How to stop the Cycling Carnage on SA's roads?

[scotty]

Looked for the "East Rand" chapter who apparently have "elected members  " to see what their position on safe cycling is but they non existent. 

[Patchelicious]

The fact is there is no other sure way to stop the carnage in SA - the only real practical solution is to take personal responsibility and stay off the roads - I had to this many years back. I know this is not what people want to hear on a cycling forum but this is unfortunately the reality we live in.

No other way? Oh ok, that's simple then. Problem solved!!!

[PhilipV]

The fact is there is no other sure way to stop the carnage in SA - the only real practical solution is to take personal responsibility and stay off the roads - I had to this many years back. I know this is not what people want to hear on a cycling forum but this is unfortunately the reality we live in.

No.

You are only stopping your own exposure to the risk.

You staying off the road is not going to stop a drunk driver from driving into your mate. Preventing that drunk driver from driving under the influence will save your friend.

You are basically saying that the only real practical way to stop crime in SA is by moving to Oz.

[Bateleur1]

The fact is there is no other sure way to stop the carnage in SA - the only real practical solution is to take personal responsibility and stay off the roads - I had to this many years back. I know this is not what people want to hear on a cycling forum but this is unfortunately the reality we live in.

 

I hear what you are saying.  But the thread heading is: 

How to stop the Cycling Carnage on SA's roads?

 

and not 

 

How to protect myself from the Cycling Carnage on SA's roads.

 

I did the latter.  I moved to Germany. (One of the many reasons for my move).

[Patchelicious]

No.

You are only stopping your own exposure to the risk.

You staying off the road is not going to stop a drunk driver from driving into your mate. Preventing that drunk driver from driving under the influence will save your friend.

You are basically saying that the only real practical way to stop crime in SA is by moving to Oz.

Stop it! Stop this logic immediately!

 

I am still in bed, too scared to walk down the stairs and go to work, I don't need this negativity so early in the morning, while sipping my "not warm enough to burn me" tea.

[Hennie VR]

 

 

try drive 60 in a 60 zone or 120 in a 120 zone - for some reason you are seen as the "bad guy"

 

 

 

Hahaha. I do that 

 

And then I watch the people in my mirrors and you can see their frustration building. I also make a point of stopping dead at stop signs just to add to their frustration. I have seen people cursing and waving their hands in the air numerous times which I find very entertaining. 

 

I also love to watch approaching cars at stop signs. You can see when they are about to roll through the intersection at 20-30km/h and as they see me stopping dead they feel guilty and hit the brakes. And I make a point of looking them in the eyes as I then pass them. They either have that look of when you are guilty and have been caught or they look at you with a WTF are you doing expression.

 

I try to make a conscious effort to obey the traffic laws. I do falter at times but I'd say that I obey the laws 95% of the time. It also helps that I drive a old Hilux.....I don't easily get intimidated and the slower I drive the better fuel consumption I get.

[Tristand]

While cyclists getting knocked down is an issue close to our hearts the fact is that our roads are stupidly dangerous even if you are in another car. The odds of surviving a head-on collision with a drunk driver are not much better than being hit from behind.

 

How many people have not had a friend or family member killed in a car accident? This is not a cyclist specific issue.

 

The heart of the problem is simply lack of enforcement. See how people have made more of an effort to not drink and drive after police just started doing a few road blocks a number of years ago. Now imagine some real penalties were involved like seizing the perpetrators car and the sort.

[kosmonooit]

I see it as a compound problem, and symptomatic of larger issues we face here. Cyclists bare the brunt because they/we are so vulnerable, I get stressed every time I drive here by the same issues, and I am on the road a lot around here.

 

For instance, one reason a lot of drivers drive badly with impunity is the lack of effective law enforcement and policing. In Jhb that's down to the Metro Police.

 

There is no shortage of numbers of Metro Police, its just that they have the mission completely wrong, and are completely and totally ineffective at keeping the roads safe,which should be one of their core missions. This is an example of failed transformation and empowerment policies in my opinion, which one sees in almost every aspect of public service. People are being given jobs and management roles (on the basis of race) who quite frankly are not up to it and cant deliver.

 

All you see of the Metro Police is their road blocks which pop up all other the place, often even on busy highways ( no problem bringing traffic flow to grinding halt and cause tailbacks of kilometres). They check your vehicle license disk and your drivers license and that's it, waste my frigging time, I resent this. I often get the feeling they do this because its about meeting quotas of fines and perhaps  the easiest way to make picking of cash and take handouts.

 

Meanwhile, down the road, taxis rip through red lights, most are totally unroadworthy and unsafe, people jump stop streets, drive drunk, one out of 5 traffic lights don't work and there is general mayhem and lawlessness on the roads, but what to the Metro Police do? set up roadblocks in comfy places to produce income and gather cash

 

Just yesterday I was driving behind a fully loaded taxi that was driving angled about 10 Deg of the centre of travel horizontally and pitched up about 5 deg, and  it was swaying on its back axle as it went about 80 ks in 60 zone  - CRAZY!

