PhilipV Posted March 23, 2012 Share BigBen, good point. I think the course builders know their target market, and they know that a lot of people racing won't be able to handle that level of tech. If they aspire to build PMB style course for local racers the numbers will dwindle. So I don't think they'll go and plant log drops and boulders just yet to emulate PMB. You still build a course with riders in mind. I think the best is to push the tech level gradually, you still want people to progress, so they should get out of their comfort zones, but you need to tread a fine line with rideability as well. Guess I'm fence sitting now? Edited March 23, 2012 by PhilipV Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hairy Posted March 23, 2012 Share What? ARE you trying to say something in a Picture??? This specific piece is NOTHING... my 10y.o will drop off here 100x's in a row without any issues. Go for a lap at Thaba with Wendell, you'd *** yourself... it makes this look like a pumptrack.. (I myself do ride thaba with my all-mountain bike....i would hate to go down here with a HT...which may not be a bad idea to get the XCO guys to use different bikes for different tracks) Hey Macho man .... thank you for assuming that you know what I am saying with this pic. But so that you know the truth, I posted the pic because it is a cool pic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheV Posted March 23, 2012 Share Hey Macho man .... thank you for assuming that you know what I am saying with this pic. But so that you know the truth, I posted the pic because it is a cool pic. when i read my post now, i can appreciate your reply... i can be a tosser... However, the core message of what i am trying to express is still the same... courses have to get more technical, with time human/rider evolution and technical advances will force us to have more exciting XCO courses... If not, our sport will end up like boxing.... then it will die out, and in 30 years from now some clever oke will come and create a new crazy XCO series with hectic courses, blood and guts... just like the MMA/Cage Fighting thing has exploded at the moment.... Edited March 23, 2012 by TheV Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eldron Posted March 23, 2012 Share Personally I think the XCO course at PMB was too hard core. Technical is one thing but making XCO riders drop down near vertical log drops and boulder gardens not rock gardens is getting silly. The downhillers have the ability to wear protective gear because less pedalling is required. Sending guys clad in thin lycra down those things is crazy. We have downhill and had 4cross to test "redical" technical ability. Personally I think XCO is about difficult technical not potentially bone breaking technical. It should be about not losing time by putting a foot down rather than not finishing the race because your bike or you is broken. It's about the ability to ride stuff rather than having the balls to ride something. When Thomas Freishnicht says "I shitted my pants on air" then youo know the course is getting out of hand. Keep the radical big air and OHMYGOD stuff to DH and the technically challenging riding to XCO I say. When I heard masters world champs is being hosted in PMB next year my first thought was - damn - the world is goiong to see me taking the chicken run around the boulder garden. Fortunately the rules say that age groupers are not allowed to take the A-lines. Ego saved! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hairy Posted March 23, 2012 Share when i read my post now, i can appreciate your reply... i can be a tosser... However, the core message of what i am trying to express is still the same... courses have to get more technical, with time human/rider evolution and technical advances will force us to have more exciting XCO courses... If not, our sport will end up like boxing.... then it will die out, and in 30 years from now some clever oke will come and create a new crazy XCO series with hectic courses, blood and guts... just like the MMA/Cage Fighting thing has exploded at the moment.... Thank you for your reply and it is appreciated. MMA / Cage fighting just does not have the same grace that a good boxing bout can offer.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kranswurm Posted March 23, 2012 Share Personally I think the XCO course at PMB was too hard core. Technical is one thing but making XCO riders drop down near vertical log drops and boulder gardens not rock gardens is getting silly. The downhillers have the ability to wear protective gear because less pedalling is required. Sending guys clad in thin lycra down those things is crazy. We have downhill and had 4cross to test "redical" technical ability. Personally I think XCO is about difficult technical not potentially bone breaking technical. It should be about not losing time by putting a foot down rather than not finishing the race because your bike or you is broken. It's about the ability to ride stuff rather than having the balls to ride something. When Thomas Freishnicht says "I shitted my pants on air" then youo know the course is getting out of hand. Keep the radical big air and OHMYGOD stuff to DH and the technically challenging riding to XCO I say. When I heard masters world champs is being hosted in PMB next year my first thought was - damn - the world is goiong to see me taking the chicken run around the boulder garden. Fortunately the rules say that age groupers are not allowed to take the A-lines. Ego saved! I agree with this.While it is great to watch the riders hit those obstacles at speed I think lesser mortals will come unstuck.I walked the course in 2009 