Riding up the DOWNhills at Tokai

[I can has a nike]

Headshot - I agree - I ride both DH and XC in Tokai (though am more of an XC fan TBH) and I don't mind moving over for some DHer belting down... I generally also call out how many riders are behind me too - just so he/she knows.

 

My problem is being screamed at by some clown at the top of a run I have just come up telling me I have no right being on "his trail" - we have such a small area of mountain as it is - what a good idea to segregate it into DH and XC cos you know, "We don't like you on our tracks".

 

If people were just civil - move over for the guy who has right of way (and if you can't work that out - it is the guy belting down at 60kph - not you heading up at 20)

and then get back on your bike to head on up again - it isn't gonna hurt your average time.

 

And to you DH'ers - would it really hurt you to pause at the top of a run? really? Is it gonna ruin your day if you have to wait 10 seconds to see if there is someone coming up? no. sorry. it isn't, you take long enough to get up as it is

 

FFS guys lets not get into some stupid argument when we all know what is needed here - just some basic mountain etiquette.

[splat]

My personal view after nearly 16 years of riding at Tokai and surrounds.

 

I ride a 100/120 mm marathon bike that is set up for dh grip. It could manage just about anything Tokai could throw at it if I was brave enough. Mastering the gap jump on My Roots was quite a mental challenge for me but felt amazing when I finally had the courage to take it. I tackle the singletrack (not the 600m of DH)as fast as possible and try and ride as many jumps and bumps as possible. To me the technical dh s/track where where the fun is, so I generally ride the jeep track up and rip the s/track on the way down. The exception is Boulders and Fairy which I ride both ways.

 

I have no problem with people cycling up some of the more DH oriented tracks that I would never ride up, however, common sense should prevail, especially on those tracks that are effectively DH only - the 600m mentioned in this thread - and the other steeper pieces of singeltrack. Surely the fact that ist step, there are plank judmps and such like indicates people are going to be coming down there, probably at pace?

 

If so, expect bikes to be coming down at speed sometime semi out of control. You are not riding up the fairy garden anymore!If you see me coming, and its possible, please try and let me pass or at least move over a bit. At the same time, when I am bombing down your chosen peice of singletrack, I'll be watching ahead, probably more focused on the trail than you are because I could crash, and I'll try and avoid you while maintaining my momentum. I'm sure this could work - it just requires some common sense and courtesy from both sides.

 

Not everyone is into this sport for the adrenaline - skills levels vary hugely and there are a lot of beginners out there but if we act properly we can all get our kicks on the same trails...

 

My 3c

 

 

Headshot - I agree - I ride both DH and XC in Tokai (though am more of an XC fan TBH) and I don't mind moving over for some DHer belting down... I generally also call out how many riders are behind me too - just so he/she knows.

 

My problem is being screamed at by some clown at the top of a run I have just come up telling me I have no right being on "his trail" - we have such a small area of mountain as it is - what a good idea to segregate it into DH and XC cos you know, "We don't like you on our tracks".

 

If people were just civil - move over for the guy who has right of way (and if you can't work that out - it is the guy belting down at 60kph - not you heading up at 20)

and then get back on your bike to head on up again - it isn't gonna hurt your average time.

 

And to you DH'ers - would it really hurt you to pause at the top of a run? really? Is it gonna ruin your day if you have to wait 10 seconds to see if there is someone coming up? no. sorry. it isn't, you take long enough to get up as it is

 

FFS guys lets not get into some stupid argument when we all know what is needed here - just some basic mountain etiquette.

 

You two okes must be new.

We don't behave like this on The Hub.

There is no space for this kind of sensible opinion here.

[Eddy Gordo]

I dont really want to wade in on the argument, but I am not sure where the rules for Tokai are posted. Specifically for direction on the trails. Other mtb parks in SA have directional routes and clear signage at both ends of the trail.

 

I do agree that there is going to be a huge crash, if there hasn't already been one.

 

I like this idea. I think it is time that tokai does what alot of other trails have, and that is single direction routes. This way alot of damage can be avoided

[splat]

I like this idea. I think it is time that tokai does what alot of other trails have, and that is single direction routes. This way alot of damage can be avoided

 

In theory, it should work.

But you always get special people who think rules don't apply to them and ignore the signs.

[Captain Fastbastard Mayhem]

Headshot - it's for that very reason that I check before going down into Vasbyt, and the other DH tracks. I've been met with too many people thinking that they are the only ones on the trail, and are mortified when I come around a corner at a rate of knots only to pull up 1m short of them in a flurry of dust and dirt.

 

Let's not even begin mentioning the other ST section where everyone is god and can do no wrong. I'm a bit believer in the notion that starting again on an up section is easier than starting again going down - mainly because you need to be clipped in so much more quickly when going down - have you ever tried to do a technical section out the saddle with only one foot clipped in? I have. Unwillingly. And it bit. Hard.