 

This general situation is really down to bad management and leadership of Metro, with disastrous consequences for all road users, but as I say just one factor in this larger problem but one that is very evident and clear to me at least. But what can one do? winge on the interweb is about it .  ...  failed transformation that is setting our society back further and further and continues unabated.

[Bonus]

Hahaha. I do that 

 

And then I watch the people in my mirrors and you can see their frustration building. I also make a point of stopping dead at stop signs just to add to their frustration. I have seen people cursing and waving their hands in the air numerous times which I find very entertaining.  . . . .

 

 

I stand to be corrected here because this is something I was told, not something I saw myself,  but on a holiday trip to SA back in the late 90's I was told specifically NOT to stop at Stop Streets at night but rather to roll through them - due to the high danger of "someone jumping out of the bushes beside the road and hijacking me"

 

The person who warned me had a friend who was shot and killed at a stop street a little while before.

 

Just wondering if this was the root of the problem?

[Barend de Arend]

Here's my plan:

 

Make the people who can do something about it responsible for it:

• divide the country into sections
• make a few cops responsible for that section
• count the cars, bikes, etc. that make it safely through that section
• count the number of accidents in that section

 

Now:

• Give the cops a small bonus for every safe traveller
• Give the cops a penalty for every accident
• Give the cops a severe penalty for every fatal accident

 

You need the bonus for safe travellers to avoid shutting down all the roads.

 

As an extra you can rotate cops and sections to check if the problem is the section, or the cop.

 

What I hope will happen:

• cops will chase up whatever caused the accident (drunks, robots out, visibility issues, speeding, ...)
• they'll chase up whatever is important in that section
• more safe drivers means more bonus, so traffic flow (robot timings, etc.) will suddenly matter

 

Bonus outcome:

• decent statistics

[Bateleur1]

 

Here's my plan:

 

Make the people who can do something about it responsible for it:

• divide the country into sections
• make a few cops responsible for that section
• count the cars, bikes, etc. that make it safely through that section
• count the number of accidents in that section

 

Now:

• Give the cops a small bonus for every safe traveller
• Give the cops a penalty for every accident
• Give the cops a severe penalty for every fatal accident

 

You need the bonus for safe travellers to avoid shutting down all the roads.

 

As an extra you can rotate cops and sections to check if the problem is the section, or the cop.

 

What I hope will happen:

• cops will chase up whatever caused the accident (drunks, robots out, visibility issues, speeding, ...)
• they'll chase up whatever is important in that section
• more safe drivers means more bonus, so traffic flow (robot timings, etc.) will suddenly matter

 

Bonus outcome:

• decent statistics

 

 

Knowing some of my fellow South Africans the statistics of the fatal accidents will just go missing with the police doc.  I agree with the principal of holding authorities to account.

[Bonus]

I heard last year (and again I stand to be corrected) that a typical Jo'burg roadblock, set up for half an hour, on a Saturday night can pull in upwards of R30 000

 

Edit: Sorry, my point being that they already have their own Bonus System and it doesn't require them to actually do any work, other than "turn up"

[Maaknplan]

It will just get worse because people are getting more selfish.

 

To most drivers its a mind over matter thing

i.e. " I dont mind and you dont matter"

 

The way people drive is getting worse by the week

[BLACKvoodoo]

Ok so I didn't read any of the crap but while scrolling picked up a few remarks like , awareness and protest and be heard . 

Nobody  is going to care about a bunch of cycling hipsters on their fixies.

You need to face the direction the assholes are coming from....

[Patchelicious]

Ok so I didn't read any of the crap but while scrolling picked up a few remarks like , awareness and protest and be heard . 

Nobody  is going to care about a bunch of cycling hipsters on their fixies.

You need to face the direction the assholes are coming from....

Crap? Trying to fix the problem of cyclists being killed is not crap.

 

If this is all crap, what plan do you suggest?

['Dale]

The only way is to actively get government involved and to get the political will to actually do something about it.  If you do not achieve that we can do nothing more than print road safety pamflets on toilette paper that we can at least wipe our arses with it.  There is no other way.

 

You need Dept of Transport to realise the problem.  They need to ensure that the road traffic act is sorted properly wrt to cycling safety.  You need the Dept of Transport to kick the police and traffic police rear ends into gear to know how to deal with theis.  They need to kick the useless education Dept into gear to educate people from a young age.

 

They need to get the Justice Dept into gear to properly prosecute offenders who kill pedestrians and cyclists on the road.  If this is not getting done we are just simply trying to p!ss into the South Easter.

 

CSA and PPA will have to put pressure on the Dept of Transport.

 

 

This is good.

Systemic change toe shape the predominant culture of road users that is so negligent.

 

Was there ever a time, pre 1994 or post 1994 when the culture of mutual respect was good?

Nope.

 

All this is a reflection of our nationhood.