Is motorcycling allowed?

[WaynejG]

2 minutes ago, Rob Mortimer said:

Bit of a strange comment? The bikers are on the onramp, inside the designated lane, have not crossed the solid line - can't possiby see how they contributed to this?

To be fair though, when I still rode I was also no fan of big group rides.

Huge debate on the Wild Dog Forum. Sifting through all the debate will take to long to type here. Also what was the role of the biker that was standing still? He seemed to add to the confusion. 

But yes, the Fortuner driver was definitely the most in the wrong.

[IceCreamMan]

4 hours ago, WaynejG said:

Huge debate on the Wild Dog Forum. Sifting through all the debate will take to long to type here. Also what was the role of the biker that was standing still? He seemed to add to the confusion. 

But yes, the Fortuner driver was definitely the most in the wrong.

Nothing to do with large groups …it could have been just one biker and the result would have been the same. Wrong place, wrong time. The driver is 100 percent in the wrong here. There is no proportionality of blame to be divided here. One has to remain in control of one’s vehicle at all times. She was not in control at all. 

Edited March 14, 2023 by IceCreamMan

[Spokey]

Took the little Orange for a jaunt along Mount Hope Road to R328 then Robinsons Pass before the farm roads from Klein Brak  to George. Was a hoot racing some Harleys over the Outeniqua Pass…………sadly they did not know it was a race ha ha!!!

[Stretched@Birth]

3 hours ago, IceCreamMan said:

Nothing to do with large groups …it could have been just one biker and the result would have been the same. Wrong place, wrong time. The driver is 100 percent in the wrong here. There is no proportionality of blame to be divided here. One has to remain in control of one’s vehicle at all times. She was not in control at all. 

Road Marshall blocking the left hand lane at the onramp to keep the lane clear for the large group to get onto the highway, truck changes lane at last minute in front of Fortuner, speed differential between the truck and the Fortuner, driver jumps on the brakes with nowhere to go and loses control.

I think there's some proportionality of blame.  Could have ended a lot worse.

[IceCreamMan]

10 hours ago, Stretched@Birth said:

Road Marshall blocking the left hand lane at the onramp to keep the lane clear for the large group to get onto the highway, truck changes lane at last minute in front of Fortuner, speed differential between the truck and the Fortuner, driver jumps on the brakes with nowhere to go and loses control.

I think there's some proportionality of blame.  Could have ended a lot worse.

The biker she hit is absolutely blameless. She was speeding in the circumstances and lost control. She should have foreseen the potential danger and acted accordingly. 
 

many accidents are not accidents in the true sense. Defensive driving is not taught when you buy yr licence. 
 

 

Edited March 15, 2023 by IceCreamMan

[Stretched@Birth]

On 3/14/2023 at 10:32 PM, IceCreamMan said:

The biker she hit is absolutely blameless. She was speeding in the circumstances and lost control. She should have foreseen the potential danger and acted accordingly. 
 

many accidents are not accidents in the true sense. Defensive driving is not taught when you buy yr licence. 
 

 

It is easy for us to speculate, we were not there.  All I'm saying is that it is not as cut and dried as that. 

That the biker who was hit is absolutely blameless isn't disputed, wrong place, wrong time, that's why it is an accident. 

What we do not know is at what speed was the truck driving?  Assume though it was keeping to the speed limit, which for a goods vehicle with a GVM exceeding 9 tons is 80km/h, when he pulled out in front of her and she was doing 120, the speed limit for passenger vehicles, that already is a differential of 40km/h.  Perhaps the SUV was travelling faster, we don't know.  

The way I see it, the truck was in the left hand lane, she will not have seen the "bike marshal" in the left lane as he was ahead of the truck, moving even slower, for who the truck had to move out, into the fast lane, so she did not anticipate the truck moving across into the fast lane (it is unclear on the video if the truck indicated, but it does not seem so). 

Truck moved in front of her, she climbed on the anchors, lost control, accident happened.  

In my opinion, and that is all it is, is an opinion, the "bike marshal" has some culpability, He must have crossed the solid line to get into the lane to try and keep the lane clear for the group to merge onto the highway.  He was travelling slower than the traffic with which the group needed to merge, causing an obstruction and a dangerous situation. 

One of the biggest problems on our roads, and the difference between SA roads and the roads where you live is the speed differential between vehicles.  That and the unlicensed/bought licensed drivers who have no clue of the rules of the road, never mind how to drive defensively. 

That is also why I don't have a bike anymore, it is virtually impossible to anticipate what other drivers will do on the road, and in general, SA drivers do not see motorcycles, bicycles or pedestrians as road users.

Stepping off my soap box now, apologies for the rant...!   

[IceCreamMan]

You not wrong. All valid points. 
 

she might not have seen the Marshall dude, but she would have seen the other bikers and should have adjusted her speed as she should have seen the potential risk in the situation. 
 

