Cyclists with a "Running" Problem

[b-rad]

  On 3/8/2025 at 6:57 AM, SwissVan said:

First thing that came to mind was how will this work for the various cut off times and most importantly the finish cut off?
 

For us long term comrades spectators it could result in a somewhat confusing and lack luster cut off / finish

IMHO they should not mess with the current formula, I.e. don’t fork with something that works

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Agreed. It could become rather confusing. And confusion means viewers lose interest.

I agree. Keep it as it was. The race is unique in the mass start and gun to mat timing and the traditions and different medals. By trying to change it there is the possibility it just becomes another big run, almost like the big marathons with multiple starts going on. And to be quite honest those lack in atmosphere and vibe a big way compared to Comrades.

The new start process will still see loads of people trying to jump batches (in this case from wave 2 to 1). Because as much as Comrades brag about a reduced time to cross the start line from about 8min for previous start process to the expected time of 5min people will still try jump across. As a side note South Africans are perhaps some of the more selfish and ill disciplined bunch when it comes to start line discipline I have seen.
The time taken to cross the start line could very very easily be reduced to nothing if less time is spent dilly-dallying at water tables and chatting to mates along the route anyway. 

It will be very very tricky to separate finishers into the different wave finishes particularly if there is a big bus of both wave 1 and 2 finishers. As much as some marshals will understand the importance of this, many marshals are quite frankly clueless and have no idea. Then a big question and area I see will see big confusion is the cutoffs. Who will sneak through and who will be stopped for no valid reason? Wave 1 runner possibly only starting in wave 2 but being pulled off at a cutoff incorrectly. 

The numbers they are hoping to achieve for the 100th are quite unrealistic I feel. Sure they might get high numbers of entries (revenue goals maybe?) but nowhere close to that will actually line up. And if the entire start process and potentially traditions are being adjusted just for that event I feel like Comrades are moving in the wrong direction.

Is more revenue through more entries the goal? If so, I think that’s shortsighted thinking. One could quite easily achieve significantly more sponsorship money by growing the international stature and exposure of the event. And at the same time keep the numbers similar to that of the past few years. Better, more available tv coverage, and attract the big names from the around the world. This attracts the sponsors. 
Growth just for the sake of growth (by participant numbers) is not necessarily growth is it.. 

 

[Shebeen]

I don't think you've looked past the headline. A lot of your questions and concerns are answered by the later press release on this issue which is actually labelled a FAQ

https://comrades.com/blog/posts/faq-comrades2025-two-starts

 

  On 3/17/2025 at 10:23 AM, b-rad said:

Agreed. It could become rather confusing. And confusion means viewers lose interest.

I agree. Keep it as it was. The race is unique in the mass start and gun to mat timing and the traditions and different medals. By trying to change it there is the possibility it just becomes another big run, almost like the big marathons with multiple starts going on. And to be quite honest those lack in atmosphere and vibe a big way compared to Comrades.

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logistics. the field was already too big to handle from PMB start. It's two seperate waves with all the bells and whistles twice - if you consider a ~10 000+ person mass start as "just another big run" then you have travelled much wider than me.

 

  On 3/17/2025 at 10:23 AM, b-rad said:

The new start process will still see loads of people trying to jump batches (in this case from wave 2 to 1). Because as much as Comrades brag about a reduced time to cross the start line from about 8min for previous start process to the expected time of 5min people will still try jump across. As a side note South Africans are perhaps some of the more selfish and ill disciplined bunch when it comes to start line discipline I have seen.

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should be very easy to identify people jumping ahead as the race numbers will be different colours. As this is effectively cheating 15minutes, thinking they will turn a blind eye to this shows you haven't been watching this space much (they are pretty much the only race that names and shames their naughty boys).

 

  On 3/17/2025 at 10:23 AM, b-rad said:

The time taken to cross the start line could very very easily be reduced to nothing if less time is spent dilly-dallying at water tables and chatting to mates along the route anyway. 

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this makes zero sense.

 

  On 3/17/2025 at 10:23 AM, b-rad said:

It will be very very tricky to separate finishers into the different wave finishes particularly if there is a big bus of both wave 1 and 2 finishers. As much as some marshals will understand the importance of this, many marshals are quite frankly clueless and have no idea. Then a big question and area I see will see big confusion is the cutoffs. Who will sneak through and who will be stopped for no valid reason? Wave 1 runner possibly only starting in wave 2 but being pulled off at a cutoff incorrectly. 

