DieselnDust Posted January 28, 2021 Share damned .. imagine if the bearings went in the wrong way and you wheel then only spun backwards This is why I worry about you architects.... Haven't a mechanical bone in your jello bodies.... Sorry big boned bodies Hairy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alouette3 Posted January 28, 2021 Share Hairy deep groove bearings do accomodate axial loads but not as well as angular contact bearings. It's the difference between 12500km of service vs 5000 km of service.I'm sure the skf will serve you well enough but there also angular contact options from NTN, SKF, FAG and other reputable brands. DT Swiss doesn't manufacture bearings but I think you will find that the angular contact bearing they specify is going to be a pricey item from all manufacturers for good reason. The main advantage for you going with deep groove bearings is that you can't install them the wrong way around...LOLMy original DT Swiss bearings were shot by 4500km.... never seen a pressure washer and has been looked after. Interested to know what the expected mileage is. At that kind of mileage I'm willing to experiment with generic bearings. R1160 / 4500km = R0.25c per km just in rear hub bearings Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarcHD Posted January 28, 2021 Share Hey guys, Firstly we would like to extend a huge thank you to everyone who has offered their thoughts, grievances, queries or assistance on this forum thus far. Ultimately we are here to help our community and welcome the opportunity to do so while also doing our best to improve and learn from mistakes or failures. It's to this end we now turn to you again to ask for your assistance in helping us improve our services to you - the cycling community. If you have just a few moments, we would be hugely grateful if you can complete our poll linked below. There is no sign up, no emails gathered with which to spam you. Just a simple and easy to complete questionnaire that will help us improve. You can fill out the questionnaire here: https://forms.gle/k1p7TnKKE3AHfnif7 Thanks for your time, and continued support! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarcHD Posted January 28, 2021 Share My original DT Swiss bearings were shot by 4500km.... never seen a pressure washer and has been looked after. Interested to know what the expected mileage is. At that kind of mileage I'm willing to experiment with generic bearings. R1160 / 4500km = R0.25c per km just in rear hub bearings While it's extremely rare for DT bearings to fail in this time span it must also be remembered that the 1900 series wheels are the affordable wheels from DT Swiss for a reason. The tolerances of the seals, while still superior to many of it's peers, will not be the same of that found in the mid and high end range of products (Star Ratchet and Ratchet EXP) which as you have heard are expected to last well over 10,000km Higher tolerances require more time and specialised machinery which cost more to run resulting in high price points for the final products. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselnDust Posted January 28, 2021 Share My original DT Swiss bearings were shot by 4500km.... never seen a pressure washer and has been looked after. Interested to know what the expected mileage is. At that kind of mileage I'm willing to experiment with generic bearings. R1160 / 4500km = R0.25c per km just in rear hub bearingsThe hollow gram Si hub in my rear wheel has done 12500kmThe older 240s has done over 30,000km off road since 2007 Neither hub has had the bearings replaced. Star ratchet gets serviced and I cleanup the seals and apply grease under the end caps. Done. 4500km is nothing and I suspect there’s something else going on with the hub. Perhaps the bearings were not pressed in correctly from the factory.Wheel bearings should not be enjoying such a short life Hairy, TheoG and MarcHD 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselnDust Posted January 29, 2021 Share What is configuration of the rear triangles of the bikes that seeing short bearing life? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hairy Posted January 29, 2021 Share What is configuration of the rear triangles of the bikes that seeing short bearing life?YT = Horst with Boost spacing Edit: are you suspecting a twisting rear end? Edited January 29, 2021 by Hairy DieselnDust 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselnDust Posted January 29, 2021 Share YT = Horst with Boost spacing Edit: are you suspecting a twisting rear end?Yes I am.PIVOT cycles made their Trail 429 with a 157mm super boost rear end plus they made it super stiff. No concession to the weight weenies there.a Horst link will have a lot of inherent flex around the pivot area which happens to be where the hub is. The hub and thru axle is supposed to add stiffness but it could be that the hub isn't stiff enough for the task its been given. Generally the DT hubs are plenty stiff especially the straight pull versions. The flanged 350 flanged version will flex a bit more than the straight pull model. Couple to a less than stiff rear triangle with an aggressive riding style and the bearings get loaded quite heavily all the more reason to opt for angular contact bearings too TheoG 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hairy Posted January 29, 2021 Share Yes I am.PIVOT cycles made their Trail 429 with a 157mm super boost rear end plus they made it super stiff. No concession to the weight weenies there.a Horst link will have a lot of inherent flex around the pivot area which happens to be where the hub is. The hub and thru axle is supposed to add stiffness but it could be that the hub isn't stiff enough for the