-3917193 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Furbz Posted April 4, 2023 Share 3 minutes ago, DieselnDust said: Basically if the input force is 100N the output gear will deliver a force of 93N. torque is a different matter but basically it will be 93% less than what the calculated value would be for the gear ratio. shot. what would it be for a traditional drivetrain? Link to comment https://forum.bikehub.co.za/topic/193832-classified-%E2%80%93-%E2%80%9Cyou%E2%80%99ve-tried-1x-now-try-1-better%E2%80%9D/#findComment-3917194 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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