Riding up the DOWNhills at Tokai

[flymango]

http://media.withtank.com/d93801253b.pdf

 

Maybe this can help you guys indicate which are the dedicated DH runs? Not that it makes much difference to me, as I hardly ever cycle up the single track at Tokai.

 

HIJACK ON

 

Some of the threads above seem to criticize novices like myself who also enjoy single track but just don't have the [<insert>] to descend at speed and therefore tend to be a bit more active on the brakes. This obviously increases the tendency for ruts to form. Whilst its clearly a problem, is it really an issue?

 

HIJACK OFF

[Captain Fastbastard Mayhem]

Yeah. Maybe it was the trolls under the various bridges that did him in for us. Yay for trolls!

[Captain Fastbastard Mayhem]

http://media.withtank.com/d93801253b.pdf

 

Maybe this can help you guys indicate which are the dedicated DH runs? Not that it makes much difference to me, as I hardly ever cycle up the single track at Tokai.

 

HIJACK ON

 

Some of the threads above seem to criticize novices like myself who also enjoy single track but just don't have the [<insert>] to descend at speed and therefore tend to be a bit more active on the brakes. This obviously increases the tendency for ruts to form. Whilst its clearly a problem, is it really an issue?

 

HIJACK OFF

 

It's not the activity on the brakes that matters - it's the way that the activity is carried out. If you brake linearly throughout any descent, corner or technical section, and keep control whilst not locking up, you won't damage the trails. However, if you grab a fistful of brake just before you enter the corner, you'll wreck the trails for all of us, rutting and digging out the trails...

[Guest Omega Man]

In the last year or so i've noticed a marked increase in up traffic on the dh trails. I'm sure it's just a thirst for more single track and who can blame anyone for that?

 

However. DH1, DH2 and DH3/Vasbyt are DOWNHILL tracks and have been Downhill tracks for as long as I have been riding. We have 600m of downhill on the entire mountain (Measured from just above the road gap to the 3rd jump on Vasbyt) Yes that's right 600. the rest of the entire mountain is xc and bi directional.

 

It's simple to solve the problem tho

 

1. The ENTRANCE to the trails are marked not the exit. This is a common mountain biking trail marking practice. I have been debating making up no entry signs but the xc guys will in all likelyhood just ignore them.

2. It's YOUR responsibility to educate yourself about uni-directional and bi-directional tracks There is a trail map at the entrance and if you don't know just ask.

3. If you drive up a 1 way street and you are hit by a truck it's YOUR fault. No-one else's.

 

 

Oh and @ Edge Design. We choose to push up so that we are fresh for riding downhill. The reason we bought DH bikes in the first place.

The bikes are very difficult to ride up for numerous reasons.

1. They are heavy. 17-22kg depending on spec etc

2. Gearing. Most guys run a 38 tooth chainring on the front. No Granny gear.

3. Geo. The bikes are angles backwards so riding on flat is like riding on a 10 degree up hill.

4. Pedal bob. With every pedal stroke 20% of our effort goes into the suspension rather than pushing us forward.

Edited May 23, 2011 by Omega Man

[TNT1]

 

3. If you drive up a 1 way street and you are hit by a truck it's YOUR fault. No-one else's.

 

Unless it is not clearly marked as a one way street?

[nolipoli]

flymango,

 

if I am honest, I don't know where that comes from. The reality is that some of the best DH riders in the world trail their rear brakes into corners (Steve Peat for one). Berms require maintenance from time to time, and probably more so with your soft soil in Tokai. In GP we and up with fast "blue grooves" that are as hard as concrete.

 

I would say that what is a much bigger issue is riders that lock their back wheels over the lips of jumps and down the landings of jumps. That just destroys them, although if you are the one doing it, you will never understand why.

[flymango]

I thought I was the only one who found this to be a pain in the.... Anyway I agree as far as tokai is concerned, you go up the jeep track and then either down with the jeep track and IF you are CAPABLE then you go down the single track. Now there are alot of okes that ride down the single tracks and just dont know how and end up ripping up the trail = not cool, you belong on the jeep track. I ride a XC hardtail, but I promise you I too come flying down all the single track including the bridal path and almost never lock up my brakes when I sue it. The morons that ride up the single track, why dont you guys ride up bridal path???? I think the guys in charge of tokai should start putting no entry signs up so that all hell can brake loose

cptmayhem - basically keep the (back) wheel rolling. Agreed. But even the best of us surely lock-up at times?

[Shebeen]

Steve, the DH runs at Tokai are single way, downhill stretches. There's plenty of singletrack further up and around for you to improve your skill level. Nolipoli put it very well, there's enough going on when flying down a run to have to worry about a XC rider around the bend.

