Crosstraining?

[SwissVan]

I'm going home to run in the dark and to improve my hill climbing and reaction times.

[pedal on the downhills]

Lefty, your bad manners are matched only by your ignorance. Come back when you have learnt the difference between fact and opinion, as i don't have the inclination to spell it out for you. 

 

Given how long people have doing core strength trianing, funny how there are no studies showing it increases cycling power output.

 

The point is being horribly confused here. No-one from the orthodox scientific community (or just the common sense one) disputes that core training is good idea, and it will help back pain, comfot, whole body fatigue and so on. But to state as fact that it increases cycling power is either just unsupported by any evidence - not anyone's opinion - so your believibg it or saying it doesn;t make it so.

 

This really is getting futile. Next we'll be hearing those idiotic nose strips improve performance..

[Windbreaker]

Next we'll be hearing those idiotic nose strips improve performance..

 

No! Don't tell me! I've just bought a box of 500! Anyone want fashionable nose strips??

[bruce]

 

Next we'll be hearing those idiotic nose strips improve performance..

 

No! Don't tell me! I've just bought a box of 500! Anyone want fashionable nose strips??

 

Only if they are neon pink or green!!

 

[bruce]

 

if cardiovascular efficiency is the only limiting factor in cycling and not muscle strength' date=' why is a women that is of equal size to a man (ie same size lungs and heart) def not equal in cycling ability.. [/quote']

 

'cause they are just lazy ...

 

eish WB - you into extreme sports or what??

 

[BikeMax]

 

 

 

 

[QUOTE=GoLefty!!]Sorry Bruce and Bikemax but you talking out of your arses again.

 

Core training does improve on the bike power and many pro cyclist use cross training to keep their core in shape.

 

Please explain your thinking behind this theory - I would be very interested to hear it - and while you are at it why not post us some evidence showing increased power output as a result of core strength (or any strength) training ??

 

Oh -but the pro's do it - it must be good then...

 

 

Cycling does NOT use all the muscle groups.

 

[/quote']

 

You got that right - so we probably do not need to train them all ??

 

 

A mate of mine wrote up a nice brief  on this t the MTB mailing list where a similar debate raged. Here it is attached.

 

 

 

[/quote']

 

Boy - he really knows his stuff...

 

When will you get it - strength does not limit performance in endurance cycling - this a proven fact.

 

So you can put forward as much anecdotal evidence as you like and you can be as forceful and confident as you clearly feel in posting your opinion, but I am afraid you are not going to be able to back up your opinions with any real evidence - "the pro's do it" or "I have this mate who says.." does not really cut it I am afraid.

 

Oh..and neither does the obnoxious approach you have taken here.

 

[BikeMax]

 

if cardiovascular efficiency is the only limiting factor in cycling and not muscle strength' date=' why is a pro woman that is of equal size to a pro man (ie same size lungs and heart) def not equal in cycling ability.. [/quote']

 

They don't have the same size lungs and heart - but more importantly they do not have the same CV capacity.

 

Why do male marathon runners run faster than female - you think it is down to muscle mass ?

 

 

 

[epoh]

What does it come down to when you ride up a 10km big climb at say 10% avg gradient in your 53/11 ? Muscle strength and CV capacity or just CV capacity?

 

[BikeMax]

 

What does it come down to when you ride up a 10km big climb at say 10% avg gradient in your 53/11 ? Muscle strength and CV capacity or just CV capacity?

 

CV Capacity

 

[epoh]

 

but, let's say you take like a kenian marathon runner that most likely has a very well developed CV system and you put him on that climb with that gear ratio against a pro cyclist climber..he should then compete well against the cyclist? 

[BikeMax]

 

but' date=' let's say you take like a kenian marathon runner that most likely has a very well developed CV system and you put him on that climb with that gear ratio against a pro cyclist climber..he should then compete well against the cyclist? 

[/quote']

 

Training specificity - the cyclist rides a bike and the runner runs - either would perform better on their own turf.

 

[ZippIt]

bikemax has all the answers

 

All this talk bodes well for my scrawnyness even if i'm not totally convinced

[epoh]

 

but' date=' let's say you take like a kenian marathon runner that most likely has a very well developed CV system and you put him on that climb with that gear ratio against a pro cyclist climber..he should then compete well against the cyclist? 

[/quote']

 

Training specificity - the cyclist rides a bike and the runner runs - either would perform better on their own turf.

 

understood.. but both have a very well developed CV system ? Doesn't it come down to strength then? The cyclist will be "stronger" in his sport because his muscles are better developed for his turf? Either are going to be stronger in their respective sport because either have developed specific muscles. The cyclist's muscles would automatically be "weaker" for running, despite the fact that he also has a well developed CV system ?? 

 

Im a bit confused..cannot see how it comes down to CV and not also include muscle strength.

 

 

 

[FanieFiets]

Hierdie hele redenasie oor CV en muscle strenght maak nie heeltemal sin vir my nie.

 

As wat julle se waar is moet die volgende waar wees:

Vat enige super marathon atleet in die wereld. Al het hy nog NOOIT op 'n fiets geklim nie sal hy 'n Argus onder 3 uur gaan trap,  omdat hy 'n ongelooflike CV het.

 

Dit maak nie vir my sin nie en is NIE waar nie.

Ek is seker wat julle se is die basis van die oorspronklike bewysde redenasie.  Maar julle ooreenvoudig dit totaal en dan en dan stry julle oor die 'verkeerde' teorie.

[epoh]

 

Hierdie hele redenasie oor CV en muscle strenght maak nie heeltemal sin vir my nie.

 

As wat julle se waar is moet die volgende waar wees:

Vat enige super marathon atleet in die wereld. Al het hy nog NOOIT op 'n fiets geklim nie sal hy 'n Argus onder 3 uur gaan trap' date='  omdat hy 'n ongelooflike CV het.

 

Dit maak nie vir my sin nie en is NIE waar nie.

Ek is seker wat julle se is die basis van die oorspronklike bewysde redenasie.  Maar julle ooreenvoudig dit totaal en dan en dan stry julle oor die 'verkeerde' teorie.

[/quote']

 

ek gaan vir jou vra om vir my daai een in engels oor te tik

 

[bruce]

All these arguments are proving that cross-training doesn't actually work.

 

Training specificity encompasses two things:

1. Joint angle - i.e. the range of muscle movement.

2. Contraction velocity - how fast and repetably the muscle is contracted.

 

When muscles get trained for a certain task, it is not just the muscle that changes i.e. increased mitochondria etc, but neural changes as well (what is often referred to as muscle memory).

 

None of these changes impact the actual strength of the muscle, but they impact the efficiency of the muscles.

 

So, in the case of an elite runner doing a cycling race, he may have an efficient CV system, but his muscles are not efficient for the task they are being asked to do.

 

That being said - he would still outperform a body-builder in any endurance event, such as cycling.