Enduro/gravity bike suspension and geo

[Captain Fastbastard Mayhem]

Are you making this up?

Who climbs with their seat that low?

sadly, no...

[Headshot]

That's really how they measure effective SA - just stupid. That's why the only number that matter is actual SA - especially for guys on the taller end of a size that run their seatposts far out. Then actual becomes very slack.

As long as the user knows this, its not much of a problem. I didnt but its never really bothered me. A bike that has a steeper STA is just that, steeper and because its a standard measure you can compare bikes easily. 

[Rigardt@Scott]

Okay, so question for the geometry knowers.

 

I'm getting a Transition Sentinel on Monday, much slacker and longer than anything I have owned before. Transition bases their geo on what they call SBG (Speed Balanced Geo). Basically super long (475mm reach in L), super slack (64° HA), which is balanced with a short stem (40mm), steep SA, and a reduced offset fork (42-44mm as oposed to 51mm) to being the front wheel closer to the rider which reduces front wheel flop in slow speed stuff and gives better traction. By all accounts the 7mm reduced offset actually makes a difference and is not just some gimic.

 

 

I am building everything over from my Evil incl. my standard offset Ribbin. Somewhere down the line I want to buy a Fox 36, Grip 2 fork with reduced offset, but they are expensive, so it will take a while to save up. For now the Ribbon with standard offset will do the job.

 

So my question, SBG is based on a 40mm stem and short offset fork to get weight over the front wheel. My logic tells me that when using a standard offset fork, using a 50mm stem may have the same effect getting weight over the front wheel. What do you guys think? Will it work, or should I just stick with a 40mm stem?

 

Obviously I will play around with both to see what works for me, but everything on the bike will be new and take a while to get used to - so some advice on a starting point would be good if anyone has experience with this?

[Thermophage]

Okay, so question for the geometry knowers.

 

I'm getting a Transition Sentinel on Monday, much slacker and longer than anything I have owned before. Transition bases their geo on what they call SBG (Speed Balanced Geo). Basically super long (475mm reach in L), super slack (64° HA), which is balanced with a short stem (40mm), steep SA, and a reduced offset fork (42-44mm as oposed to 51mm) to being the front wheel closer to the rider which reduces front wheel flop in slow speed stuff and gives better traction. By all accounts the 7mm reduced offset actually makes a difference and is not just some gimic.

 

 

I am building everything over from my Evil incl. my standard offset Ribbin. Somewhere down the line I want to buy a Fox 36, Grip 2 fork with reduced offset, but they are expensive, so it will take a while to save up. For now the Ribbon with standard offset will do the job.

 

So my question, SBG is based on a 40mm stem and short offset fork to get weight over the front wheel. My logic tells me that when using a standard offset fork, using a 50mm stem may have the same effect getting weight over the front wheel. What do you guys think? Will it work, or should I just stick with a 40mm stem?

 

Obviously I will play around with both to see what works for me, but everything on the bike will be new and take a while to get used to - so some advice on a starting point would be good if anyone has experience with this?

Simple answer is save your money, keep your parts, run a 50mm stem.

I had the exact reservations when I moved late last year from a 2016 Banshee Spitfire, which has pretty modern geo, to a 2018 Transition Patrol.

Running a 44mm offset as opposed to the 37mm offset. Initially running a 33mm stem which was perfect on the Spitfire but "odd" on the Patrol. Swapped over to a 50mm stem and felt great. Although this MIGHT be because I had adjusted a bit to how differently one rides the SBG bikes.

So don't consider changing forks just yet. We have a mate with a XL Sentinel and reduced offset fork (Ribbon Coil as those are available in a reduced offset too). SO potentially you guys could wif...bike swap and see how much difference there is ITO handling etc.

I can tell you one thing, the 64HA is no detriment whatsoever to climbing performance while seated on these bikes. The steeper ST really puts you in a forward position and front wheel grip is amazing. Similarly if you REALLY want to get the most out of it when going down or going fast you will need to learn to ride the front of the bike more than you may be used to with the Evil.

