Do eBikes belong on the mountain?

[Hairy]

Nooooooo....

 

It is a CHAIRLIFT .... followed by a breakneck decent ... this could mean either "fast" or actually "breaking" body parts ...

Chris, how is the E-Bike going up to the Mast at Conters ... does it hold it's line or do you find that the nose wants to lift under power? If so I imagine with the extra power it must take a good bit of body language to keep the front down.

 

With a "normal bike" one has to already shift to the tip of the saddle at the worst inclines to keep the front down and tracking true.

[aquaratza]

I recently came to own an eBike. It isn't a scrambler, very few of them are (the Greyp bikes are an exception and aren't really bicycles). My bike nominally outputs 250w, which is less than what I can manage. So, in terms of feel, it's just a normal bike with a bit of a boost. If you want to climb something steep and/or technical you still have to put in effort, the bike won't do it on its own. My bike is heavy and so requires a lot more wrangling than my normal bike. Hope that helps.

[Shebeen]

this thread is a hypocrisy timecapsule.

 

in other news i did a bikepacking trip with a "gravel ebike" in our group the other day - perfect tool for the job.

can we just moan about those here, or will we need a new thread for that?

 

 

 

Got nothing against wimps and disabled people riding eBikes anywhere. :-)

the irony of your signature is the third most amusing thing on this thread.

[Patchelicious]

this thread is a hypocrisy timecapsule.

 

in other news i did a bikepacking trip with a "gravel ebike" in our group the other day - perfect tool for the job.

can we just moan about those here, or will we need a new thread for that?

 

 

 

the irony of your signature is the third most amusing thing on this thread.

What is hypocritical about it?

[Hairy]

this thread is a hypocrisy timecapsule.

 

in other news i did a bikepacking trip with a "gravel ebike" in our group the other day - perfect tool for the job.

can we just moan about those here, or will we need a new thread for that?

 

 

 

the irony of your signature is the third most amusing thing on this thread.

could this thread also be seen as containing a mixed group of people, some of whom are not ready to accept the transition just yet?

[Eldron]

this thread is a hypocrisy timecapsule.

 

in other news i did a bikepacking trip with a "gravel ebike" in our group the other day - perfect tool for the job.

can we just moan about those here, or will we need a new thread for that?

 

 

 

the irony of your signature is the third most amusing thing on this thread.

 

 

100%! Touring on a motorbike is a great way to see the country!

 

 

 

 

 

Yes that was a joke designed to take us aaaaaall the way back to "is an ebike really just a motorbike with an alternate fact name"?

 

Yes it is.

 

Yes it is Friday.

[Eldron]

could this thread also be seen as containing a mixed group of people, some of whom are not ready to accept the transition just yet?

 

I don't think it is a transition. It's another just another parallel option like gravel bikes.

 

More choice is betterer.

[porqui]

.

Edited September 25, 2020 by porqui

[LazyTrailRider]

More choice is betterer.

Absolutely.

 

My bike garage agrees...

 

[ChrisF]

Chris, how is the E-Bike going up to the Mast at Conters ... does it hold it's line or do you find that the nose wants to lift under power? If so I imagine with the extra power it must take a good bit of body language to keep the front down.

 

With a "normal bike" one has to already shift to the tip of the saddle at the worst inclines to keep the front down and tracking true.

 

Bear with me, as I answer via but of a turn ....

 

 

Just after lockdown I cycled from home, had coffee at Bloemendal, then returned home via Traverse.  At least that was the idea.  Just above Blue gumm forest I looked down and realised I had messed up properly !!  I had 12 minutes to get off Traverse .....  For a moment I considered turning around, then thought what the heck ... BOOST !!  The Giant has 5 power levels.  I went to 3 and was at the speed-assist level in two peddle strokes (the Giant is set to the American 32km/h assist limit) .... kept it there, and when I got to the first hill I took it to max boost.  On a couple of points I would slow down for a turn, then power out of the turn ... spinning up the rear wheel !     It is scary just how much power is on tap when you use max boost !!  I actually turned it down to level 4 to keep the rear wheel from spinning.

 

And yes, I got to Odendaal gate with a minute to spare.

 

Climbing from Conties to the Mast I leave it on the third power setting, stay seated, spinning at about 80rpm, leaning slightly forward, and it iddles up the worst bits in total control.

 

 

The more tricky skill to manage is steep climbs AND sharp switchbacks .... when you back off the rpm the power-assist falls away, then when you get back on the peddles you can get a bit of surge pushing the front wheel wide of the turn ...  just another "skill" to master with these bikes.

[Fat Boab]

A couple of photos of your bike rack would be appreciated... Home made?

 

 

Absolutely.

 

My bike garage agrees...

 

[aquaratza]

Chris, how is the E-Bike going up to the Mast at Conters ... does it hold it's line or do you find that the nose wants to lift under power? If so I imagine with the extra power it must take a good bit of body language to keep the front down.

 

With a "normal bike" one has to already shift to the tip of the saddle at the worst inclines to keep the front down and tracking true.

I took my bike up there today and yes the nose does lift a little occasionally ahahahahahhaa, but nothing troublesome.

 

I usually get off on the concrete slab on my normal bike 

 

[Hairy]

I took my bike up there today and yes the nose does lift a little occasionally ahahahahahhaa, but nothing troublesome.

 

I usually get off on the concrete slab on my normal bike 

 

Screenshot from 2020-09-26 20-07-31.png

I cycled up to the mast the other day on my current normal bike, and I have to shift onto the nose of the saddle to keep the front wheel true. My previous normal bike was longer in the reach department and took less body language. 

