Flats vs Cleats. Your findings

[Meezo]

Tried but made no difference to me unfortunately

The "duckfoot" technique mentioned in that thread did make improvements

I notice the numb feet more on trails like Red Phoenix and Armageddon 

On Plumber/Status there are too many other things for a noob like me to worry about than to notice feet going numb   like just making it down without shattering something 

Would take a lot from me to go down there clipped in I reckon 

Still just want to try clips out to make a fair comparison someday...don't want to be missing out on something that could be potentially much more fun/improve my riding 

 

 

haha I've only been down those clipped in, I'm too nervous to go down on flats...

 

but i did end myself on Armageddon the same day i had clean/smooth run down Status

 

[Enduro newbie]

Why is it impossible for these companies to produce a proper flats riding shoe with a boa closure shoe?

 

Do I HAVE to look like a kid who's lost his skateboard?

Think its a different market.

 

Some people don't want to wear full XC shoes. Also it you have to carry your bike  or walk back up a hill, those carbon XC shoes are ****. Not to mention wearing them all day.

 

I think the market can offer 2 different styles of shoes but it think they catering more toward the "casual/skate shoe" and most of the current clientele  will kick against the XC shoe.

 

So get loose, stick that foot out and drift that corner Bro, its only shoes

[henningvr]

"Flats forever." - Sam Hill

 

https://dirtmountainbike.com/features/flat-pedals-endangered-species.html

[DR ◣◢]

"Flats forever." - Sam Hill

 

https://dirtmountainbike.com/features/flat-pedals-endangered-species.html

That is one seriously well written piece that drives home the fact that racers win races, not pedals.

[DR ◣◢]

Back on clips for the first time in 10 years or so. I’ve spent at least 50% of my cycling career on flats and the other 50% clipped in so I knew what to expect today.

 

Clipped in is a real game changer. Not for the better and not for the worse.

 

Findings:

 

My average speed though the 20km trail we ride all the time stayed exactly the same.

 

Couple of new PRs on the climbs. Not related to the pedals though. I lost weight this week and knowingly pushed a little harder on sections.

 

I love how you can make micro adjustments with the whole bike by lifting the wheel with the pedals. Bad habit but a very useful one. I can do the same on flats but I hardly ever do. I pick better lines with flats.

 

I hate jumps when clipped in. Even when using the correct technique I feel that attachment to the pedals will affect the bike in the air.

 

I hate the disconnected feel between the soles and the pedal. Yes I’m using the pins that came with the pedals and no spacer on the cleats. Still not a solid contact patch.

 

Being light on the bike and not worrying about slipping a pedal is nice. Then again I’ve never in 8 years slipped a pedal with Five Tens.

 

Speed at which I can get my foot out is the same as getting my foot off a flat pedal. Muscle memory from years of racing downhill clipped in.

 

More numb toes than with flats. Smaller unsupported platform I think.

 

I don’t hate being clipped in. I don’t love it either.

 

Pedals used : DMR V-Twin

Shoes used: Afton

[Spafsack]

Nice comments

Strange how we all getting numb feet...regardless of flats or clipped in.

[DR ◣◢]

One thing to add. The “you can push and pull to increase efficiency” is utter bs to me. My riding style is spinning the gears vs pushing a harder gear. It doesn’t work for spinning. Not for me anyways.

 

I’m sure it’s good on road riding and dirt roads. Not on single track and tech trails.

[Jewbacca]

One thing to add. The “you can push and pull to increase efficiency” is utter bs to me. My riding style is spinning the gears vs pushing a harder gear. It doesn’t work for spinning. Not for me anyways.

 

I’m sure it’s good on road riding and dirt roads. Not on single track and tech trails.

No man...

 

It is 100% not BS but it needs to be taken in context. One is not going to be sitting and pedalling with an even pedal stroke while descending. 

 

Also, it 100% works for spinning. It actually works incredibly for spinning, look at Chris Froome.

 

This is just a case of technical deficiency on your part, if you practiced the right things enough you will definitely see a difference.

 

I ride both flats and clipless.

