Give it a TRI

[Fat Boab]

I understand your logic, but does not really make sense to move incremental.... and rather flawed.

 

If a "correct" bike fit sets you up properly irrespective of a small or in this case a large change, it is better to get you adapted to the correct riding position quickly, avoiding potential injury from incorrect set up with such incremental adjustments.

 

Case in point, going from my road bike saddle height 745mm, saddle fore-aft 45mm to my TT bike 752mm, saddle fore-aft 39mm.  I can go from riding 1 bike one week to the other bike next week and back again with very little discernible discomfort adapting to the change in riding position.

 

You make a fair point, particularly with regard to road to TT positions, although those are quite small changes relative to 6cm, as well as moving away from a grossly 'bad' saddle height.

 

I suppose I look at it this way; if one wasn't sore in the old position, presumably because one had adapted to that bad position, then there would be little reason to expedite the change to avoid potential injury from the status quo. Any change from that position, be it small or large, in terms of cms, or a more aggressive position would likely need a period of adaption, so time, take it easy, keep the distance down etc, and on-going review. (If one wanted to apply basic experimental design, one wouldn't change anything else at the same time eg other activities etc, but life is too short!). EmJayZA's comments about more power & going longer (both changes as well), sore quads, suggest to me, that adaption to a large change may have been flawed (but how would I know?!). So maybe the positional change could have been adapted to more slowly in terms of time/effort etc, or maybe the positional change could have happened more slowly? Or maybe neither were the 'problem' and the increase in running mileage was the issue??

 

In my case, which obviously influences my thinking, I know I adapt v slowly to change, so if my road bike position changes, by less than 5mm, I get knee and ITB issues. If I move between 2 bikes with differing set-ups infrequently enough, I get knee and ITB issues. An aggressive position, for me, needs lots of back stretching, to avoid messing with my SI, pelvis, hammie, quad, ITB, knee chain. But I know mates who can adapt at the drop of a hat!

[shaper]

You make a fair point, particularly with regard to road to TT positions, although those are quite small changes relative to 6cm, as well as moving away from a grossly 'bad' saddle height.

 

I suppose I look at it this way; if one wasn't sore in the old position, presumably because one had adapted to that bad position, then there would be little reason to expedite the change to avoid potential injury from the status quo. Any change from that position, be it small or large, in terms of cms, or a more aggressive position would likely need a period of adaption, so time, take it easy, keep the distance down etc, and on-going review. (If one wanted to apply basic experimental design, one wouldn't change anything else at the same time eg other activities etc, but life is too short!). EmJayZA's comments about more power & going longer (both changes as well), sore quads, suggest to me, that adaption to a large change may have been flawed (but how would I know?!). So maybe the positional change could have been adapted to more slowly in terms of time/effort etc, or maybe the positional change could have happened more slowly? Or maybe neither were the 'problem' and the increase in running mileage was the issue??

 

In my case, which obviously influences my thinking, I know I adapt v slowly to change, so if my road bike position changes, by less than 5mm, I get knee and ITB issues. If I move between 2 bikes with differing set-ups infrequently enough, I get knee and ITB issues. An aggressive position, for me, needs lots of back stretching, to avoid messing with my SI, pelvis, hammie, quad, ITB, knee chain. But I know mates who can adapt at the drop of a hat!

Perhaps you missed the statement with regard to the original saddle set-up being that she could touch her toes on the floor whilst sitting on the saddle... which is a grossly incorrect original set up... as even the most basic of set-ups will tell you to have the pedal at the 6 o'clock and have your foot flat on the pedal with a slight knee bend.  Even in that most basic of riding positions your feet are nowhere near touching the floor.

 

Of course your body can adapt to riding in the wrong position and be ok, in this case the saddle way too low.

 

So a 6cm change when I first queried as being drastic was on the assumption that the bike was in a general ok set up.  As this was not the case a 6cm to move the foot from being tip-toe on the floor to being in the correct position on the pedal is not so drastic. 

 

So in response to how would you know....if you had in fact read properly EmJayZA'a first paragraph is post #709 (He did mention that he was surprised I was not battling with knee pain, so it gives you an idea my seat post was initially way too low. I could sit on my seat and my toes would just touch the ground) and knew anything about bike set-up in even the most basic form.... then a 6cm is not drastic at all.  

 

So recommending incremental adjustments to the new height is completely flawed and frankly bad advice!!

 

I highlighted that you can adapt to a changed bike set-up very quickly and you are more likely to do less harm and injury if riding in the correct bike set-up irrespective of whether it is drastically different to a completely wrong set up that you were use to and that the body will adapt quickly.