[Captain Fastbastard Mayhem]

Okay, so question for the geometry knowers.

 

I'm getting a Transition Sentinel on Monday, much slacker and longer than anything I have owned before. Transition bases their geo on what they call SBG (Speed Balanced Geo). Basically super long (475mm reach in L), super slack (64° HA), which is balanced with a short stem (40mm), steep SA, and a reduced offset fork (42-44mm as oposed to 51mm) to being the front wheel closer to the rider which reduces front wheel flop in slow speed stuff and gives better traction. By all accounts the 7mm reduced offset actually makes a difference and is not just some gimic.

 

 

I am building everything over from my Evil incl. my standard offset Ribbin. Somewhere down the line I want to buy a Fox 36, Grip 2 fork with reduced offset, but they are expensive, so it will take a while to save up. For now the Ribbon with standard offset will do the job.

 

So my question, SBG is based on a 40mm stem and short offset fork to get weight over the front wheel. My logic tells me that when using a standard offset fork, using a 50mm stem may have the same effect getting weight over the front wheel. What do you guys think? Will it work, or should I just stick with a 40mm stem?

 

Obviously I will play around with both to see what works for me, but everything on the bike will be new and take a while to get used to - so some advice on a starting point would be good if anyone has experience with this?

As thermophage says above, but also... Ribbon Coil. Cheaper, coil, ramp control goodness. Or, Lyrik RC2. LOVING mine.  

Edited February 14, 2019 by Captain Fatbastard Mayhem

[Thermophage]

Also, Cane Creek is releasing the Helm in reduced offset shortly and having had one for the last few months I finally hit the sweet tinkering spot on the fork and holy hell is it nice 

[Jewbacca]

they have some sexy hardtails!

They are basically just 3 tattoo'd weirdo's who make some pretty weird and wonderful bikes!

 

I am on the look out for a proper fun to ride Trail bike. 

 

Everything these days is too slack and a tank.

 

The Marin Rift Zone looks nice, but our trails aren't steep enough for any of this crazy long and slack stuff.

 

If we had parks with uplift I would have bought one of those FR frames from Sick months ago!

 

As it stands an affordable trail bike with decent reach and pedalable numbers seems to be missing.

 

The Marin rift zone comes in at 14kg less pedals.

 

If any of you have any decent suggestions for a really fun, pedallable trail bike that isn't a western Australian road train I'm all ears!

[Rigardt@Scott]

Simple answer is save your money, keep your parts, run a 50mm stem.

I had the exact reservations when I moved late last year from a 2016 Banshee Spitfire, which has pretty modern geo, to a 2018 Transition Patrol.

Running a 44mm offset as opposed to the 37mm offset. Initially running a 33mm stem which was perfect on the Spitfire but "odd" on the Patrol. Swapped over to a 50mm stem and felt great. Although this MIGHT be because I had adjusted a bit to how differently one rides the SBG bikes.

So don't consider changing forks just yet. We have a mate with a XL Sentinel and reduced offset fork (Ribbon Coil as those are available in a reduced offset too). SO potentially you guys could wif...bike swap and see how much difference there is ITO handling etc.

I can tell you one thing, the 64HA is no detriment whatsoever to climbing performance while seated on these bikes. The steeper ST really puts you in a forward position and front wheel grip is amazing. Similarly if you REALLY want to get the most out of it when going down or going fast you will need to learn to ride the front of the bike more than you may be used to with the Evil.

Good to hear, so the logic checks out then, I will stick to the 50mm stemm and my current Fork (which I love).

[Hairy]

First things first .... congrats on the bike.

 

Now to make your life simple, can you not just get the Ribbons lowers in a 42-44mm offset?

 

If so, I am sure it could save you a wad of cash that can be spent on a good couple of beers?

 

Okay, so question for the geometry knowers.

I'm getting a Transition Sentinel on Monday, much slacker and longer than anything I have owned before. Transition bases their geo on what they call SBG (Speed Balanced Geo). Basically super long (475mm reach in L), super slack (64° HA), which is balanced with a short stem (40mm), steep SA, and a reduced offset fork (42-44mm as oposed to 51mm) to being the front wheel closer to the rider which reduces front wheel flop in slow speed stuff and gives better traction. By all accounts the 7mm reduced offset actually makes a difference and is not just some gimic.