task its been given. Generally the DT hubs are plenty stiff especially the straight pull versions. The flanged 350 flanged version will flex a bit more than the straight pull model. Couple to a less than stiff rear triangle with an aggressive riding style and the bearings get loaded quite heavily all the more reason to opt for angular contact bearings tooI hear you, but am going to try out the SKF's first and if they do not last, then will fall back on to the DT's. The rear on the YT is rather "chunky" and under sprinting loads it certainly feels as stiff, if not stiffer than previous bikes I have owned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselnDust Posted January 30, 2021 Share That's only the bb area you're feeling. The clamping area around the rear wheel is the important bit that transfers load via your end caps into the axle. With any Horst link bike that has bearings in the pivots the dropouts will walk relative to each other. Add in your thru axle a.k.a wheelclamping shaft to the mix which is likely not done up to the 12N.m because everyone out there leaves the thru axle lose enough to be able to undo it with a multi tool Allen key (short with no leverage). Essentially your hub is likely being flexed by the this walking action. To reduce the effect you can fit bigger end caps if hub and frame allow or use a TA that has the old school cam closing mechanism or just carry a long enough Allen key. In this scenario again the angular contact is superior. Yes you're going for the cheap deep grooves as you keep posting that picture. I'm just illustrating why the angular contact is better Been waiting for Mr. Torque to post this one as I knew it was coming. Enjoy Hairy and TheoG 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bicycle Supply Chain Posted January 31, 2021 Share R290 x 4 = R1160.00 ex. labour .... looks like I am going the Enduro ABEC 3 route then, at least they still have a double seal. R283.48 for the 4 x bearings, ex. shipping and labourAs a reference. WheelsI charge R75 per bearing fitted. This is for a standard ABEC-3 bearing. Double seal LLU type. This also includes a freehub service and seal inspection. I use the specified special or universal grease from DT Swiss. If I use the DT Swiss OEM BEARING. I charge R270 per bearing for the hubs. This also includes a freehub service and seal inspection. I use the specified special or universal grease from DT Swiss. Suspension pivots I charge R90 per bearing fitted. This is for a standard ABEC-3 MAXX bearing. Double seal LLU type. Hairy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bicycle Supply Chain Posted January 31, 2021 Share In the name of the backyard mechanic, the hammer and the cheap knock-off tools, Bless thou service for the local bike shop rips me off. Amen[emoji120]Good luck “knocking out” the drive side bearing on a ratchet hub. When it’s Brocken then the “rip off” LBS may of been the cheaper option. DieselnDust 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselnDust Posted January 31, 2021 Share Good luck “knocking out” the drive side bearing on a ratchet hub. When it’s Brocken then the “rip off” LBS may of been the cheaper option.Amen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hairy Posted January 31, 2021 Share That's only the bb area you're feeling. The clamping area around the rear wheel is the important bit that transfers load via your end caps into the axle. With any Horst link bike that has bearings in the pivots the dropouts will walk relative to each other.Add in your thru axle a.k.a wheelclamping shaft to the mix which is likely not done up to the 12N.m because everyone out there leaves the thru axle lose enough to be able to undo it with a multi tool Allen key (short with no leverage).Essentially your hub is likely being flexed by the this walking action.To reduce the effect you can fit bigger end caps if hub and frame allow or use a TA that has the old school cam closing mechanism or just carry a long enough Allen key. In this scenario again the angular contact is superior. Yes you're going for the cheap deep grooves as you keep posting that picture. I'm just illustrating why the angular contact is better Been waiting for Mr. Torque to post this one as I knew it was coming.Enjoy this is interesting, I have the DT twisty turney thingie axel now other thru axels that take a allen key are made out of alum and do not take too well to heavy handed pressure from a/key ... this thinkin back to the axel I had on my old Banshee Spitty frame. DieselnDust 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselnDust Posted January 31, 2021 Share this is interesting, I have the DT twisty turney thingie axel now other thru axels that take a allen key are made out of alum and do not take too well to heavy handed pressure from a/key ... this thinkin back to the axel I had on my old Banshee Spitty frame.And you can bet that the tightening was never near that required to produce the correct clamping force.on your bike you have the DT skewer that folds back in the axle or the one that closes on a cam like an old school QR. If not then that's the one to have Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hairy Posted January 31, 2021 Share And you can bet that the tightening was never near that required to produce the correct clamping force.on your bike you have the DT skewer that folds back in the axle or the one that closes on a cam like an old school QR. If not then that's the one to haveright tighty till you can't tighty anymore and the pull the lever back from the ratchet and place where you find to be the best location for the handle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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