Northcliff Cycles in the Cradle this morning - what a bunch of Tjops

[HeartCoppi]

Stopped reading when I got to the part about long hair. He's guilty of being a tjop.

Didn't describe the hairstyle of the group so cant comment on their tjoppness as whole.

[TNT1]

Play the ball, not me, Tess.

[tombeej]

So, is lane splitting legal in your opinion?

 

Since lane splitting describes 2-wheel vehicles moving through stationary traffic, what's that got to do with this particular situation?

 

But to answer your question, as far as I understand it, it's legal in SA (Article 298 of the National Road Traffic Regulations, 1999).

 

 

I do it, but only when traffic is stopped (e.g. at a red light) and I move slowly while doing it. The law does not protect a motorcycle moving between moving cars, e.g. on the freeway - that is not lane splitting, that's just extremely dangerous driving.

[TNT1]

Since lane splitting describes 2-wheel vehicles moving through stationary traffic,

 

Stationary? Where'd you get that from?

[slowpoke]

 

 

Since lane splitting describes 2-wheel vehicles moving through stationary traffic, what's that got to do with this particular situation?

 

But to answer your question, as far as I understand it, it's legal in SA (Article 298 of the National Road Traffic Regulations, 1999).

 

 

I do it, but only when traffic is stopped (e.g. at a red light) and I move slowly while doing it. The law does not protect a motorcycle moving between moving cars, e.g. on the freeway - that is not lane splitting, that's just extremely dangerous driving.

 

The law does allow it whenever passing other vehicles, even if those other vehicles are moving, eg on a highway. Intelligence is what determines the speed differential at which you do it. Passing a car driving at 110kmph by splitting at 120kmph is neither illegal nor stupid. Either going at 130kmph is illegal. Passing a car doing 40 on a bike at 80 is stupid. Lack of knowledge of the law is not an excuse, and just because you don't personally like a law does not stop it from being the law.

[tombeej]

Stationary? Where'd you get that from?

 

Ok, if I'm wrong in saying lane splitting is legal for only stationary/very slow moving traffic, cool. I'm no expert and won't try to make myself out to be one. Anyway, as I'm sure you'll agree, as slowpoke says lane splitting is about allowing a 2-wheel vehicle to pass another vehicle inside a lane. If you say it's legal for, say, a motorcycle to do that at speed, then I'm not going to argue with you.

 

All that you're doing here is sending this thread off-topic. Fact remains that these people were riding side-by-side, not trying to pass. They were not lane splitting. They were riding illegally, arrogantly and dangerously.

[tombeej]

The law does allow it whenever passing other vehicles, even if those other vehicles are moving, eg on a highway. Intelligence is what determines the speed differential at which you do it. Passing a car driving at 110kmph by splitting at 120kmph is neither illegal nor stupid. Either going at 130kmph is illegal. Passing a car doing 40 on a bike at 80 is stupid. Lack of knowledge of the law is not an excuse, and just because you don't personally like a law does not stop it from being the law.

 

thanks, got it now

[TNT1]

They were riding illegally, arrogantly and dangerously.

 

To put a point on it, so was the OP when he chose to overtake over a solid white line.

 

Let's debate cause and effect all night long,

 

But the point is he, as a user of the road, chose to break the law.

 

I personally don't care what motivated him to do that, but I do find it completely strange that he can accuse others of breaking the law, and then go right ahead and do the same.

 

Don't get me wrong, I think the cyclists should be taken to task, remember, I stop at stop streets and red lights and stuff on my bicycle.

 

But, be part of the solution, even if it means slowing down and taking a few minutes longer to get to your destination, rather than being part of the problem.

[TNT1]

All that you're doing here is sending this thread off-topic.

 

How exactly?

 

By offering an opinion that differs from yours?

 

I agree 100% that I am an abrasive ****, but how exactly am I derailing this topic?

[tombeej]

To put a point on it, so was the OP when he chose to overtake over a solid white line.

 

Let's debate cause and effect all night long,

 

But the point is he, as a user of the road, chose to break the law.

 

I personally don't care what motivated him to do that, but I do find it completely strange that he can accuse others of breaking the law, and then go right ahead and do the same.

 

Don't get me wrong, I think the cyclists should be taken to task, remember, I stop at stop streets and red lights and stuff on my bicycle.

 

But, be part of the solution, even if it means slowing down and taking a few minutes longer to get to your destination, rather than being part of the problem.

 

OK this is the last I'll say here:

 

I agree with what you say, we're on the same page. Patience definitely is a virtue and we'd all live in a much happier world if folks would just chill out a bit. But we've still got to deal with this attitude of cyclists who think they can go around town side by side in bunches, giving everyone who complains the middle finger. It's just not ok. I take it personally because their actions are making my life harder and putting me in danger because the next person that enraged motorist sees further down the road might be me.

[slowpoke]

TNT, what you are constantly trying to sweep under the rug by shifting blame is the fact that NC were riding illegally and in a manner that would logically lead to other road users getting upset. Yes, so the OP did eventually get fed up and also behaved illegally. Yes, two wrongs do not make a right. They are BOTH wrongs. The second wrong does NOT negate the first wrong nor should it ever detract from any attention the first wrong should get. In fact, address the first wrong and the second wrong may very well cease to occur.

[TNT1]

TNT, what you are constantly trying to sweep under the rug

 

Lost me there.

 

I will sit for days behind a cyclist whilst driving my car and wait till I can pass safely.

 

Sorry that my world view doesn't coincide with yours.

[slowpoke]

 

 

Lost me there.

 

I will sit for days behind a cyclist whilst driving my car and wait till I can pass safely.

 

Sorry that my world view doesn't coincide with yours.

 

You might and I might but most SA drivers won't. What do you not understand about that simple fact? As such it is idiotic for cyclists to blatantly ride illegally and endanger other cyclists.

[Agteros]

To everybody who is poking a righteous finger at NC: What have you done about this perceived (only one eye witness) alleged wrong?

 

To the OP: Have you taken the matter up with the identified individual, or have you reported it to the police?

 

to the hubbers: This exact thread is the reason why as stated earlier, the hub is sidelined by those actually participating in cycling activities. Too much finger pointing and self righteous chin wagging going on here.

 

Cyclists(read hubbers) are just too fond of fighting and pointing fingers at other cyclists. Never, EVER, will there be a 'cycling community' with idjuts fighting amongst themselves.

 

Amazing how cyclists (read hubbers) can point fingers at cyclists 'transgressing', but in the same breath (read paragraph) admit to breaking the law...

 

To be frank, the mind boggles!

Edited December 17, 2012 by robox

[TNT1]

As such it is idiotic for cyclists to blatantly ride illegally and endanger other cyclists.

 

 

What? I've been ridden into by other cyclists when I stopped at a non functioning traffic light.

 

I get what you're saying.

Edited December 17, 2012 by TNT1

[LeTurbo]

I'm in agreement - the OP is actually the worse transgressor here - white lines are there for a reason; if another car had crested the hill and hit him head on, two drivers and probably half of the cyclists would have been wiped out. Exceptionally irresponsible. Actually plain damn dumb.

 

Now this Alex or Neil or Neil, long-haired or short, Russian accented or whatever: he probably looked behind him and thought, "There's a tjop here in a car who is going to attempt overtaking on a blind rise," or he looked ahead and thought, "There's a fat pothole that everyone's going to hit - go right," or he thought, "There are times when it's necessary for the cyclist to own the lane, such as turning right at intersections, to ensure that they're clearly seen."