Specialized Bicycles eliminating counterfeit products

[TheJ]

What gets me is that Big name products instill fear that sub standard products will fail, yet when a branded frame breaks it's due to a manufacturing flaw...

 

Sometimes I believe the Chinese frames are over designed to avoid problems. So not ALWAYS an inferior product...perhaps not cutting edge weight, but still a value purchase.

 

 

But agree - don't buy counterfeit and then brand as original. 

 

This.

 

Often the Chinese would use one "grade" carbon lower than the original product, ie Toray T700 vs T800 carbon, to get it to the same strength but it would then maybe be 50g or so heavier. Said it once and I'll say it again, Chinarellos for me from here on in. I won't buy a Speciarized from China, but "blanks", any day.

[gummibear]

They'll never get all the sellers  

 

http://www.aliexpress.com/item/HOT-29er-mtb-carbon-frame-Special-27-5-carbon-mtb-frame-carbon-bicycle-frame-with-many/32633381576.html?spm=2114.40010208.4.127.Bc1EMk

 

http://g03.a.alicdn.com/kf/HTB1_RXXMXXXXXctXpXXq6xXFXXXk/227344914/HTB1_RXXMXXXXXctXpXXq6xXFXXXk.jpg?size=116377&height=640&width=960&hash=8e2b3836f65d4155c39e8f387ade9909

[TheJ]

They'll never get all the sellers  

 

http://www.aliexpress.com/item/HOT-29er-mtb-carbon-frame-Special-27-5-carbon-mtb-frame-carbon-bicycle-frame-with-many/32633381576.html?spm=2114.40010208.4.127.Bc1EMk

 

http://g03.a.alicdn.com/kf/HTB1_RXXMXXXXXctXpXXq6xXFXXXk/227344914/HTB1_RXXMXXXXXctXpXXq6xXFXXXk.jpg?size=116377&height=640&width=960&hash=8e2b3836f65d4155c39e8f387ade9909

 

You can find anything you want really.

 

Specialized

http://img.alibaba.com/wsphoto/v0/519494511/Specialized-S-WORKS-TARMAC-SL3-FRAMESET-white-52-54-56cm-2011.jpg

Giant

http://g02.a.alicdn.com/kf/HTB14cSkJVXXXXbZXXXXq6xXFXXXe/2013-font-b-GIANT-b-font-TCR-Composite-font-b-Carbon-b-font-Frame-Set-700C.jpg

Pinarello

MCipollini

http://g02.a.alicdn.com/kf/HTB1XqCzIFXXXXcfXXXXq6xXFXXX0/Top-sale-carbon-road-bike-frame-Mcipollini-RB-1000-1k-weave-racing-bike-bicycle-frameset-size.jpg

De Rosa

http://g01.a.alicdn.com/kf/HTB1lTPdHVXXXXbeXXXXq6xXFXXXN/New-product-De-rosa-carbon-frame-road-bicycle-de-rosa-888-superking-frames-carbon-road-bike.jpg

Ridley

http://g01.a.alicdn.com/kf/HTB1_PNNJVXXXXcXXVXXq6xXFXXXP/221222745/HTB1_PNNJVXXXXcXXVXXq6xXFXXXP.jpg?size=107671&height=640&width=960&hash=05221d9cee62d5537e817ec370dc90c9

Look

http://g03.a.alicdn.com/kf/HTB1bnQVLVXXXXXDXpXXq6xXFXXXp/227344600/HTB1bnQVLVXXXXXDXpXXq6xXFXXXp.jpg?size=121015&height=675&width=900&hash=871485ac8a402f7a92a93e14258ea247

Time

http://g04.a.alicdn.com/kf/HTB1QCHwGFXXXXcIXpXXq6xXFXXXP/222124106/HTB1QCHwGFXXXXcIXpXXq6xXFXXXP.jpg?size=92302&height=666&width=1000&hash=bcdf7e87866fdf4edf7aac656e36a86f

Cervelo

http://g01.a.alicdn.com/kf/HTB1N7UuLVXXXXa8XpXXq6xXFXXX2/220762092/HTB1N7UuLVXXXXa8XpXXq6xXFXXX2.jpg?size=67960&height=600&width=600&hash=ede50f70bd6ff0d41520155faac821f6

Even though I don't agree with branding these frames like the "real" thing, I can promise you any one of these would get you to the finish line of the Argus in exactly the same time as the "real" thing.

