KlapperKnop Posted January 19, 2009 Posted January 19, 2009 Lets set a few things straight.1) I never attacked the whole of TCS.2) Eben lied and I told everyone so from the beginning3) Crux knew he was doping. Hell' date=' half of TCS knew he was doping and have claimed so themselves. To come and tell us no-one knew is a bit rich. Why did babelkous leave TCS?Crux has always been most vocal when pro riders have been busted, calling for jailtime/lifetime bans/heavier sentences. I find it extremely hypocritical that a TCS is rider is busted and suddenly everyone comes with a "lets sweep it under the rug" attitude, and then still single a few of us out as instigators? Mark - clearly you have an issue with me. I'm not sure what it is, but feel free to answer my pm and tell me how i (and the capies for that matter) have offended you[/quote'] I agree with Fand ... it is very ironic that Fand and Colonel are labelled as stirrers when they indeed did not attack other TCS members (initially) other than questioned Eben (the topic poster) and Crux (The Manager of TCS) I find TCS members such as Phen, EPOH, IanJ, Christie and MWNN (the one's that responded to this thread) to be "true" unbiased cyclists ... yes I am sure anyone would defend his or her club in a situation like this; but labelling people as stirrers and generalising them as Capies is uncalled for. I also found some Hubbers (you know who you are) to be "fence sitters" as it is TCS ... yet with the doping scandal of TdF they were the one's to full up the thread with response. I respect teams such as Cyclelab, Bulk Meats and other (which I may not come to their names right now) to have abstained on this thread ... I am sure it is a lesson learnt for any club, including mine!KlapperKnop2009-01-19 12:21:20
markStockton Posted January 19, 2009 Posted January 19, 2009 Mark - clearly you have an issue with me. I'm not sure what it is' date=' but feel free to answer my pm and tell me how i (and the capies for that matter) have offended you[/quote'] Not you personally Fand, but I'm just tired of the lashing at the good tCS people, so I lashed back. Disclaimer: I have no association with tCS, apart from having met a couple of members. That said enough is enough. If you have an issue with Eben, Cruxie etc, thats fine just leave the rest alone. See it isn't very nice being on the back foot.
fandacious Posted January 19, 2009 Posted January 19, 2009 Mark - clearly you have an issue with me. I'm not sure what it is' date=' but feel free to answer my pm and tell me how i (and the capies for that matter) have offended you[/quote'] Not you personally Fand, but I'm just tired of the lashing at the good tCS people, so I lashed back. Disclaimer: I have no association with tCS, apart from having met a couple of members. That said enough is enough. If you have an issue with Eben, Cruxie etc, thats fine just leave the rest alone. See it isn't very nice being on the back foot. no worries mate - i can understand how you feel. however, i've never dissed the other TCS riders. I still think that the ones i've met are awesome riders, and they were always courteous and friendly to me every time i've seen them.
markStockton Posted January 19, 2009 Posted January 19, 2009 Dude, both you and Captain Kangaroo where riding them pretty hard. Maybe not directly, but there was a good guilt by association thing going. One of my failing's is I don't react well to what I see as bullying.
fandacious Posted January 19, 2009 Posted January 19, 2009 Dude' date=' both you and Captain Kangaroo where riding them pretty hard. Maybe not directly, but there was a good guilt by association thing going. One of my failing's is I don't react well to what I see as bullying. [/quote'] as i said previously - i didnt rip any TCS riders a new one. in fact, on the contrary I have stated that I have a lot of respect for all the TCS riders i've met. They've always been friendly and courteous and ride the hell out of bike. If it was misconstrued that I was attacking everyone at TCS, then I am sorry, but it was never my intention to personally attack everyone @ TCS
Guest colonel Posted January 19, 2009 Posted January 19, 2009 Its all my fault and while it is and I am clearly to blame for the royal ****up positive test that has happend at TCS and they need to try and move the blame from themselves here by trying to make myself and FanD the problem here is another one for you all: E phedrineB eatsE veryoneN o problemWell up to 7th place that is. You lot are unbelieveable really you are so why dont you cowboys please go and take some of your own medicine (no wait, you tried that and you got busted) and do the life bans,jailtime and all that other crap that all Managers say to make themselves look innocent when a rider gets bust but you had no idea what he was doing? Well then you should maybe focus more attention on your team instead of running around in the night. Face the facts, deal with your problem and answer the questions people are asking and dont try shift the blame it makes you look even more guilty. Amazing 2 Capies have brought TCS to their doom. Flip this mountain is strong!!! colonel2009-01-19 12:36:20
Groot Lem Posted January 19, 2009 Posted January 19, 2009 A SA cyclist/funrider died during 2008 cause of this stuff, so dont play with your life.