 

Further being in the right bike set-up you will use the correct muscles more efficiently, fatigue less and ultimately increase power.

 

EmjayZA, stick to your new bike position set-up by Troisports because Marc knows what he is doing!! 

[Fat Boab]

Perhaps you missed the statement with regard to the original saddle set-up being that she could touch her toes on the floor whilst sitting on the saddle... which is a grossly incorrect original set up... as even the most basic of set-ups will tell you to have the pedal at the 6 o'clock and have your foot flat on the pedal with a slight knee bend.  Even in that most basic of riding positions your feet are nowhere near touching the floor.

 

Of course your body can adapt to riding in the wrong position and be ok, in this case the saddle way too low.

 

So a 6cm change when I first queried as being drastic was on the assumption that the bike was in a general ok set up.  As this was not the case a 6cm to move the foot from being tip-toe on the floor to being in the correct position on the pedal is not so drastic. 

 

So in response to how would you know....if you had in fact read properly EmJayZA'a first paragraph is post #709 (He did mention that he was surprised I was not battling with knee pain, so it gives you an idea my seat post was initially way too low. I could sit on my seat and my toes would just touch the ground) and knew anything about bike set-up in even the most basic form.... then a 6cm is not drastic at all.  

 

So recommending incremental adjustments to the new height is completely flawed and frankly bad advice!!

 

I highlighted that you can adapt to a changed bike set-up very quickly and you are more likely to do less harm and injury if riding in the correct bike set-up irrespective of whether it is drastically different to a completely wrong set up that you were use to and that the body will adapt quickly.

 

Further being in the right bike set-up you will use the correct muscles more efficiently, fatigue less and ultimately increase power.

 

EmjayZA, stick to your new bike position set-up by Troisports because Marc knows what he is doing!! 

 

I'm not going to get into this, particularly as I was aiming my posts as discussional. Happy bike fitting.

[EmJayZA]

I'm sure it's just the angle of the photo, but that saddle tilt looks suspect......

 

I think so too. Going to reduce the angle by a degree or two and see how that impacts comfort. 

 

Not changing my fit, as I am 100% sure my ITB issues are from my running, and not cycling. After my 3 hour ride on Saturday I was fine. Did a 90 minute run the next day and in a matter of hours afterwards was hobbling around. 

[shaper]

I'm not going to get into this, particularly as I was aiming my posts as discussional. Happy bike fitting.

Good because your advise given is incorrect and I fail to see where your posts were discussional where in fact both your posts #707 and #719 was advocating and giving advice that it would be better to change incremental.... there was nothing for discussion or for debate in it.

 

Am sorry but bad advice is just wrong!!.... happy riding!

 

I think so too. Going to reduce the angle by a degree or two and see how that impacts comfort. 

 

Not changing my fit, as I am 100% sure my ITB issues are from my running, and not cycling. After my 3 hour ride on Saturday I was fine. Did a 90 minute run the next day and in a matter of hours afterwards was hobbling around. 

Have physio, ice, do the stretching exercises. Cut back on distance but run more often shorter distances.

 

if you were doing 2 short runs during the week and a 90 min at the weekend, it will be more beneficial to run more often but shorter runs 5-8kms. i.e say 5 runs a weekof short distance until the ITB subsides to mild or no pain

[IceCreamMan]

Ultimately triathlon is a dark art and what works for one does not for another. I have seen ppl take their bike for fitting and not feel good, take it to another place and they make changes as well. Both were scientific bike fits. I had a pro fit done and while my PBs Improved I started getting severe cramping on longer rides. The seat had been moved up 15 mm.

 

The ITB issues were almost certainly a result from running and general increase in activity. When I am struck by itb issues I can’t run even 2 km’s it becomes unbearable. The bike set up may of course excacerbate the issue as itb is caused essentially by rubbing causing inflammation. Worn shoes also cause it.

 

Anyway, each to his own. Off for a lil walk jog to test my knee..hopefully it’s better now. As a matter of interest there is little agreement on how to treat itb but one thing is for sure and that is lots of rest is needed.

[EmJayZA]

Running is by far my worst sport. Why is it that now all I want to do is run? It's so bad that I wonder what running up all the hills I drive over would be like. 

 

Have a run planned for tomorrow. Did a high intensity cycle on the WattBike this morning with sets at above FTP, and I got through all those quite easily (must be from the rest). Have not run since Sunday. Will see how that goes. 

 

ICM - your rides look amazing. You must be loving the scenery. Any races on the calendar?

 

Happy, injury free training all. 

Edited November 15, 2017 by EmJayZA

[IceCreamMan]

Running is by far my worst sport. Why is it that now all I want to do is run? It's so bad that I wonder what running up all the hills I drive over would be like. 