In this country she would be hard pressed to blame anyone else as she was speeding, not necessarily breaking the law speeding but speeding in those circumstances. They take a dim view of that here. 
 

 

[The Ouzo]

Sadly on saturday morning near my house a biker lost his life and his 10 year old daughter is still in ICU.

I dont know many details as I only received the message on our community whatsapp group. Judging by the time of the message it was early morning. My guess was the low rising sun behind the bike prevented the vehicle at the intersection from seeing the bike.

Knowing that intersection, and being early morning, the likely hood was that the bakkie went through a red light, not seeing the bike with the sun behind it.

 

Very very sad. Hopefully the little girl pulls through.

[The Ouzo]

2 minutes ago, IceCreamMan said:

not necessarily breaking the law speeding but speeding in those circumstances.

yeah thats a big problem in this country. the speed limit says 120 and no matter what the conditions and whats in my way I will do 120(or more) and be damned everything or everyone else.

[IceCreamMan]

50 minutes ago, The Ouzo said:

Sadly on saturday morning near my house a biker lost his life and his 10 year old daughter is still in ICU.

I dont know many details as I only received the message on our community whatsapp group. Judging by the time of the message it was early morning. My guess was the low rising sun behind the bike prevented the vehicle at the intersection from seeing the bike.

Knowing that intersection, and being early morning, the likely hood was that the bakkie went through a red light, not seeing the bike with the sun behind it.

 

Very very sad. Hopefully the little girl pulls through.

Read about that. I think it’s the same intersection where a mate of mine died about 25 years ago now. 

[Hairy]

1 hour ago, The Ouzo said:

Sadly on saturday morning near my house a biker lost his life and his 10 year old daughter is still in ICU.

I dont know many details as I only received the message on our community whatsapp group. Judging by the time of the message it was early morning. My guess was the low rising sun behind the bike prevented the vehicle at the intersection from seeing the bike.

Knowing that intersection, and being early morning, the likely hood was that the bakkie went through a red light, not seeing the bike with the sun behind it.

 

Very very sad. Hopefully the little girl pulls through.

Judging by the obscene number of cars jumping stop streets and cutting in front of me today, then the truck and two bakkies jumping very very very red lights at different intersection, I would put my neck out and say people need to wake the #%^@%^ up and drive responsibly.

The one lady in a big SUV had the audacity of shouting at me as I had to swerve out the way from her as she jumped the stop street.....just ignored her and rather focused on the next unfocused accident waiting to happen.

[Andymann]

On a lighter note - lots of fun was had last weekend!

[Hairy]

You lot can pass off as family members ... guy on the right a little different looking though

[Headshot]

On 3/14/2023 at 6:16 PM, IceCreamMan said:

Nothing to do with large groups …it could have been just one biker and the result would have been the same. Wrong place, wrong time. The driver is 100 percent in the wrong here. There is no proportionality of blame to be divided here. One has to remain in control of one’s vehicle at all times. She was not in control at all. 

Yes, also find it strange people are trying to apportion blame in a situation where a speeding driver, possibly on her phone, suddenly meets a truck in the r/h lane and loses control. Size of the group  is irrelevant as you point out. Driver probably not even aware there were any riders on the road. What an idiot.

[Headshot]

Feeling a bit jealous of all the riding pics... my slow motion DR Big moto restoration is proceeding, well very slowly. I have however picked up the cudgels after an extended festive season lay off and got going again. I'm working back to front and a problem I had was the worn out chain slider. Amazingly Suzuki can still supply one at nearly R1k after a few weeks. I decided to make myself one and eventually managed to source a 13mm thick HDPE cutting board which I have cut and carved and glued and heated until I had something that looks rather good IMHO.  It was cheap and a lot of fun to make. (The chain is clearly a bit rusty but the sprockets are not  worn out and I'm leaving this as is for now.)

Next is to resolve some airbox issues and possibly order a new air filter, then some final carb setting up. 

[IceCreamMan]

1 hour ago, Headshot said:

Feeling a bit jealous of all the riding pics... my slow motion DR Big moto restoration is proceeding, well very slowly. I have however picked up the cudgels after an extended festive season lay off and got going again. I'm working back to front and a problem I had was the worn out chain slider. Amazingly Suzuki can still supply one at nearly R1k after a few weeks. I decided to make myself one and eventually managed to source a 13mm thick HDPE cutting board which I have cut and carved and glued and heated until I had something that looks rather good IMHO.  It was cheap and a lot of fun to make. (The chain is clearly a bit rusty but the sprockets are not  worn out and I'm leaving this as is for now.)

Next is to resolve some airbox issues and possibly order a new air filter, then some final carb setting up. 

Post more pics of the Big please. Always loved em. Only had a 650DR at one point never a big.