PPA versus CSA

[ichops]

I feel as much for the PPA as I feel for the stormers. Far away and nothing to do with me.

 

I don't see how this decision can be good for cycling. Loads of money enters the PPA coffers at Argus time and I'm believe most of the entrants are not even from the Cape. That money sure does nothing for cyclists outside of the area.

 

It's been a long time since I did an Argus. Be a longer time before I do another one.

You are missing the point >> most of the money raised during Argus goes to charities - not the cyclists (PPA affiliated or otherwise) how much money does CSA give to charities or to you as a cyclist ?

[DJR]

The PPA has cash in the bank because they have managed their finances responsibly with long term sustainability in mind. That is the RIGHT WAY of doing things, period. Their financials are open and transparent for anyone who cares to read it.

 

They are not perfect, they can improve, and how they should spend their money can be debated, but the fact remains that they are the single organisation that have done the most for cycling in South Africa over the longest period. A track record like theirs is worth gold.

 

By comparison........

[DJR]

i quote by steve haywood the ppa chairman in the Argus about the ppa legal fees " this money can be now put back into our charities and buying bikes for people who desperately need them to get around"

nice - what about charity begins at home (ie with your members)

 

Make a presentation to the PPA for a worthy cycling related project or cause that you personally fancy! They are at the very moment asking for proposals. Please do it!

[Blackbeard]

The PPA has cash in the bank because they have managed their finances responsibly with long term sustainability in mind. That is the RIGHT WAY of doing things, period. Their financials are open and transparent for anyone who cares to read it.

 

They are not perfect, they can improve, and how they should spend their money can be debated, but the fact remains that they are the single organisation that have done the most for cycling in South Africa over the longest period. A track record like theirs is worth gold.

 

By comparison........

 

But the PPA are in the Western Cape .......whine whine whine and I won't do the Argus.... whine whine whine.

 

(obviously not aimed at you DJR).

Edited February 19, 2014 by Blackbeard

[RocknRolla]

so now my R75 license fees i paid to CSA last year went straight to the lawyers....

 

lots of losers.. only one winner.....

[GoLefty!!]

I do not believe that it is the PPA's responsibility to sponsor top athletes. This should come from corporate sponsorships or dedicated government programs (lotto included).

 

I do, however, wonder what the intention of the PPA is with all the money in their hands. They do proclaim to have various avenues of spending it, but very little is actually seen. Heard that a grand total of R17000 was spent on mtbing last year and if one looks at their 'investments' into places like Schapenberg and Thandi, very little improvements are seen. Thandi bike park does not even exist any more.

 

Also many PPA events do not exist any more and no help was forthcoming to help them out. What happened to 'Die Wingerd' race in Somerset West?

 

I fully agree with their fight with the CSA and am happy with the outcome, but they seriously need to relook at how their money is spent towards the development of cycling.

 

 

The problem they have with having the money is not knowing how to spend it responsibly. PPA has been stung by many "Fly by nights" and programs that have not worked. Tehy do pump money into development cycling but I feel that program needs to be more formal, with a proper structure and governance. Problem is then they need a revenue stream.

So how do they spend their savings whilst still being an NPO?

They can fund a kick off program but from then on corporate or benefactor sponsorships and donations becomes necessary to sustain the program.

 

I sat on the EXCO when the decision to put a pot of money in a unit trust was made. That decision was made to keep the value of the cash PPA had ahead of inflation so t hat it could cover legal fees and other unforseen challenges that could arise in the future.

Based on the CSA challenge I would say it was a darn good decision as this has allowed PPA to stay in the fight. Cash reserves important. Imagine the PPA had to ask members for money to fight CSA??!!! HEck have you ever been to a AGM where a decision from members has to be made. What a moan fest.

 

icycling, how does PPA work as a socialist organisation when the commercial laws under which it operates is written under capitalist principals? Every NGO, NPO or other non profit must have a revenue stream and a responsible organisation with have cash reserves.

 

Lets strip the violin music out of the debate, leave the what if's at the door.

 

What CSA needs to do is get its own business model working and that s where they falter, stutter and fail. CSA should have its own events, membership structure and fee structure. Once it has cash flow it can get going but somehow they have it in their heads that its better to go and absorb a larger organisation....

 

Porsche tried that with VW and VW ended up buying Porsche outright...

 

CSA does not appear to realise it has an elephant in the room... but fighting in court is not going to reveal the elephant

[TimW]

PPA could have created a problem in the future:

 

UCI Rule 1.2.019 states, "No licence holder may participate in an event that has not been included on a national, continental or world calendar or that has not been recognised by a national federation, a continental confederation or the UCI."

 

In other words, if PPA try to organise Argus without falling under CSA then no licenced rider may ride the Argus. According to the rules he would only be eligible for a one-month suspension so it is not really a big problem and I suspect a lot of riders would take the penalty and have a month off.

 

For 2014 this rule will not be enforced (UCI have it under review) and a UCI official has said the change may mean it may only apply to elite and professional riders in future.

[GoLefty!!]

I feel as much for the PPA as I feel for the stormers. Far away and nothing to do with me.

