Hunting - yes or no?

[Mousea]

To go hunting something like an elephant or any big and dangerous game...do you need to have proven yourself by shooting smaller game first or can you just rock up and blast away as a total beginner?

Any good PH should check his clients abilities before the are taken on any hunt

[Gen]

No if you're a dumb **** like this guy

 

Take the animal down quick or go play with dolls.

 

 

https://twitter.com/nealcol/status/1053104108608069633?s=19

Motherf*****. Edited October 19, 2018 by Gen

[Patchelicious]

Any good PH should check his clients abilities before the are taken on any hunt

This is where the lines can get blurred.

 

Rich American comes across, he is willing to pay big money for a hunt, abilities not great, how many guys will truly turn them away? 

[Mousea]

This is where the lines can get blurred.

 

Rich American comes across, he is willing to pay big money for a hunt, abilities not great, how many guys will truly turn them away? 

Patch my Great Uncle was a PH.

He turned down more than one American hunter that could not "hit a cow on the arse with a banjo"

There are unethical PH people out there...

But so are there Dopers in Cycling

 

But on an average the PH in South Africa are good

[J∆kk∆ls]

When I was working on a sheep farm in Murraysburg my mate and I would go hunting when we wanted meat. In the few months that I lived on the farm, I can't remember us ever buying meat unless friends were visiting from the coast we would ask them to bring fish. I enjoy going out on the odd occasion with the 30-06 and looking for a Khudu or a Springbok. We always took care to bring the animal down with one shot. 

 

I don't support hunters that travel the world in search for trophies or hunters that shoot at anything that moves. 

 

I also worked my own meat in the butchery making biltong and wors but when I moved back to the city I stopped hunting as I got meat from the butcher so there was no need. 

Edited October 19, 2018 by J∆kk∆ls

[Patchelicious]

serious question / comment. I have always found it quite weird that hunters get such negative press all the time, but fishermen never do. Generally speaking hunters, in some way or other, replace what they take - usually through the huge amounts of money they pay. Fishermen dont. they just take from the wild in, what i consider, a much more inhumane and cruel way. the oceans are currently in a terrible state but we still have this romantic view about fishing.

Cultural conditioning is a fact of life that we need acknowledge.

 

Animals, especially the ones we grow up with loving, will illicit much emotions than those which we don't share the same love for. Its the don't eat dogs but eating pigs is ok argument.

 

But ones can be a little facetious and swing the hyperbole the other way. If hunters are ok with culling animals for the sake of the planet, would they also be ok with culling people, if conservation of the plant is their motive?

[leeubok]

So I'm guilty of something that I haven't done simply because I said I have a right to do it.

 

I was also very clear on the type of hunter I have an issue with, the one who take pleasure in killing for the sake of it. Now, you took that as all hunter.

 

You asked me to engage rationally, which I have subsequently tried to do, but if you are going to keep putting words in my mouth, I am going to have to correct you each time, which detracts from what you say you are trying to achieve.

Patch, you're debating in circles and not making a valid point. ALL "hunters" will take pleasure in bringing down their prey. Even the biltong-hunters. yes the end result is the meat, but they're not going to hunt themselves if they didn't enjoy it. Then you'd rather get someone else to hunt for your, or just buy the venison from a butcher. 

 

You have also not rationally given an alternative to hunting. Or told me why it doesn't contribute to conservation. 

[Patchelicious]

Patch my Great Uncle was a PH.

He turned down more than one American hunter that could not "hit a cow on the arse with a banjo"

There are unethical PH people out there...

But so are there Dopers in Cycling

 

But on an average the PH in South Africa are good

Im sure there are, in fact I know there are. I have hunted before, and thats where I found out that I dont like killing animals. The PH we had was very good and very ethical and loved the animals, I know that might sound conflicting, be they really cared for them.

 

Again those are not the people that I have a problem with. The people I have a problem with are like that handlebar moustache guy in the elephant video. (but apparently that means I hate ALL hunters) and then those who facilitate these staged hunts.

Edited October 19, 2018 by Patchelicious

[leeubok]

As for that elephant hunt video. It is actually against the law what he did. You are not allowed to hunt an elephant that is part of a herd. You are only allowed to hunt solitary bulls. That PH's license should be taken away from him

[Patchelicious]

Patch, you're debating in circles and not making a valid point. ALL "hunters" will take pleasure in bringing down their prey. Even the biltong-hunters. yes the end result is the meat, but they're not going to hunt themselves if they didn't enjoy it. Then you'd rather get someone else to hunt for your, or just buy the venison from a butcher. 

 

You have also not rationally given an alternative to hunting. Or told me why it doesn't contribute to conservation. 

Apologies, I was not aware that I was obliged to do so.

 

You are clearly more educated in this field than I am, so what do you think is a plausible alternative to hunting for conservation?

[Gen]

As for that elephant hunt video. It is actually against the law what he did. You are not allowed to hunt an elephant that is part of a herd. You are only allowed to hunt solitary bulls. That PH's license should be taken away from him

Are the laws the same in Nambia as here?

[J∆kk∆ls]

If you hate all hunters then don't be surprised at someone that hates all cyclists! 

[forkie]

Cultural conditioning is a fact of life that we need acknowledge.

 

Animals, especially the ones we grow up with loving, will illicit much emotions than those which we don't share the same love for. Its the don't eat dogs but eating pigs is ok argument.

 

But ones can be a little facetious and swing the hyperbole the other way. If hunters are ok with culling animals for the sake of the planet, would they also be ok with culling people, if conservation of the plant is their motive?

we used to do it a lot in the past. it was called war

[Patchelicious]

If you hate all hunters then don't be surprised at someone that hates all cyclists! 

This is the point I made earlier.

 

Seems that we are obliged to pick a side and then fight relentlessly for that side, regardless of rational discussion. Its lazy. I don't like certain hunters, that means I automatically hate all hunters. I don't like Trump, that must mean I am Libtard. 

 

Putting those opposing a part of your argument in the same box as those who oppose your argument in its entirety is lazy!

[leeubok]

Apologies, I was not aware that I was obliged to do so.

 

You are clearly more educated in this field than I am, so what do you think is a plausible alternative to hunting for conservation?

 

There is none. My whole point is that without the option of hunting on the 1000's of small game farms across the country, we would see an incredible loss in biodiversity. Natural habitat is already so fragmented, and will be even more so if those land owners change the land use on their properties.

 

As to your question about the lions. Lions are incredibly difficult to manage. It's not as simple as introducing a pride and you then leave them to sort out the bokkies and manage themselves. They breed, too quickly for their own good. So you can then either cull, or relocate to other areas. Relocation is becoming difficult because in SA, the market for lions is saturated. Plus lions now have all kinds of diseases, including TB. 

Edited October 19, 2018 by leeubok

[Gen]

If you hate all hunters then don't be surprised at someone that hates all cyclists!

I hate every single big game trophy hunter out there.

 

My son was invited to a bday party when he was little and we walked into the lapa and there were a few big 5 trophies mounted on the wall..my son burst out in tears..I told them they disgust me and we left.

Edited October 19, 2018 by Gen