Can skill make up for short travel and geometry??

[Sidewinder.]

Nobody is smooth when they first start riding...so if you plan on riding all mountain stuff with an xc race bike, you're gonna be replacing parts soon and often. Also, I cant count the amount of times my trail bike has saved me from serious injuries.

[Raydek]

Nobody is smooth when they first start riding...so if you plan on riding all mountain stuff with an xc race bike, you're gonna be replacing parts soon and often. Also, I cant count the amount of times my trail bike has saved me from serious injuries.

Thanks, sounds like good advice, especially re part replacement, noticed that recently...

[EmptyB]

Nobody is smooth when they first start riding...so if you plan on riding all mountain stuff with an xc race bike, you're gonna be replacing parts soon and often. Also, I cant count the amount of times my trail bike has saved me from serious injuries.

Spending too much money hammering the xc bike too!

[Daniel J Méssem]

I've been told that should I want to do more technical trail riding and steeper downhills that I should look into a bike with longer (140mm+) travel and a slacker head angle..

 

Now I don't necessarily disagree with this, but was just curious as to wether or not certain trails are just not ridable with 100mm travel and a steep head angle or, if a riders skills are well developed that it could be tackled?

 

Does the extra travel etc just make it easier? More comfortable?

think it depends on how technical you are talking... not much that a short travel cant do, or a hardtail for that matter

there is also an argument to be made that doing it on a short travel bike will develop skills faster

[Captain Fastbastard Mayhem]

think it depends on how technical you are talking... not much that a short travel cant do, or a hardtail for that matter

there is also an argument to be made that doing it on a short travel bike will develop skills faster

A long travel bike will give you the confidence to hit bigger things sooner. Also be less jittery over the technical stuff, so imo a longer travel bike would develop skills faster.

[Bomberman]

Me thinks its all about bragging rights......100mm travel, not so much brag.....160mm travel, much more brag.

 

"A long travel bike will give you the confidence to hit bigger things sooner. Also be less jittery over the technical stuff, so imo a longer travel bike would develop skills faster." What cpt armpies said here is on the dot. Having a bike with long travel can make all the differences, having the right gear for the job will increase your confidence. The more confidence you have the more you are willing to do technical rides, hens building on your skills.

[Raydek]

Thanks for all the comments guys, from these it seems.....

 

It is possible to hit most trails with shorter travel xc bike (skill is needed though), but it won't be as comfortable or forgiving should you stuff up as what  a longer travel trail bike would be. The trail bike will also give you the confidence to try bigger more technical sections sooner.

 

Edit: and part replacement/servicing will be more frequent on the xc bike..

[lechatnoir]

do a youtube search on downhill racing on days when suspension just arrived, and i think you'll find that there was some fast guys on weird bikes. just enjoy whatever and above all, wear a smile

[Bos]

Good topic.

 

I have been riding MTB for just under 20 years now. Started dirt jumping and dual slalom, now I am a trailriding marathon racing kind like probably the majority of riders in SA. I would say when it comes to single track I am pretty "skilled". I can hit most lines like the ave Tokai singletrack and smaller jumps and drops as fast on my 4' bike as the skilled guys on their enduro bikes do. However they will be riding with a big smile on their faces and I will be concentrating and pushing the bike to the very limits in most cases.

 

Although, I am on trail friendly 4'' bikes, If I can call it that: Morewood Zula now Rocky mountain Element. I'm not sure of the racing orientated SCOTT Spark kind.

 

Since it sounds like you enjoy the trailriding more. Do this, It will save you lots of money.

 

A: Get a 5'(130-140mm) bike and try lighten it up:

By putting lighter wheels and converting them to tubliss with lighter tyres and adding a longer stem your bike will be converted from a trail machine to a marathon machine. Keep your stock wheels and run burly tires and interchange wheels when you do different kind of riding. The stem lenth could be overlooked by putting on something in the middle like 85-90mm

[JXV]

The suspension on the newer bikes is just so much more effective than older ones - I dare say that even a brand new XC bike will be more controllable and fun to ride than a 5 year old one.