 

Have a run planned for tomorrow. Did a high intensity cycle on the WattBike this morning with sets at above FTP, and I got through all those quite easily (must be from the rest). Have not run since Sunday. Will see how that goes. 

 

ICM - your rides look amazing. You must be loving the scenery. Any races on the calendar?

 

Happy, injury free training all.

 

Sadly knee not 100 percent, was enjoying being out but the niggle started so cut the run short.

 

Yeah, I am very fortunate to live in an amazingly beautiful area with loads of historic sites. My MTB rides are mostly in woods near my house which are now muddy and one has to be careful. But damn I am enjoying the MTB, like being a kid again. It’s a cheapie and arrived 2 weeks ago with our stuff. ITs a load of fun.

 

Seems here the big thing is sportives and not out an out races, have an eye on a couple but we see what happens, also 70.3 Weymouth I will do again as I have some unfinished business there specially with the run. Then the Celtman is on my radar. Just need to find some seconds.

[EmJayZA]

Hope you heal up quickly ICM! It's so frustrating. Today is the first day I am pain free since the weekend. The foam rolling has been doing wonders. I actually really enjoy it, and can't understand why I never did it. 

 

With 94.7 on Sunday, is the Cradle going to be semi busy tomorrow? My training partner is abroad and I am a little hesitant to go out on my own if the roads are going to be quiet. 

[Cheese]

Any one here have done the Rockman's Ultra to give an indication of the Cycle and running leg route technicality and difficulty.

 

Wanted to do the Prestige Ultra but that is not happening anymore.

[IceCreamMan]

Any one here have done the Rockman's Ultra to give an indication of the Cycle and running leg route technicality and difficulty.

 

Wanted to do the Prestige Ultra but that is not happening anymore.

I did a Rockman ultra at Heia safari last year, now know as something else.

 

Holy hell, I suffered worse than any ironman I have ever done, was hell. From exiting the water in the first 5 to being stone last at 9 Kay’s on the run before a bee sting forced my much appreciated retirement. These off-road triathlons must not be underestimated.

 

But I have to say, I suck on the MTB. Lost 3 kilos on the day even while consuming liquids, think I was delirious at the end. They gave me a finishers medal for bravery .

 

Had to hide the IM tattoo that day. Every body had packed up an pretty much gone home when I got back to transition. Haha

[Cheese]

I did a Rockman ultra at Heia safari last year, now know as something else.

 

Holy hell, I suffered worse than any ironman I have ever done, was hell. From exiting the water in the first 5 to being stone last at 9 Kay’s on the run before a bee sting forced my much appreciated retirement. These off-road triathlons must not be underestimated.

 

But I have to say, I suck on the MTB. Lost 3 kilos on the day even while consuming liquids, think I was delirious at the end. They gave me a finishers medal for bravery .

 

Had to hide the IM tattoo that day. Every body had packed up an pretty much gone home when I got back to transition. Haha

Thanks, Have done a MTB duathlon and really not that much into MTB.

 

Think I will do the normal one then and not the Ultra.

 

But have three months to train so lets see.

[amr63]

So... my son & I are entered for the sprint event at Midlands Ultra this weekend.

 

Running & swimming are going well (despite a mild cold last week), but I haven’t done any riding. (Actually still need shoes too). So it’s definitely going to be a test-event.

 

Anyone else going to be at Midmar?

Edited November 21, 2017 by amr63

[ScottCM]

So... my son & I are entered for the sprint event at Midlands Ultra this weekend.

 

Running & swimming are going well (despite a mild cold last week), but I haven’t done any riding. (Actually still need shoes too). So it’s definitely going to be a test-event.

 

Anyone else going to be at Midmar?

 

Enjoy the experience. Hope my son will do a TRI with me one day. 

[@ndy]

So... my son & I are entered for the sprint event at Midlands Ultra this weekend.

 

Running & swimming are going well (despite a mild cold last week), but I haven’t done any riding. (Actually still need shoes too). So it’s definitely going to be a test-event.

 

Anyone else going to be at Midmar?

I am going to do the Ultra this weekend at Midmar. I haven't done it before and I don't know the area either. I've heard the weather will be quite favorable.

[SeaBee]

Enjoy the experience. Hope my son will do a TRI with me one day. 

I have until Feb to learn to swim. Hoping to start this afternoon. And then... to enter XTERRA and plan is to drag my daughter along and introduce her to XTERRA kids. Only pity is that she's having her birthday shortly before the event and will now do it in the oldest age bracket - most likely as the youngest in the bracket! 

 

But hey, it's for intro and fun. Think she'll love it. And at least she CAN swim.