I am building everything over from my Evil incl. my standard offset Ribbin. Somewhere down the line I want to buy a Fox 36, Grip 2 fork with reduced offset, but they are expensive, so it will take a while to save up. For now the Ribbon with standard offset will do the job.

So my question, SBG is based on a 40mm stem and short offset fork to get weight over the front wheel. My logic tells me that when using a standard offset fork, using a 50mm stem may have the same effect getting weight over the front wheel. What do you guys think? Will it work, or should I just stick with a 40mm stem?

Obviously I will play around with both to see what works for me, but everything on the bike will be new and take a while to get used to - so some advice on a starting point would be good if anyone has experience with this?

[Rigardt@Scott]

As thermophage says above, but also... Ribbon Coil. Cheaper, coil, ramp control goodness. Or, Lyrik RC2. LOVING mine.

I may in the future do a coil conversion on my Ribbon, but would want to ride one extensively before doing it - coz once it's done there is no going back!

 

And before I would conver to coil in the front I would do coil on the back. But once again, am very happy with air, so I would wanna test a coil out lots before even thinking of it.

[Rigardt@Scott]

First things first .... congrats on the bike.

 

Now to make your life simple, can you not just get the Ribbons lowers in a 42-44mm offset?

 

If so, I am sure it could save you a wad of cash that can be spent on a good couple of beers?

Thanks, very keen to get a leg over, hopefully the couriers play alond deliver tomorrow!

 

Aha.... I hadn't even thought of that option, would be the cheapest by a LONG shot. Thanks for the inspiration

 

The Ribbon comes in a 46mm offset as far as I know, so 5mm difference from mine.

Edited February 14, 2019 by Grease_Monkey

[Hairy]

you know all you need to is get Mr Mercer to slap a custom frame together for you

 

They are basically just 3 tattoo'd weirdo's who make some pretty weird and wonderful bikes!

 

I am on the look out for a proper fun to ride Trail bike. 

 

Everything these days is too slack and a tank.

 

The Marin Rift Zone looks nice, but our trails aren't steep enough for any of this crazy long and slack stuff.

 

If we had parks with uplift I would have bought one of those FR frames from Sick months ago!

 

As it stands an affordable trail bike with decent reach and pedalable numbers seems to be missing.

 

The Marin rift zone comes in at 14kg less pedals.

 

If any of you have any decent suggestions for a really fun, pedallable trail bike that isn't a western Australian road train I'm all ears!

[Jewbacca]

you know all you need to is get Mr Mercer to slap a custom frame together for you

hahahahaha Sjoe.... I think his dual sussers go for about 40k?

[Thermophage]

I may in the future do a coil conversion on my Ribbon, but would want to ride one extensively before doing it - coz once it's done there is no going back!

 

And before I would conver to coil in the front I would do coil on the back. But once again, am very happy with air, so I would wanna test a coil out lots before even thinking of it.

Just keep in mind the Tranny on the rear is super progressive. So much so that I removed all the volume spacers which were in the air can to tame it down a bit and now rides really well...However...I was running a coil shock on the Spitfire and man o man...What I wouldn't do to have a coil shock on the Patrol!

[Rigardt@Scott]

Just keep in mind the Tranny on the rear is super progressive. So much so that I removed all the volume spacers which were in the air can to tame it down a bit and now rides really well...However...I was running a coil shock on the Spitfire and man o man...What I wouldn't do to have a coil shock on the Patrol!

Good to hear! I'm heavy and like a decent amount of sag, so I need progressive! Which is also great for coil

[Hairy]

Thought you were #Hardtail4Life 

 

Then there is also Calculus Bikes that can weld together a custom Ti Duallie for you at 45K, or a Ti HT at 35K .... 

 

 

hahahahaha Sjoe.... I think his dual sussers go for about 40k?