Said this before in another thread: if you ride primarily to race a lot of XC and have a reasonable chance of getting podiums in your age group then maybe stick with XC bikes. If you ride mostly for fun and race more casually then a trail bike will be a whole lot more fun. More comfy on longer rides, more plush on rough trails. Between the modern rear shocks and modern pivot systems pedal bob has become so much more controlled that the longer travel bikes are much more efficient than they used to be.

 

Longer travel, bigger wheels and better brakes definitely give you the confidence to tackle bigger obstacles once you get to know the bike.

[Captain Fastbastard Mayhem]

Good topic.

 

I have been riding MTB for just under 20 years now. Started dirt jumping and dual slalom, now I am a trailriding marathon racing kind like probably the majority of riders in SA. I would say when it comes to single track I am pretty "skilled". I can hit most lines like the ave Tokai singletrack and smaller jumps and drops as fast on my 4' bike as the skilled guys on their enduro bikes do. However they will be riding with a big smile on their faces and I will be concentrating and pushing the bike to the very limits in most cases.

 

Although, I am on trail friendly 4'' bikes, If I can call it that: Morewood Zula now Rocky mountain Element. I'm not sure of the racing orientated SCOTT Spark kind.

 

Since it sounds like you enjoy the trailriding more. Do this, It will save you lots of money.

 

A: Get a 5'(130-140mm) bike and try lighten it up:

By putting lighter wheels and converting them to tubliss with lighter tyres and adding a longer stem your bike will be converted from a trail machine to a marathon machine. Keep your stock wheels and run burly tires and interchange wheels when you do different kind of riding. The stem lenth could be overlooked by putting on something in the middle like 85-90mm

Dude... if you have anything bigger than a 70mm stem on your mountain bike, you're on the wrong size frame!

[Brian Fantana]

Many are referencing XCO elite riders riding very technical sections with short travel bikes.  It is a valid argument, but one needs to remember that in an XCO race these riders spend easily twice as much time climbing (if not more) than what they do descending and riding technical sections.  For efficient climbing the top level riders want bikes that are light, with short travel and a low front end.  They train their skills inside out so they can ride technical sections with a bike that is set up for fast climbing.

 

Here is Nino in race situation:

 

 

Here he is in the off season, long travel bike:

 

 

 

Moral of the story:  Pick your poison, and ride it like it's stolen.

 

 

[Bos]

All this is mearly confusing the OP.

 

In black and white: Choose what you want to do, rig up for it. Try compensate for your type within that catagory by upgrades.

 

Along with what Brian Fontanna mentions, all the pro's would be riding 5'' full sus bikes on the WC XC courses if they were doing it for enjoyment. They suffer through the 3 hours on those hardtails but its about pure efficiency on the climbs. Yes they will be faster on the technical flats and Dh sections on trail bikes, no matter how skilled they are.

[dimsum]

Ray Ray Ray, I'm pretty sure we've had this discussion before. I showed you my rig. An Intense 5.5 with 140mm travel back and 150mm Sektor fork front.

 

Do yourself a favour and get yourself a proper trail/enduro bike. They're set up to go fast uphill and downhill, best of both worlds. Also go 1 x 10, you will not go back.

 

Sure you can do technical trails on a 100mm fork but it is not forgiving, you can hone your skills on an Enduro/trail bike and you will enjoy the ride a lot more than with a 100mm. If you're trying to hit some of the bigger stuff you are also going to bottom out that 100mm and that's not good for anyone.

 

In terms of brands: Intense and Pygas are awesome. If you want to spend less, go for a Giant Reign or the new Giant Trance. Santa Cruz also have some insanely nice trail/enduro bikes but they are super expensive.

[MuddyMike]

My skills suck. I rated my skills a 3 on a 100mm dual susser. I have only moved to a 110mm "trail" bike with slacker head tube and the difference is HUGE I reckon my skills are a 6 now. - Far more stable on descents. I can only imagine how good a 140mm trail bike must be but at a speed penalty. All depends what your goals are.... 

[dimsum]

My skills suck. I rated my skills a 3 on a 100mm dual susser. I have only moved to a 110mm "trail" bike with slacker head tube and the difference is HUGE I reckon my skills are a 6 now. - Far more stable on descents. I can only imagine how good a 140mm trail bike must be but at a speed penalty. All depends what your goals are.... 

 

Go 150mm it's amazing! I'm saving up for a dropper seatpost now