 

Whilst everyone is in essence right in at least one tiny section of their posts, a lot of common sense is being lost here when the uppers claim dominion over the downers. It's just common sense that you SHOULD get out of the way for somoene doing 80 kph on a 20kg machine. Like it's just plain common sense to look left and right when crossing the road, or NOT playing chicken. Who can get out of the way faster? The guy going up at 10kph, or the guy going down at 50kph? For one of them, it's 2 wheels off the side of the trail, and a puncture or an interrupted uphill slog at the worst. For the other, it's 50m of slowing down, and those same 2 wheels off the track mean coming off the bike where the BEST case scenario is a scratched hand or arm. Worst case, you ask? Just ask the guy who went away in an ambulance this past weekend for losing control at speed.

 

What, you may ask, is the solution? Certainly not speed limits. Education education education. And at least a smidgen of common sense NOT to ride up the DownHill tracks, or at least to constantly be on the lookout for the guys coming down. The correct signage will form part of the solution. But then so will keeping your head up, your ipod off and your eyes open for any fellow trail rider. Because as we have seen, tensions run high on these fora. I thought we were supposed to be better than the roadies? More... at peace. Seeing as we're in constant touch with someof the most glorious tracks in the country, it makes sense, no?

 

At the end of the day - be courteous. Otherwise you WILL be hurt by someone who takes exception to your potty-mouthed proclamation over how "up has the right of the way" and "you should have seen me".

 

In closing though - what is more fun - down or up? Which would you rather be doing? Now which would you like to be interrupted least of all for some tjop who "did not see you" or claims the trail is just as much his as yours, and therefore REFUSES to move off the trail for someone else, purely becasue he considers himself more equal than others?

[AndrewF]

We still talking about this????? Amazing what people can get worked up over and then feel that the "net" is their voice. If the OP really had a problem, he should have stopped and spoken to the guy about it there and then. Oh wait, that would have meant ending his most awesomely bodacious DH run. Couldn't have that now could we? Seriously guys. There are a LOT of people who MTB and don't know these specific things. Technically, riders going UP have right of way. Yes, this may have been a DH route, but HE maybe didn't know that... Instead of ranting here you could have maybe had a calm word with the guy and informed him.

 

I say props to the guy for riding UP what "you" guys can't...

[Eddy Gordo]

In theory, it should work.

But you always get special people who think rules don't apply to them and ignore the signs.

 

this is true hence this topic. But at least with the single direction it should be a lesser occurence

[Captain Fastbastard Mayhem]

We still talking about this????? Amazing what people can get worked up over and then feel that the "net" is their voice. If the OP really had a problem, he should have stopped and spoken to the guy about it there and then. Oh wait, that would have meant ending his most awesomely bodacious DH run. Couldn't have that now could we? Seriously guys. There are a LOT of people who MTB and don't know these specific things. Technically, riders going UP have right of way. Yes, this may have been a DH route, but HE maybe didn't know that... Instead of ranting here you could have maybe had a calm word with the guy and informed him.

 

I say props to the guy for riding UP what "you" guys can't...

 

And I say that even though he might have been able to ride up it, he shouldn't have. Ignorance is no excuse for circumventing the rules. A DH track is a DOWN HILL track. One way. No other way.

[Danger Dassie]

In theory, it should work.

But you always get special people who think rules don't apply to them and ignore the signs.

 

There will always be them 'thspecial' ones. At least with proper signage theres no excuse though.

Given how busy Tokai gets I've always been surprised at the relatively minimal signage in Tokai, some of the best signage I've found, is at Groenkloof. Despite what Eldron said, he was most likely going too fast and blowing his nose out, too notice.

[DJR]

I'm too frightened to say anything about this issue!

 

Who knows how big some of the DH guys are? Who knows how much of a class a personality the XC guys have?

 

Poor All Mountain dude like me will most likely get chewed up and spit out from both sides!

[Captain Fastbastard Mayhem]

lol @ DJR... And I'm on a hardtail... Not a DJer, nor DHer, not even an AMer or FRer. But I don't class myself as an XCer.

[RaeTrewBrowne]

you see people trying to go up a super tube or roller coaster track do you ?? although i have to agree with the comment, if the it's possible to ride up the 'downhill', it can't be a vey steep downhill ??

[Joe Low]

Ignorance is no excuse for circumventing the rules......

 

Of course it is.

 

You got a whole lot of unpublicised rules and unsigned tracks, I'd say ignorance has been inflicted & you cant blame folk (especially occasional riders) for not knowing.

[(Deon)]

Classifications. Fact is, if you have the skill to ride the trail, ride it.. but ride it for what it was intended...

 

Can we all agree that 7 pages of this is too much? I think the point was made in the beginning, no matter how angry the commenter was. I am afraid that this divide will conquer us all. While we bicker amongst ourselves, the true enemy sits back and waits for the war to end, them the victor! News flash. We could lose the trails completely!

 

To Gary..

 

While I also feel it unacceptable that you had to endure this encounter, know that this same mentality is also on our roads. We cannot take comfort in this fact, but it is a minority. The downhill track is exactly as the name denotes, this is not debatable. Anyone who disputes this is clearly not answerable for safety.

[Captain Fastbastard Mayhem]

Agreed, Pain or shine...

 

Can't we all just get along (with the rules AND each other)

[(Deon)]

Agreed, Pain or shine...

 

Can't we all just get along (with the rules AND each other)

 

 

Ahoy!

 

That damned song is playing in my head.. I'll spare you all!