PPA Seeding - Mathematically Illiterate?

[stratus5]

The formula PPA use to calculate the individual race seeding is clearly spelled out on their website as:

 

The formula is: (your time / adjusted winner’s time – 1) / beta value and then expressed as a percentage

 

If we take the 2011 Argus

I got a 2:53:56 The winner a 2:32:10

 

Now the Argus is "THE" base event, so they have not adjusted the winners time, but they have given it a beta of 0.99, which means for a start they dont understand the concept of a base event .... but using that if I apply the magic formula (using minutes) I get:

(174/152 - 1)/0.99 = 14.6%

 

The PPA calculates this as 16.4% ??? Hello ... a bit of transparency would be nice PPA ... how are you really calculating the seeding?

Edited August 11, 2011 by stratus5

[MTB_Roadie]

Make peace with it, you are just going to upset yourself regarding something that has already been discussed with no answer....just enjoy cycling

[Tiny K]

as discussed at length, and with loads of cursing and wondering, it has been decided that the people at PPA #1 want us not to know what they are doing and #2, don't know what they are doing.

 

that about sums it up. enjoy racing to get into a group you should already be in

[Shebeen]

holy crapbags...i need to do some ppa events sometime soon. i'm down about 20 seeding index points for avoiding them since 2009!

[stratus5]

Happy with my seeding for the new season It does not need to improve... I am going to get broken

 

But ... It does bother me like an itch you cant scratch (I am an engineer at heart) ... I dont want to take seedings on subjective faith. Its either right or it isn't. PPA tries to explain on their website how they calculate the seeding, so why go to all that effort if the fundamental calculation is all a big lie?

[andydude]

I see you... That is the old formula - they might have changed it with the new updated calculation and they just haven't updated the explanation.

 

And I raise you... But on previous races a friend and I compared the same race which should've had same adjusted time and beta, but we had different betas assuming the same adjusted time! We even started in the same group.

Edited August 11, 2011 by andydude

[Lucky Luke.]

Save the brain strain and go ride your bikes! If you end up in a *** group, then surely you are going to win that group? If you end up in a *** hard group, you will bleed from the ears to stay with it and be stronger next time. Good times and happy days.

[Jaco-fiets]

Happy with my seeding for the new season It does not need to improve... I am going to get broken

 

But ... It does bother me like an itch you cant scratch (I am an engineer at heart) ... I dont want to take seedings on subjective faith. Its either right or it isn't. PPA tries to explain on their website how they calculate the seeding, so why go to all that effort if the fundamental calculation is all a big lie?

 

This basically sums up how i feel as well. I have been bitching about PPA for yonks and have come to a point where i really dont care about the seeding i have but at least stick to a calculation method.....

[firewolf]

Save the brain strain and go ride your bikes! If you end up in a *** group, then surely you are going to win that group? If you end up in a *** hard group, you will bleed from the ears to stay with it and be stronger next time. Good times and happy days.

Sounds like a plan Stan..

[Rydogg]

on previous races a friend and I compared the same race which should've had same adjusted time and beta, but we had different betas assuming the same adjusted time! We even started in the same group.

 

Haha, that's funny

[Tiny K]

 

snip

 

Now the Argus is "THE" base event, so they have not adjusted the winners time, but they have given it a beta of 0.99, which means for a start they dont understand the concept of a base event .... but using that if I apply the magic formula (using minutes) I get:

(174/152 - 1)/0.99 = 14.6%

 

The PPA calculates this as 16.4% ??? Hello ... a bit of transparency would be nice PPA ... how are you really calculating the seeding?

 

I figured this 0.99 out - in stats, the beta value cannot be 1 - so they are forced to make it 0.99999999, but that still doesn't excuse their lysdexia. LOL

['Dale]

I am now apathic.

 

And in brief moments of hope, I check out their website.

Only to leave with my confusion again.

[Guest Frail4Life]

IF YOU ALL feel so frustrated and upset about PPA, make an appointment and go see them at there office.

 

I HAVE tried before, emails & phone calls & appointments & AGM Meeting. NO SUCCESS!

 

Still want to compete and cycle.

[fandacious]

The formula PPA use to calculate the individual race seeding is clearly spelled out on their website as:

 

The formula is: (your time / adjusted winner’s time – 1) / beta value and then expressed as a percentage

 

If we take the 2011 Argus

I got a 2:53:56 The winner a 2:32:10

 

Now the Argus is "THE" base event, so they have not adjusted the winners time, but they have given it a beta of 0.99, which means for a start they dont understand the concept of a base event .... but using that if I apply the magic formula (using minutes) I get:

(174/152 - 1)/0.99 = 14.6%

 

The PPA calculates this as 16.4% ??? Hello ... a bit of transparency would be nice PPA ... how are you really calculating the seeding?

 

you're forgetting the random adjustment they do for each rider. there is no "1" formula that they use across the board. its totally random

[Tiny K]

I am now apathic.

 

And in brief moments of hope, I check out their website.

Only to leave with my confusion again.

 

woohooo - I am in E now From G to E without doing any races. Yeah baby!

[andydude]

you're forgetting the random adjustment they do for each rider. there is no "1" formula that they use across the board. its totally random

 

The "friend" I mentioned in my previous post was you! How is your training going - are you going to kick some behind in spring 2011?