Windbreaker Posted January 19, 2009 Posted January 19, 2009 I really had intended to let this all go - especially after the "issues" started to get lost in the noise - but just to be clear. This is not an "anti-TCS" thing. It is anti doping, anti-lies and anti-arrogance. A top elite rider doped, doped some more, lied and then tried to take us all for fools His "boss" came out with a very soft line which was also quite dishonest considering his prior postings on the topic of doping. In my postings I made it clear that both their original and current actions were casting a bad light on ALL of the TCS riders some of whom I have come to admire at long distance for their achievements in the past 18 months or so. The one question also still is open is whether Babbelkous was given the boot because she stuck to her principles and made her objections known wiithin the club. If that is the case then this episode on the hub is just the last in a series of "cover ups" and the stink remains.
fandacious Posted January 19, 2009 Posted January 19, 2009 eloquently put, as always. however, i have asked that last question before and no answer is forthcoming, so i guess we will never know...
Guest Agteros Posted January 19, 2009 Posted January 19, 2009 A SA cyclist/funrider died during 2008 cause of this stuff' date=' so dont play with your life. [/quote'] Who/When/Where?Tandem/Solo/Mono?MTB/Road?
Wonder Woman Posted January 20, 2009 Posted January 20, 2009 Lets set a few things straight.1) I never attacked the whole of TCS.It has felt a bit like it....but you aren't the only one2) Eben lied and I told everyone so from the beginningI agree3) Crux knew he was doping. Hell' date=' half of TCS knew he was doping and have claimed so themselves. To come and tell us no-one knew is a bit rich. There might have been suspicions but no proof. Innocent till proven guilty...he's now been found guiltyWhy did babelkous leave TCS?That's another whole new story you know nothing about!! Don't make assumptions.Crux has always been most vocal when pro riders have been busted, calling for jailtime/lifetime bans/heavier sentences. He still feels the sameI find it extremely hypocritical that a TCS is rider is busted and suddenly everyone comes with a "lets sweep it under the rug" attitude, and then still single a few of us out as instigators? Nothing is being swept uinder the rug....Eben has been kicked out of the club...what more could Crux do, he isn't part of UCI and banning law.Hope that answers some of your questions!![/quote']
Canaris Posted January 20, 2009 Posted January 20, 2009 after reading all the public washing of laundry here, which was started by Eben in the first place a number of ethical questions arise: 1. Elite cycling is a team sport. So Eben's successes are not his own. He rode with other riders in his team to secure his race results. He may also in a doped state helped his team members get better placings in races. So although "only" he took the dope, the entire team willingly or unwittingly gained advantage from his form. So does this make his team mates and management accomplices to his cheating? How much responsibility should they take for the affair? 2. TCS is a SPONSORED team. Crux's company gets advertising from Eben's successes. (which is a rands and cents issue). So, if it was "obvious" to other riders that Eben "got the chills" why did Crux wait until he was "bust" before acting? (and why was he not ejected from the club in totality?) Why are sponsors willing to claim the victories, but not the failures? 3. Lastly, which is a rather sensitive point all around and is not a simple conceptual ethical issue, why did the team manager of TCS leave the club? Reading between the lines about Eben's behaviour and how it was tolerated by the Club management (despite the team manager being unhappy), is there more to be said on this issue? As I said, these are just some questions this thread raises.
Spinnekop Posted January 20, 2009 Posted January 20, 2009 The one question also still is open is whether Babbelkous was given the boot because she stuck to her principles and made her objections known wiithin the club. If that is the case then this episode on the hub is just the last in a series of "cover ups" and the stink remains. The question is not open.....she left because of VERY personal differences between her and the team and Crux. Trust me when I say it has NOTHING to do with the doping thing. In fact. Carel took her comments into action when he heard what happened at the Bakwena and approached Eben personally and confronted and etc. etc.etc. There is a lonnnnng story to tell that have (*$#$#$# to do with you. Capish? But Babbelkous leaving TCS is a whole different matter. A personal one that should stay just that. Personal. Answer your so called "open question?"
mallo Posted January 20, 2009 Posted January 20, 2009 Why all this fighting when the mother body itself shows they don't actually give a damn to rid the sport of DOPERS(6 months for tarnishing the sport)Why not the standard two year ban? Go a bit further back and check the vet rider who was suspended for doping he still rode races during that time and nothing was done about it even though some complaints were made public.CSA stance was the race organizers should not have accepted his race entry. What about the EPO character has he been tested over the last year or so to ensure he is truly free from the juice. Unless our mother body takes this issue to task we can say and fight with one another nothing will be achieved. Is this not a funny world 2 dopers caught, one gets flamed due to his stupidty and further lies whilst the other keeps quiet and is defended by friends and hubbers. BOTH DOPED FINISH and KLAAR.
Spinnekop Posted January 20, 2009 Posted January 20, 2009 Its all my fault and while it is and I am clearly to blame for the royal ****up positive test that has happend at TCS and they need to try and move the blame from themselves here by trying to make myself and FanD the problem here is another one for you all: Either you your stupid or you can't read like Eben. The blame is on EBEN. He took the stuff.I was pointing out that you Capies are like Jackels that chew on the balls of an already dead buck. Smaak lekker ne ou grote?
AndreZA Posted January 20, 2009 Posted January 20, 2009 Damn, but you bunch of wannabes can get upset when another wannabe cheats. Get over it.
Recommended Posts