Edited March 31, 2016 by TheJ

[Cat2forLife]

Safety, build standards or performance do not come into it. It is simply protecting their brand and has nothing to do with the physical integrity of the product.

 

Building a stronger, better performing bike and slapping a Specialized sticker on it would meet the same reaction and correctly so.

 

This is true, but I have read an article where Specialized purchased a fake frame from a seller on ebay and did their own tests. Now I am not naive as to think they weren't a little bias, but they did have valid proof concerning safety.

 

 

"Perform no-where near the same as the original product"

 

Pro riders are given bikes straight from the manufacturers, they get to ride the real thing. The rest of us, there is ABSOLUTELY no way for an amateur cyclist, if blindfolded, to tell the difference between a Spez Tarmac and a Chinese Tarmack is maybe 50g, the difference in the Toray carbon used. Joe Soap won't know the difference.

 

I beg to differ. I for one can definitely feel the difference between even an entry level and higher end carbon frame from the same manufacturer, nevermind a knock- off.

 

And I am by no means a pro. Ask any cyclist worth his salt and they WILL feel a difference.

 

EDIT: To support my statement, I work the bike industry and I am fortunate enough to be able to ride a wide variety of bikes. From top end stuff to run-of-the-mill everyday stuff. There is a difference. There is a reason you pay more.

Edited March 31, 2016 by Jetstar500

[TheJ]

 

I beg to differ. I for one can definitely feel the difference between even an entry level and higher end carbon frame from the same manufacturer, nevermind a knock- off.

 

And I am by no means a pro. Ask any cyclist worth his salt and they WILL feel a difference.

 

Did the "expensive" and "cheap" framed bikes have exactly the same parts on? Same wheels, same stem and bars? Cheap wheels probably flex more than more expensive wheels, bars and stem the same. If not, then what you "felt" was probably nothing more than a bit of this...

http://www.bibalex.org/psc/Attachment/Attachment/Original//bigstock_Close-up_of_some_pills_with_o_20890136-300x254.jpg_2014032609035573559.jpg

[Cat2forLife]

Did the "expensive" and "cheap" framed bikes have exactly the same parts on? Same wheels, same stem and bars? Cheap wheels probably flex more than more expensive wheels, bars and stem the same. If not, then what you "felt" was probably nothing more than a bit of this...

http://www.bibalex.org/psc/Attachment/Attachment/Original//bigstock_Close-up_of_some_pills_with_o_20890136-300x254.jpg_2014032609035573559.jpg

 

Must be.

 

Well different strokes for different folks then.

 

You ride your Chinese bike and I'll carry on riding my genuine bike with the knowledge that I will be safe and probably faster than you.

[gummibear]

 

 

 

 

I can promise you any one of these would get you to the finish line of the Argus in exactly the same time as the "real" thing.

I can't agree with that.

 

I have seen numerous Chinese frames and wheels break causing injury to the riders and others.

 

I have seen tubbies break off the rim,brake area delaminate from the heat and tyre beads break off.

 

Most of the frames seem to snap by the head tube and down tube joint.

[Matt]

Even us down here on the pointy end of Africa have had contact from Andrew Love at Specialized regarding fakes listed in our Classifieds a good while back. They're on the ball and I applaud their proactive approach, but are certainly facing a huge challenge in squashing all suppliers and channels.

 

The issue of counterfeits (across all brands) and the muddy understanding some have of it continually surprises me. The simple fact is that counterfeit products (like some of the examples others have posted here) are illegal. Some may be better quality than others, but if it carries a brand name illegitimately it's not a question of ethics, morals or performance vs. the real thing... it's downright illegal.

