Danger Dassie Posted June 14, 2012 Posted June 14, 2012 Reading the letter and the respondents it's addressed to, the whole thing seems to be more than just about LA.... http://a.espncdn.com/pdf/2012/0613/armstrongcharges.pdf
nochain Posted June 14, 2012 Posted June 14, 2012 That is well written, makes perfect sense, and will be missed by most of the 'ubbers.... Agree!!!!
TNT1 Posted June 14, 2012 Posted June 14, 2012 Reading the letter and the respondents it's addressed to, the whole thing seems to be more than just about LA.... http://a.espncdn.com...rongcharges.pdf I like the "USPS Conspiracy" or the "Conspiracy" part. Good movie title. Wonder if Matthew will still be keen to play LA after this?
petatodd Posted June 14, 2012 Posted June 14, 2012 Just some of the beauts in this story.....Someone made this comment. This pursuit of Lance is a joke. It relies on the subtleties of the definition of modern doping - abnormal levels of x relative to y. X is okay below threshold z and only if q is not present at all. Simple things were completely ignored like the presences of plastic residue from transfusion bags – too easy. I care for the future of the sport, not the past. Americans simply fail to understand how deeply affected the French are by the fact that their system has not produced a winner since 1986. USADA should be a pawn in the healing of their annual humiliation. This action and the recent DOJ action is so small and childish.It's really simple, a vast empire (Livestrong) has been built on the image of a 7 times winner being cleaner than clean in respect of doping and cheating. The unknown author of the piece above is clearly a) an Armstrong accolyte B) an American playing the patriotism card c) clearly petrified that his long held beliefs are about to be shattered as a forgery and a lie. I love cycling, I love watching super fit athletes battle it out on slopes at speeds that we can only dream of achieving, the drama of the drop, the pain, the sprint. So many good things. I also don't care that most of the heros that drew me into the sport long before it was a mainstream television spectacle were dopers as they all doped. And it made for great racing, not the drudge we get today of Evans trying to steal a few seconds here and there. What I do care about is that one guy achieved so much more and beat ALL the dopers and hasn't got the strength to say Yes, I'm guilty, I doped, I misled you. He is a liar and that's why I get excited when, finally, he cannot compete as an athlete due to questions about his record. I sincerely cannot believe any cyclist with even part of a brain can still believe Armstrong won 7 Tours de France without ever taking anything he should not have taken. While everyone he beat doped. And his helpers doped. Mellow 1
bigjoe Posted June 14, 2012 Posted June 14, 2012 How can we be sure what the truth is. Currently, it is all a case of he/she said and saw this. No proof that he ever doped. I am not saying he did or didn’t, but I am still a fan. From the following link….http://www.washingtonpost.com/lance-armstrong-faces-fresh-doping-charges-from-usada/2012/06/13/gJQAefnPaV_story.htmlThe USADA letter further claims that Martial Saugy, the director of an anti-doping lab in Switzerland, stated that Armstrong’s urine sample results from the 2001 Tour of Switzerland indicated EPO use.Saugy told The Post last year, however, that Armstrong’s sample was merely “suspicious,” a designation that meant it could not be called positive. Further analysis with modern methods might bring clarity, Saugy said, but the sample no longer exists.“We did not do the additional analysis. It will never be sufficient to say, in fact, it was positive,” Saugy said in an interview. “I will never go in front of a court with that type of thing.” No, there is no proof in any of his blood tests. He was racing against the top triathletes at the age of 15….are we saying he was doping then? He is racing the top IM guys today….is he doping now? So why doesn’t the blood tests reveal it then? Are we saying that Usain Bolt is also doping cause he is a cut above the rest? Exceptional athletes come past from time to time…that’s life! Just my 2 cents worth…… Wannabe and Roer 2
philip.maree Posted June 14, 2012 Posted June 14, 2012 I sincerely cannot believe any cyclist with even part of a brain can still believe Armstrong won 7 Tours de France without ever taking anything he should not have taken. While everyone he beat doped. And his helpers doped. The question is was the stuff he was taking illegal at that time? On the banned substance list? Nope. Then he did not take anything illegal to enhance his performance. Retrospectively all he has done then is identified the substance to be put on the list to which should be tested for. USADA owes him some remuneration for his time and effort then . I promise you, everyone from squeaky clean Bradley Wiggins to known dopers like Ivan Basso are still using stuff today that will be banned in a couple of years. They might as well stop racing now already.
Mellow Posted June 14, 2012 Posted June 14, 2012 The question is was the stuff he was taking illegal at that time? On the banned substance list? Nope. Then he did not take anything illegal to enhance his performance. Retrospectively all he has done then is identified the substance to be put on the list to which should be tested for. USADA owes him some remuneration for his time and effort then . I promise you, everyone from squeaky clean Bradley Wiggins to known dopers like Ivan Basso are still using stuff today that will be banned in a couple of years. They might as well stop racing now already. all winners should be announced in 10 years time at a finishing ceremony
Tumbleweed Posted June 14, 2012 Posted June 14, 2012 The question is was the stuff he was taking illegal at that time? On the banned substance list? Nope. Then he did not take anything illegal to enhance his performance. Retrospectively all he has done then is identified the substance to be put on the list to which should be tested for. USADA owes him some remuneration for his time and effort then . I promise you, everyone from squeaky clean Bradley Wiggins to known dopers like Ivan Basso are still using stuff today that will be banned in a couple of years. They might as well stop racing now already. EPO has been banned since the '90s.
philip.maree Posted June 14, 2012 Posted June 14, 2012 EPO has been banned since the '90s. Did he test positive for EPO in the 90's?
petatodd Posted June 14, 2012 Posted June 14, 2012 Did he test positive for EPO in the 90's?Only 2 guys did when the test was developed, that's the joke....but virtually everyone except your hero did it. There was no test, just a max level.
Tumbleweed Posted June 14, 2012 Posted June 14, 2012 Did he test positive for EPO in the 90's? I am answering your question about if it was banned or not. But to answer you, there was a question over the retested '99 samples. The anecdotal evidence quoted in the USADA letter would seem to suggest that they believe he indeed did take - as well as possess, traffick, administer - it in the other six wins.
Tumbleweed Posted June 14, 2012 Posted June 14, 2012 Only 2 guys did when the test was developed, that's the joke....but virtually everyone except your hero did it. There was no test, just a max level. That's why some of the top anti-doping gave some weight to what Landis had to say about micro-dosing and hydration to avoid detection.
TNT1 Posted June 14, 2012 Posted June 14, 2012 he indeed did take - as well as possess, traffick, administer - it in the other six wins. Olive oil?
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