and it was challenging then and the racing was good.The obstacles do however give opportunities for overtaking.so there are lots of changes up front which is good as well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wyatt Earp Posted March 23, 2012 Share Not looking for an argument.... I have not seen the XCO course in real life, I did watch the race and has seen 100's of pictures... in my mind, maybe it's because of my own pains when riding Thaba. Have you been to Thaba lately on the full loop taking technical options, and I'm just asking for your opinion not chirping?Yes I have been there lately and even 12 years before.Thaba is nowhere near in comparison.But then again, with me weekend warrior skills, that log drop looks might scary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wyatt Earp Posted March 23, 2012 Share I love it when an armchair XCO champ talks about TECHNICAL.Well tjaainas and all you hardcore technical macho men.Go and do it at speed and not at a pace that helps you survive to the bottom of a technical section, then we speak again.I have no problem with them making XCO technical, that's why I simply don't do the events.I can get through the sections, but have squat skill to get through them FAST. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eldron Posted March 23, 2012 Share I love it when an armchair XCO champ talks about TECHNICAL.Well tjaainas and all you hardcore technical macho men.Go and do it at speed and not at a pace that helps you survive to the bottom of a technical section, then we speak again.I have no problem with them making XCO technical, that's why I simply don't do the events.I can get through the sections, but have squat skill to get through them FAST. "Radical" technical is one thing on the first or second lap but after 70 mins of "redline racing" in XCO events the errors start to creep in and errors in boulder gardens and log rocks are not a wee issue... Like I said - technical is about not losing time not hospital time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capricorn Posted March 23, 2012 Share I honestly dont believe all track builders will go out there to build world cup level tracks. that said, there is such a thing as track grading, and the onus is on riders to either develop their skills, grow balls, or respect the track grading. Whining that they cant ride something cos they dont have nerve or skill is just pathetic. They probably whinge and whine they cant afford a ferrari too, and ride up DH tracks. Those types should just get over themselves. Caerus 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wyatt Earp Posted March 23, 2012 Share "Radical" technical is one thing on the first or second lap but after 70 mins of "redline racing" in XCO events the errors start to creep in and errors in boulder gardens and log rocks are not a wee issue... Like I said - technical is about not losing time not hospital time.Exactly, but the Hub is full of cheese squares who are legends in their own lunch boxes, but can't differentiate racing to playing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(Deon) Posted March 23, 2012 Share BigBen, good point. Guess I'm fence sitting now? We'll see when Tokai gets a rebuild.. you are going to be jumping off that fence!! 100% agreed that to ride stuff normally out of reach of ave Joe, a skillset needs to be built up slowly. This is why Tokai will eventually be built back up to it's former hardcore glory, but with safety and development in mind. We know the bikes can handle handle the abuse, but bodies are not factory tested and therefore mental strength is the untested variable. If you have time and a safe option to progress, you will! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eldron Posted March 23, 2012 Share I honestly dont believe all track builders will go out there to build world cup level tracks. that said, there is such a thing as track grading, and the onus is on riders to either develop their skills, grow balls, or respect the track grading. Whining that they cant ride something cos they dont have nerve or skill is just pathetic. They probably whinge and whine they cant afford a ferrari too, and ride up DH tracks. Those types should just get over themselves. Yes and no... Me - I like to give technical a go but draw the line at technical which may render me broken and not able to work for a few weeks. I think the difference is in the body armour and long travel bikes. You could argue that XCO riders could use both but it's just not practical to try and climb switchbacks in knee guards on a floppy 17kg bike. Match the challenge to the protection I say. Long travel suspension turns boulder gardens into rock gardens. A tumble down a rock garden in body armour makes for a good video - a tumble down a rock garden in lycra is all blood, gristle and lost teeth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
covie Posted March 23, 2012 Share I tend to shred the technical stuff and then fall over in the parking lot while trying to unclip, anyone have a solution? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wyatt Earp Posted March 23, 2012 Share I tend to shred the technical stuff and then fall over in the parking lot while trying to unclip, anyone have a solution?Give us your definition of shred. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotSoBigBen Posted March 23, 2012 Share I tend to shred the technical stuff and then fall over in the parking lot while trying to unclip, anyone have a solution? Whatever you do don't get tips from Weedmod then Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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