[Tony datoy]

I can almost guarantee you a fair amount of bicycle frames are manufactured in China.

Giant is one and Silverback is another.

So are these so called fake frames really fake or are they surplus from the factory and sold on the grey market?

I would guess a lot of Specialized merchandise is the same. Made in China and distributed elsewhere. Overruns are ending up on the grey market.

T

[TheJ]

You ride your Chinese bike and I'll carry on riding my genuine bike with the knowledge that I will be safe and probably faster than you.

 

Different strokes.

 

My crappy Chinarello has been through numerous Trans Baviaans's, Trans Karoo's, plenty other races and a few wins. One or two crashes as well. Not a hint of a problem.

 

If you end up being faster than me, it won't have anything to do with the bike, or that my $500 frame weighs 50g more than your $2000 frame.

[TheJ]

Even us down here on the pointy end of Africa have had contact from Andrew Love at Specialized regarding fakes listed in our Classifieds a good while back. They're on the ball and I applaud their proactive approach, but are certainly facing a huge challenge in squashing all suppliers and channels.

 

The issue of counterfeits (across all brands) and the muddy understanding some have of it continually surprises me. The simple fact is that counterfeit products (like some of the examples others have posted here) are illegal. Some may be better quality than others, but if it carries a brand name illegitimately it's not a question of ethics, morals or performance vs. the real thing... it's downright illegal.

 

100% agree than branding something that it isn't isn't on, don't condone it in the very least. My point is that a Chinarello, branded to match an original product or left blank, will get you to the finishline in 99.9999% the same time. And I've owned "legit" Meridas, Cannondales, Specializeds and Treks (and they still hang in my man cave today).

[Captain Fastbastard Mayhem]

I can almost guarantee you a fair amount of bicycle frames are manufactured in China.

Giant is one and Silverback is another.

So are these so called fake frames really fake or are they surplus from the factory and sold on the grey market?

I would guess a lot of Specialized merchandise is the same. Made in China and distributed elsewhere. Overruns are ending up on the grey market.

T

mostly Taiwan, but anyway. 

[eddy]

I can almost guarantee you a fair amount of bicycle frames are manufactured in China.

Giant is one and Silverback is another.

So are these so called fake frames really fake or are they surplus from the factory and sold on the grey market?

I would guess a lot of Specialized merchandise is the same. Made in China and distributed elsewhere. Overruns are ending up on the grey market.

T

 

 

In the competitive world that is the Chinese manufacturing industry, do you really believe a factory that has the prize contract to manufacture Specialized merchandise would compromise all that by shipping off a few at the back door ?

 

Ignorant stuff

[Matt]

100% agree than branding something that it isn't isn't on, don't condone it in the very least. My point is that a Chinarello, branded to match an original product or left blank, will get you to the finishline in 99.9999% the same time. And I've owned "legit" Meridas, Cannondales, Specializeds and Treks (and they still hang in my man cave today).

When it comes to the so-called "open mould" frames (non-branded lookalikes) the argument does get a bit more murky.

 

From the right source you can get some good quality blank frames from the east, some which closely resemble a known brand and others which are more generic. 

 

Those lookalikes often avoid patent infringement through minute changes. While technically not illegal, they could raise some questions about the ethics of the manufacturer, sellers and even buyers. 

 

There's a key distinction that should be made though between an unbranded / generic frame, the non-branded lookalike and the blatant copy. On the far end of the scale it's highly unlikely that the blatant counterfeiter cares much for quality if they're already trying to dupe you with the paint job. These are what Specialized (and many other brands) are most focussed on stamping out. And for good reason! With the vast majority of these I'd say safety is a very real concern.

 

[raptor-22]

Does my Specialist Humpstumper qualify as OEM?

[TheJ]

Does my Specialist Humpstumper qualify as OEM?

 

Specialist Stumphumper?