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sure. planned for accordingly. essentially two medal tables.

 

  On 3/17/2025 at 10:23 AM, b-rad said:

The numbers they are hoping to achieve for the 100th are quite unrealistic I feel. Sure they might get high numbers of entries (revenue goals maybe?) but nowhere close to that will actually line up. And if the entire start process and potentially traditions are being adjusted just for that event I feel like Comrades are moving in the wrong direction.

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how do you know that. 23 000 sold out. I have spoken to people who are gearing up to return to the race just for it.

 

  On 3/17/2025 at 10:23 AM, b-rad said:

Is more revenue through more entries the goal? If so, I think that’s shortsighted thinking. One could quite easily achieve significantly more sponsorship money by growing the international stature and exposure of the event. And at the same time keep the numbers similar to that of the past few years. Better, more available tv coverage, and attract the big names from the around the world. This attracts the sponsors. 
Growth just for the sake of growth (by participant numbers) is not necessarily growth is it.. 

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cool. you can do both.

[b-rad]

  On 3/17/2025 at 1:22 PM, Shebeen said:

 

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  Quote

I don't think you've looked past the headline. A lot of your questions and concerns are answered by the later press release on this issue which is actually labelled a FAQ

https://comrades.com/blog/posts/faq-comrades2025-two-starts

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I did see the FAQ thanks. Doesn’t mean one has to agree with the changes just because of some answers. 
 

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logistics. the field was already too big to handle from PMB start. It's two seperate waves with all the bells and whistles twice - if you consider a ~10 000+ person mass start as "just another big run" then you have travelled much wider than me.

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Was it? Or was it just the first few km that get a bit congested? The last down run in 2023 was a problem at the sharp right into Epworth Rd and left into Isabel Beardmore Drive. Maybe the route out on N3 and into Market Rd like in 2022 is a better option anyway? And hopefully CMA still put up better lighting there regardless (and down Pollys too anyway). Whether it’s the later start or not. That was lacking in the past. 
What I mean by just another big run. The mass starts split into different waves in the big events have a vibe. No doubt. But the single mass start, non-wave event of Comrades creates a vibe like no other. It’s that singular gun going. Maybe the new format changes nothing or perhaps it creates a different feeling. Who knows. 
 

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should be very easy to identify people jumping ahead as the race numbers will be different colours. As this is effectively cheating 15minutes, thinking they will turn a blind eye to this shows you haven't been watching this space much (they are pretty much the only race that names and shames their naughty boys).

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There’s a difference between threatening transgressions and actually taking action. If it weren’t for a few notable individuals raising awareness of cheats and particularly raising awareness of multiple offenders, I’m not sure much would have been done. I’m very glad such folk exist to spend the time finding cheats. Has there been improvement on dealing with offenders? Perhaps in the very recent past, but we’ve all seen how a blind eye is so often turned. 
I just wish for immediate repercussions to cheating. Big or small offence. Someone jumps a fence into a higher batch it should be on the spot disqualification. End of. Someone is found with a doctored batch letter. Again. Immediate on the spot disqualification. 
Cheats will find a way to cheat regardless of which format of race start is used, that’s true. All I wish for is a strict enforcement of rules. 
 

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this makes zero sense.

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Point taken. It doesn’t. To clarify. People worried about taking 8 minutes or 5 minutes, or 10 minutes, or whatever time it is to cross the start line, should rather focus on not wasting time in other parts of the route. That time lost at the start line is the least of the issues in the bigger picture of the 86km. 
 

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how do you know that. 23 000 sold out. I have spoken to people who are gearing up to return to the race just for it.

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I don’t know it. Find me someone who does.
Selling out entries to events these days is pretty easy though. We see it at just about every big event. But for Comrades to get the numbers they want for the 2027 race they will need to attract internationals in a big way. 
Comrades 2023 had just over 22500 entries and only 18800 (just over) started. It’d be a massive jump up to the 35000 entries being talked about. Bigger is better? 
 

[Vetplant]

Long podcast, but very insightful on the topic of Sprinting, covers many running aspects.

 

[IceCreamMan]

Barclay marathon on the go. 

[IceCreamMan]

I doubt there will be finishers this year.