I run red robots.

[Guest Latent Blue]

I'm a cyclist who joined this site with a confession to make. I run red robots.

 

Please just have an arm band or something to notify the medics that you are a traffic light jumber when they examine your body.

 

We dont want to go through "RIP fellow cyclist" threads for nothing.

 

Otherwise. Happy cycling

[andydude]

So why is everybody concentrating on the one law? What about the other cycling laws we all break all the time? Conveniently not being discussed? Or is it fine to break the other laws, because it's not as topical. And who judges that... o yes... us.

[Harryn]

So why is everybody concentrating on the one law? What about the other cycling laws we all break all the time? Conveniently not being discussed? Or is it fine to break the other laws, because it's not as topical. And who judges that... o yes... us.

 

Probably because there is a lot of dishonest sanctimonious judgmental bs being "dispensed" on this thread. I rode for 3 hours this morning. Neither I nor any other cyclist I saw stayed stopped at any intersection, save for those where there was intersecting traffic. But put it out here, and everyone's a red robot-stopping saint, and butter wouldn't melt in their mouths.

[scuzzy]

I'm going to apply the OP's theory in my car from now on, think traffic will be a breeze tomorrow morning.

 

Thanks for the insight, for all the commuters, watch out for me when you're crossing the green light in the Bellville area tomorrow morning.

[Captain Fastbastard Mayhem]

 

Probably because there is a lot of dishonest sanctimonious judgmental bs being "dispensed" on this thread. I rode for 3 hours this morning. Neither I nor any other cyclist I saw stayed stopped at any intersection, save for those where there was intersecting traffic. But put it out here, and everyone's a red robot-stopping saint, and butter wouldn't melt in their mouths.

 

What a Dumbass. I'll be the first to say that your generalisation doesn't apply to me, nor the people I ride with.

['Dale]

Is the merry-go-round debate on again?

Eish!

 

 

[anicca]

porqui et al, please grow up. I'm really not trolling or flamebaiting or otherwise internet-meme-ing, this is a genuine and most pressing concern in the cycling community and motorist-cyclist relations, and I'm attempting to stimulate some opinions and honest debate. Why does it matter that I'm female or that I'm young?

 

FCH said "please explain how a car crossing a red robot is any different to you doing it on a bicycle.

 

I have already but let me spell it out.

 

1) you occupy much less road real-estate.

2) you can if necessary take refuge in pedestrian crossings, traffic islands, etc.

3) you have ~5% of the mass of a car and none of the top speed, so you simply cannot do the damage of a car even if you tried.

4) your initial acceleration is usually better than that of a car. Even when waiting for a green I'm usually through an intersection before the cars.

5) other countries around the world have noted the difference and have passed laws to this effect.

6) you can dismount at any point and become a pedestrian who is now merely crossing a road.

 

Of course it can go wrong. Cycling is inherently dangerous. I'm guessing that doesn't stop you from getting on your bike, though. Oops.

 

I don't say I'm the best judge of when it's safe to cross a road, but I'm as good as the next pedestrian. Oops.

 

And I never said anything about changing the law. Like I said, this isn't about the law. What the law states doesn't factor much into how I choose to live my life.

 

Latent Blue said "We dont want to go through "RIP fellow cyclist" threads for nothing. "

 

I just find it shocking that people can insinuate that I deserve to die for jumping a robot, while I bet all of you have received warning from a friend about a roadblock or speed trap. Surely the incredible passion that this topic riles up is of enough interest for scholarly debate??

 

"If a fellow cyclist shout at you for jumping a red light, what do you do?" - so far that hasn't happened, but if it did, you're right in saying I'd probably shout back, because there isn't time to have a debate as you're skipping red lights. I know it's wrong, legally speaking, but I also believe it's right, practically speaking.

 

"And there we go. The ultimate admission. You're a law disdaining citizen"

 

What are you talking about? I have said that I disdain the law from the very first post. Why are you acting as though this is new information?

 

"nothing anyone can say shall change your point of view, regardless of whether what you're doing is legal, logical or responsible"

 

But THIS is just not true. I know it's not legal, but I have already explained why I believe it is logical and responsible. If you can explain why jumping the robot is illogical or irresponsible I will change my point of view. Why would I come on here and ask for opinions and in the same breath also state that I intend in future to not jump robots? I'm inviting you to show me that I am in fact wrong. So far all I've heard against is

 

1) it's the law

2) it brings forth the wrath of motorists upon cyclists

3) its a bad example for children who don't know how to cross a road

4) it will upset someone if they happen to kill you.

 

These are four weak arguments.

[Harryn]

 

What a Dumbass. I'll be the first to say that your generalisation doesn't apply to me, nor the people I ride with.

 

1. Your adherence to the Road Traffic rules is most laudable;

2. Your compliance with the rule of the Hub against personal attacks, less so;

3. Committing an act of defamation on a public forum? Not clever, and erm...not lawful. Kinda like running a red light.

Edited March 16, 2014 by Harryn

[Captain Fastbastard Mayhem]

 

1. Your adherence to the Road Traffic rules is most laudable;

2. Your compliance with the rule of the Hub against personal attacks, less so;

3. Committing an act of defamation on a public forum? Not clever, and erm...not lawful. Kinda like running a red light.

 

Thanks. And technically not defamation - you admitted to breaking a law, and proceeded to pass a gross generalisation in your attempt to paint cyclists as a law breaking bunch (in addition to calling those posts that tried to offer sensible reason in an attempt to dissuade the OP from further breaking the law and endangering other road users as "sanctimonious bs") - which is generally accepted as not a clever thing to do - ie: dumb. I did not attempt to defame you, merely point out that your thought patterns were not that clever in this instance.