 

There is no right of way on DH run. There is only one way. The runs at Tokai are marked as such on the map. You cant claim that there is zero guideline. There's a marked out map at the entrance gate. Have a look next time.

 

Perhaps it's time to put up full on "No Entry" signs at the bottom of the DH runs. I'll gladly have them made up if the other guys agree to it.

ja, i might be talking of the wrong sections. once again, better signage and education would not be lost here.

 

http://media.withtank.com/8109a80925.jpg

http://irideafrica.com/trail-maps/

http://media.withtank.com/d93801253b.pdf

 

i ride up the blue stuff, (ie. meurants/vasbyt)

i ride up some of the red stuff (ie. switchbacks)

 

i wouldn't touch any of the black, up or down, you're welcome to it!

[Captain Fastbastard Mayhem]

Exactly right, Noli. It's the different soil texture down here that makes it all the more important to be proper in your treatment of the trail, and makes maintenance all the more important. I wish we had the same soil structure as you guys do, but the majority of it is just so damn sandy that it makes it next to impossible for the clay to form a nice, hard, tight berm. The only place I see that is on a few of the berms (top of vasbyt and some of the berms in My Roots to name a few) and the jumps in the middle section of Vasbyt. The rest are all just so sandy and break apart at the merest noise of a tire coming at them.

[Guest Omega Man]

cptmayhem - basically keep the (back) wheel rolling. Agreed. But even the best of us surely lock-up at times?

 

Let's not change the subject. The thread is about riding UP the downhill trails not destroying the trails with rear brakes.

[Lucky Luke.]

Seems so obvious, but for some people nothing is. Put up the signs before someone get's pole-axed.

[flymango]

Let's not change the subject. The thread is about riding UP the downhill trails not destroying the trails with rear brakes.

You're right. I did claim HIJACK ON/OFF earlier. Probably deserves its own thread.

 

But this UP vs DOWN right of way discussion does illustrate that quality and safe venues are becoming crowded with a diverse number of skills and interests. We need to define rules (you must!!) and etiquette (you ought to!!). Who should define it and how we comminicate them is another matter.

[Guest Omega Man]

You're right. I did claim HIJACK ON/OFF earlier. Probably deserves its own thread.

 

But this UP vs DOWN right of way discussion does illustrate that quality and safe venues are becoming crowded with a diverse number of skills and interests. We need to define rules (you must!!) and etiquette (you ought to!!). Who should define it and how we comminicate them is another matter.

 

Ja you deff right about about that. The thing is. If we stick to the rules. I.e. WE all ride Down the Downhill and I come through the berm and there is a dude putting along the trail that's cool. It's happened to me many times and all I do is stop and push a little further up. We all have our own relative skill and we all have to share the same trails.

 

On another related note. On Saturday morning we were pushing up the main jeep track when we came upon a dude lying next to the road with his mates around him. He's clearly been hauling down the jeep track, hit a water bar and crashed heavily.

 

I'm not sure why people ride down the jeep track but presumably it's cos they think riding down the single track is dangerous. Doing 50kph down that jeeptrack is waaay more dangerous than a few slippy roots in my opinion. But hey. Maybe that's just me.

[banna]

Ja you deff right about about that. The thing is. If we stick to the rules. I.e. WE all ride Down the Downhill and I come through the berm and there is a dude putting along the trail that's cool. It's happened to me many times and all I do is stop and push a little further up. We all have our own relative skill and we all have to share the same trails.

 

On another related note. On Saturday morning we were pushing up the main jeep track when we came upon a dude lying next to the road with his mates around him. He's clearly been hauling down the jeep track, hit a water bar and crashed heavily.

 

I'm not sure why people ride down the jeep track but presumably it's cos they think riding down the single track is dangerous. Doing 50kph down that jeeptrack is waaay more dangerous than a few slippy roots in my opinion. But hey. Maybe that's just me.

 

No problem if they wanna stick to the jeeptrack...more space for me on the singletrack!

[Captain Fastbastard Mayhem]

So THAT'S why there was an amblybince on the trails. Wondered what the poor soul was doing to have been carted off int he back of the van.

 

He might not have realised that there are a few more bumps in the fire road since it's been graded. I know that there's a "speed bump" like thing about halfway up the fire road that has only been there for a week, so it could have been that. Wouldn't have liked to hit that thing at speed. It was far too steep and sandy to be hit at 60 plus on an XC machine. Especially when the majority of ppl riding down the fire road can't bunnyhop to save their mother's brother's sister in law.

[Guest Omega Man]

Ja. Not nice to see anyone getting hurt. He was waving his arms and legs around so probably just a bit of shock and a concussion.