 

I 100% won't go and ride the jump line at black hill or Dirt jumps clipped in, but I'm also 100% not going to arrive at an XCO on flats.

 

They are not 1 vs the other.... One is not better than the other BUT there is science behind an even pedal stroke. If there was not, more pro's would be racing XCO and XCM in flats. (As an aside, they don't).

 

Let's not confuse preference and our very limited 'kook' experience with truth.

 

I can run the same speed 400m barefoot or with spikes. Does that mean barefoot is as efficient and effective as spikes, or does that mean that I am so terrible at the 400m it doesn't matter what shoes I wear/don't wear as they only start making a difference when my speed/fitness/technique and efficiency is closer to being primed?

 

90% of us commenting on this thread are so far from being technically decent our kit is all just bird song anyway.

[DR ◣◢]

It’s doesn’t work for me so I’ll call it bs when it applies to my riding. I’m not in the least bit new to this. It doesn’t work for me and it has never worked for me.

 

I consider myself a little bit above technically decent. Not my first rodeo.

Edited September 24, 2020 by DR ◣◢

[Wimmas]

When I used to own a road bike I used cleats. On the first few rides I fell a few times due to stupidity and not releasing at like stop streets etc. Once I got the hang of it there was not even a consideration for flat pedals.

 

Then I sold my road bike and started mountain biking. First bike came with flat pedals and I did not feel the need to change to clip ins. Got around quite well but I was still amateur with mtb'ing.

 

Second mountain bike came with no pedals so I bought Shimano SPD's and clipped in again. Fell my arse off once but again due to stupidity. Cleats were set too tight and I could not get my foot released fast enough when I slipped and ended with a nice roastie from the top of my foot till under my knee. Carried on after that and eventually sold the bike.

 

Third bike came with flats and I again just left it on. Came by just fine.

 

Current bike has decent flats on and what I can tell you in my experience is I feel confident on especially technical uphills / thick sand etc. Where I lack confidence is technical downhills or standing and sprinting. Downhills because if you are not careful your foot can easily bounce off the pedals. Standing and sprinting because once my foot slipped off the pedal and I almost lost my manhood. For those two reasons I would consider going clip in again, but for now and my type of riding the flats suit me well.

 

Oh and I cannot care less what anyone thinks of me due to me riding with flats. It is a preference and does not define your skill or experience.

Edited September 24, 2020 by Wimmas

[Eldron]

Nice comments

Strange how we all getting numb feet...regardless of flats or clipped in.

 

Nobody with (mostly) normal feet should have numb feet in clipless pedals. Flats you can of course move your foot around but clipless should allow you to put your cleat in the right spot to spread the pressure around the 2 plantar zones evenly and avoid hot/numb feet.

[DR ◣◢]

It was a brand new pair of shoes and my initial setup was to get the ball of my foot over the axle as I normally ride like that on flats. Cleat is pushed over to inside to push out my foot a bit.

 

100% sure it comes down to setup in this case.

[Eldron]

It was a brand new pair of shoes and my initial setup was to get the ball of my foot over the axle as I normally ride like that on flats. Cleat is pushed over to inside to push out my foot a bit.

 

100% sure it comes down to setup in this case.

 

Aim for the axle to be midway between 1st and 5th metatarsal. Below the ball is old school :-)

 

Shoes parallel to bike is a good place to start for angle then work towards knee stability from there.

 

Q factor is pelvic width dependent.

[DR ◣◢]

Thanks. Will have to pull out the old iMuscle app to pin point the location.

[Eldron]

Thanks. Will have to pull out the old iMuscle app to pin point the location.

 

Easiest way is to mark the two metatarsals on the outside of your shoe then flip it over and find the midpoint.

 

Most cleats have some kind of axle reference so you just line up the reference point with your midpoint. Job done!

[DR ◣◢]

Managed to sort out the numb toes about 99%. Adjusted the cleats correctly. Interesting how much different my left foot is in terms of angling the clear.

 

At 30km today my left pinkie toe started getting numb and I had pain on the outside of the foot. Made another adjustment tonight and will see tomorrow how it goes.