 

This will be my final post on this matter, as it is clear that the OP is not willing to accept any counter argument or take cognisance of her / his effect on the safety of fellow road users, and the negative light that her / his actions on the road further cast on us as cyclists.

[porqui]

porqui et al, please grow up. I'm really not trolling or flamebaiting or otherwise internet-meme-ing, this is a genuine and most pressing concern in the cycling community and motorist-cyclist relations, and I'm attempting to stimulate some opinions and honest debate. Why does it matter that I'm female or that I'm young?

 

 

 

You're not serious !?!

 

If this was a genuine and most pressing concern in the cycling community according to you.(And it is)

Then YOU would obey the LAW.

 

Laws are usually there for very good reasons and you will still discover this and I sincerely hope that you will not discover this the hard way but that is more than likely how you will.

 

Reality is sometimes a hard taskmaster!

 

Oh to be young!

 

 

I am part of a select group on the net - we are net goblins.

You are most welcome to join us as you have passed with flying colours or should that be RED only.

Edited March 16, 2014 by porqui

[FCH]

No weaker than your arguments.

 

Any-old-how, good luck with all that

 

Adios

[Harryn]

 

Thanks. And technically not defamation - you admitted to breaking a law, and proceeded to pass a gross generalisation in your attempt to paint cyclists as a law breaking bunch (in addition to calling those posts that tried to offer sensible reason in an attempt to dissuade the OP from further breaking the law and endangering other road users as "sanctimonious bs") - which is generally accepted as not a clever thing to do - ie: dumb. I did not attempt to defame you, merely point out that your thought patterns were not that clever in this instance.

 

This will be my final post on this matter, as it is clear that the OP is not willing to accept any counter argument or take cognisance of her / his effect on the safety of fellow road users, and the negative light that her / his actions on the road further cast on us as cyclists.

 

Lol, I also don't inhale! But still, a simple apology would have been more honest.

[Captain Fastbastard Mayhem]

 

Lol, I also don't inhale! But still, a simple apology would have been more honest.

 

Nah. An apology would have been dishonest on my part.

 

But yes. For the language used, I apologise. For the sentiment regarding those that shoot stops and reds, my ire remains.

[anicca]

"This will be my final post on this matter, as it is clear that the OP is not willing to accept any counter argument or take cognisance of her / his effect on the safety of fellow road users, and the negative light that her / his actions on the road further cast on us as cyclists."

 

I have insisted that I will accept a valid counter argument. So make it already.

 

I am concerned enough about road safety to break laws that don't promote it.

 

And I am concerned enough about the negative light in which cyclists are bathed to have taken the time to have this discussion, as well as stating from the beginning that I intend to obey red lights in future.

 

So if that baseless personal attack was the last post you make on the matter the discussion will miss nothing.

 

 

"Laws are usually there for very good reasons"

 

But not always - as it would seem in this case.

 

 

"No weaker than your arguments"

 

That it is both safer and more convenient for everyone?

 

 

As Harryn and others said, I'm one jumper of very many. I'd guess half of cyclists jump robots as routinely as I do, and if any one of you can say honestly you never do it - you always come to a complete stop behind the line at every red robot and stop street, regardless of the time of day, dodginess of the area, heaviness of traffic, lack of witnesses, range of visibility or type of vehicle you're driving, then please cast those stones. Can we not even admit as a community that it is something many people see as acceptable? Can we as cyclists resist the urge to blind road rage towards another cyclist who is behaving in a safe albeit illegal way and not bay for blood when we see it? If we don't analyse why, and figure out what to do about it, then how are we to ever progress beyond giving each other the finger as one cyclist jumps while the other one waits?

[DPG]

Can't find the double face palm emoticon!!! Admin please help!

[Ham]

"This will be my final post on this matter, as it is clear that the OP is not willing to accept any counter argument or take cognisance of her / his effect on the safety of fellow road users, and the negative light that her / his actions on the road further cast on us as cyclists."

 

I have insisted that I will accept a valid counter argument. So make it already.

 

I am concerned enough about road safety to break laws that don't promote it.

 

And I am concerned enough about the negative light in which cyclists are bathed to have taken the time to have this discussion, as well as stating from the beginning that I intend to obey red lights in future.

 

So if that baseless personal attack was the last post you make on the matter the discussion will miss nothing.

 

 

"Laws are usually there for very good reasons"

 

But not always - as it would seem in this case.

 

 

"No weaker than your arguments"

 

That it is both safer and more convenient for everyone?

 

 

As Harryn and others said, I'm one jumper of very many. I'd guess half of cyclists jump robots as routinely as I do, and if any one of you can say honestly you never do it - you always come to a complete stop behind the line at every red robot and stop street, regardless of the time of day, dodginess of the area, heaviness of traffic, lack of witnesses, range of visibility or type of vehicle you're driving, then please cast those stones. Can we not even admit as a community that it is something many people see as acceptable? Can we as cyclists resist the urge to blind road rage towards another cyclist who is behaving in a safe albeit illegal way and not bay for blood when we see it? If we don't analyse why, and figure out what to do about it, then how are we to ever progress beyond giving each other the finger as one cyclist jumps while the other one waits?

 

I run them too, and no amount of moaning about the law is going to change it. Those that have a problem with it can deal with it.