 

The concept of assisted power on the climb had me wondering if it accentuated the front wheel lifting or not tracking accurately.

[ChrisF]

Chris, how is the E-Bike going up to the Mast at Conters ... does it hold it's line or do you find that the nose wants to lift under power? If so I imagine with the extra power it must take a good bit of body language to keep the front down.

 

With a "normal bike" one has to already shift to the tip of the saddle at the worst inclines to keep the front down and tracking true.

 

Hairy I was thinking of this post on Sunday morning, while riding up to the mast from Conties side..... seeing a rider in the distance walking the last bit .....

 

 

As I approached that short cement section I was lowering my shoulders .... along some sections my elbows were almost 90-degrees.  But all the time I stayed seating to keep traction on the rear wheel.

 

After the cement section there were 2 or 3 moments when the rear wheel wanted to spin .... so I had to find that sweet spot between balancing the weight between the front and the rear ....  through all of this I did manage to keep the front planted.

 

 

 

It also gave met time consider the benefits of different "power assist levels" ... and its impact on the ridebility of the bike .... to only refer to the "boost level" certainly is a small part of the story, and often misleading.

 

 

For the GIANT the the following numbers apply, though the same reasoning applies to all ebikes.

The Giant has 5 boost levels:

"1" Eco = 100% boost.  Thus for every 50W you put in, the motor will add another 50W

"2" Eco+ = 175% boost.  So now the motor adds 87,5W for every 50W you put in.

"3" Normal = 250% boost.  Now you get 125W for every 50W you put in ... 

"4" Sport = 300% boost.  150W added for your 50W ....

"5" Sport+ = 360% boost, ie 180W assist for your 50W.

 

 

Please note the following :

- I deliberately used a low 50W input power example, as this is easy to put down when coming through a sharp turn or pulling way .... and suddenly you get a "burst" of "50+180=230W" on the back wheel.  This is when you get wheel spin out off slow corners, or the nose pushing wide in hair pins - while using maximum power assist.  Using levels 1, 2 or 3 (depending on the gradient) really helps to smooth out the power delivery to the back wheel !!!!

 

- the maximum assist power from the motor is 250W .... so when I am riding using assist level 3, I need to put in 100W to get the maximum power assist from the motor.  Even if I stand on the pedals and put in 400W the motor assist will only be 250W, irrespective of the assist level - and only while my speed is less than 25 or 32km/h.

 

- as such, using the higher assist levels negatively impacts the handling of the bike at low speeds.

 

- the only benefit of the higher assist levels is when you are doing longer climbs and are too tired to put in 70W (for max assist on level 3) ....  at this point you really need to start asking yourself if you can still concentrate on the trail if you are that tired .....

 

 

 

- uhm ja .... the higher assist levels are handy during the morning commute, to get you to the office without building up a sweat ...    

[Hairy]

Hairy I was thinking of this post on Sunday morning, while riding up to the mast from Conties side..... seeing a rider in the distance walking the last bit .....

 

 

As I approached that short cement section I was lowering my shoulders .... along some sections my elbows were almost 90-degrees.  But all the time I stayed seating to keep traction on the rear wheel.

 

After the cement section there were 2 or 3 moments when the rear wheel wanted to spin .... so I had to find that sweet spot between balancing the weight between the front and the rear ....  through all of this I did manage to keep the front planted.

 

 

 

It also gave met time consider the benefits of different "power assist levels" ... and its impact on the ridebility of the bike .... to only refer to the "boost level" certainly is a small part of the story, and often misleading.

 

 

For the GIANT the the following numbers apply, though the same reasoning applies to all ebikes.

The Giant has 5 boost levels:

"1" Eco = 100% boost.  Thus for every 50W you put in, the motor will add another 50W

"2" Eco+ = 175% boost.  So now the motor adds 87,5W for every 50W you put in.

"3" Normal = 250% boost.  Now you get 125W for every 50W you put in ... 

"4" Sport = 300% boost.  150W added for your 50W ....

"5" Sport+ = 360% boost, ie 180W assist for your 50W.

 

 

Please note the following :

- I deliberately used a low 50W input power example, as this is easy to put down when coming through a sharp turn or pulling way .... and suddenly you get a "burst" of "50+180=230W" on the back wheel.  This is when you get wheel spin out off slow corners, or the nose pushing wide in hair pins - while using maximum power assist.  Using levels 1, 2 or 3 (depending on the gradient) really helps to smooth out the power delivery to the back wheel !!!!

 

- the maximum assist power from the motor is 250W .... so when I am riding using assist level 3, I need to put in 100W to get the maximum power assist from the motor.  Even if I stand on the pedals and put in 400W the motor assist will only be 250W, irrespective of the assist level - and only while my speed is less than 25 or 32km/h.

 

- as such, using the higher assist levels negatively impacts the handling of the bike at low speeds.

 

- the only benefit of the higher assist levels is when you are doing longer climbs and are too tired to put in 70W (for max assist on level 3) ....  at this point you really need to start asking yourself if you can still concentrate on the trail if you are that tired .....

 

 

 

- uhm ja .... the higher assist levels are handy during the morning commute, to get you to the office without building up a sweat ...    

All I ever put out on a normal bike is 150-200W on a slow corner exit or starting to pedal    

[Vilgrim]

I test rode a Giant Ebike on holiday a few years back, could not stop smiling because it was a riot.

 

That being said if you have a reason for an ebike like an operated or weak limb, maybe you are older and very unfit, any illness like diabetes or such then by all means go for it. If you use an ebike just because you can well that's your decision but you might be missing the point of cycling and pushing your own limits. 

 

If all you care about is someone crushing your KOM then you have forgotten what it's all about.