 

I don't see how this decision can be good for cycling. Loads of money enters the PPA coffers at Argus time and I'm believe most of the entrants are not even from the Cape. That money sure does nothing for cyclists outside of the area.

 

It's been a long time since I did an Argus. Be a longer time before I do another one.

 

 

Maybe the air is too thin up in Jozi but i figured that hosting an event to raise money for charity whilst taking a management fee was how good NPO grow their worth and influence..

 

Maybe I missed Economics 101 and Entrepreneurship 1

Edited February 19, 2014 by GoLefty!!

[HappyMartin]

 

 

 

Maybe the air is too thin up in Jozi but i figured that hosting and event to raise money for charity whilst taking a management fee was how good NPO grow their worth and influence..

 

Maybe I missed Economics 101 and Entrepreneurship 1

 

Perhaps you did I don't know. I never studied either. What I did study was running my own business and spending money where I get a return. When I race up here in the thin air iI get commisaires and bike marshals. Regular mail keeping me informed about cycling events in SA and about our cyclists overseas also find there way into my inbox courtesy of the CSA.

 

From the PPA I don't get anything.

 

I'm not saying CSA is perfect far from it.

 

By the way my favorite thing about the Argus was always how they never put safety pins in the race pack but allow one guy to sell them at a premium on the way out of the expo. Does that still happen? Lovely touch that.

[Blackbeard]

Perhaps you did I don't know. I never studied either. What I did study was running my own business and spending money where I get a return. When I race up here in the thin air iI get commisaires and bike marshals. Regular mail keeping me informed about cycling events in SA and about our cyclists overseas also find there way into my inbox courtesy of the CSA.

 

From the PPA I don't get anything.

 

I'm not saying CSA is perfect far from it.

 

By the way my favorite thing about the Argus was always how they never put safety pins in the race pack but allow one guy to sell them at a premium on the way out of the expo. Does that still happen? Lovely touch that.

 

We re-use our safety pins down here.

[carbon29er]

so now my R75 license fees i paid to CSA last year went straight to the lawyers....

 

lots of losers.. only one winner.....

Actually every recreational cyclist in the country is a winner as CSA can no longer demand licence fees from riders AND charge the organiser a fee for approving the event.

[GoLefty!!]

Perhaps you did I don't know. I never studied either. What I did study was running my own business and spending money where I get a return. When I race up here in the thin air iI get commisaires and bike marshals. Regular mail keeping me informed about cycling events in SA and about our cyclists overseas also find there way into my inbox courtesy of the CSA.

 

From the PPA I don't get anything.

 

I'm not saying CSA is perfect far from it.

 

By the way my favorite thing about the Argus was always how they never put safety pins in the race pack but allow one guy to sell them at a premium on the way out of the expo. Does that still happen? Lovely touch that.

 

 

So if you don't get anything from the PPA why do you want them under the control of CSA? Good businesses don't want companies that they are not interested in.

 

oh sorry I get it now, you're having a moan because you have nothing better to moan about. You should play bowles instead

[Wannabe]

I feel as much for the PPA as I feel for the stormers. Far away and nothing to do with me.

 

I don't see how this decision can be good for cycling. Loads of money enters the PPA coffers at Argus time and I'm believe most of the entrants are not even from the Cape. That money sure does nothing for cyclists outside of the area.

 

It's been a long time since I did an Argus. Be a longer time before I do another one.

 

Do you cycle at The Cradle by any chance?

Did you notice that the whole of the route / cycle lane was recently sweeped / cleaned up with a Mechanical Sweeper?

Do you know who funded that?

 

YES, CORRECT, THE PPA!!

 

Still doing nothing for the upcountry cyclist's?

[HappyMartin]

 

 

 

So if you don't get anything from the PPA why do you want them under the control of CSA? Good businesses don't want companies that they are not interested in.

 

oh sorry I get it now, you're having a moan because you have nothing better to moan about. You should play bowles instead

 

I expressed an opinion you didn't agree with. I didn't insult you. You had a go at me implying the thin air up here was affecting my thinking. Then you say I'm moaning needlessly and I should go play bowles instead.

 

Try to accept that not everyone will always agree with you. Try to understand that if someone doesn't agree with you that it is not an attack on your thinking. Just chill. It's not life or death. Save your energy for the important stuff. Good greif.

[HappyMartin]

 

 

Do you cycle at The Cradle by any chance?

Did you notice that the whole of the route / cycle lane was recently sweeped / cleaned up with a Mechanical Sweeper?

Do you know who funded that?

 

YES, CORRECT, THE PPA!!

 

Still doing nothing for the upcountry cyclist's?

 

I don't cycle the cradle but well done to the PPA for cleaning the place up. Money well spent and credit to them. I was not aware they did anything at all up here.

[DJR]

The other day I had someone tell me what a useless lot the PPA is.

 

While we were standing on the red laterite cycle path that runs around Lower Tokai. The very same path that was funded by the PPA (R300 000 I recall) and where hundreds of indigenous trees were planted by the PPA staff, personally, in anticipation for when the pines will be cut, to let us still have shade one day when we use the path!

 

That's the kind of organisation I want to look after my kind of cycling.