Self defence when cycling (and other sports)

[MTBRIDER1234]

The only problem I have with the whole gun thing is that thieves may start to assume all/the majority of us carry guns. It will go from pushing someone off their bike or hitting them with a branch or whatever to just shooting them outright, as they don't want the risk of being shot themselves.

I don't know if that will ever happen, but it is just what I fear will happen.

[Robbie Stewart]

1 hour ago, MTBRIDER1234 said:

The only problem I have with the whole gun thing is that thieves may start to assume all/the majority of us carry guns. It will go from pushing someone off their bike or hitting them with a branch or whatever to just shooting them outright, as they don't want the risk of being shot themselves.

I don't know if that will ever happen, but it is just what I fear will happen.

This has been my conclusion as well. The moment these thugs get it in their thick skulls that cyclists are an opportunity for a possible weapon all bets are off the table.

I'm sure the top 0.1% of firearm toting cyclist is ready and capable of defence. The remaining 99.9% wouldn't know what to do when they actually are confronted with a scenario needing the gun.

Okes make brave statements in a group but when you're with your back to the wall and you draw a gun, the next thing you had better do is pull the trigger or you're toast.

This applies regardless of whether you're home, out cycling or anywhere else for that matter. You draw to shoot. No hesitation. Hesitate and you're dead. Can you do that? Really ?!? Have these people considered the cost to that decision? Can you prove beyond any reasonable doubt that pulling the trigger was your last resort? Are you willing to sit in jail, even for a day, while SAPS decide you're not the aggressor?

If you say no to even one of these situations it becomes evidently clear all you're doing is bluffing yourself, and endangering the rest of society.

I'm not anti gun. I'm anti people waving guns around without full appreciation for what can happen.

[Robbie Stewart]

Using a firearm is a split second event broken down into moments so quick you blink and you miss what happened. In a fluid situation with multiple people doing different things it becomes increasingly difficult to unravel moment by moment who's right and who's wrong. Go watch some videos on self defence where guns are involved in YouTube. Pay particular attention to how fast things happened. Notice how quick off the mark the gun owner has to be to survive the ordeal. Notice how quick things can turn against you. 

Now take all you've just learnt and apply that logic to being on a bicycle. You still so sure you can do it?

The best defence is to be actively engaged in fleeing the situation. Have situational awareness and suss out the situation, and if things make you uncomfortable then leave. If you find yourself in the fight it's a different matter, at which point if you choose to fight back you'd better be convinced you have the greatest chance of overcoming your foe. And even then, neutralise the threat and get out of there. Don't hang around. Leave as soon as feasibly possible.

For reference go watch Active Self Protection on YouTube.

https://youtube.com/c/ActiveSelfProtection

 

 

[Oli4]

11 hours ago, Jewbacca said:

Not so long ago there was a guy who was hit off his bike with a big stick on Constantia Nek road going into Hout Bay.

One attacker ran and the other struggled to mount the guys bike and ride away, so in one fluid motion he grabbed a rock, tackled the guy off his bike and hit him over the head a few times with the rock.

The second assailant vanished. 

The guy mounted his bike and rode the 1.5km down to the police station in hout bay covered in his and the assailants blood to report the incident. 

I believe the guy in question kept it very quiet and now doesn't ride alone ever and takes the valley road turnoff to avoid the hout bay road stretch to chappies

Was this incident on Main Road between the Disa river turnoff and the township? Or higher up towards Constantia Neck? 

[MTBRIDER1234]

46 minutes ago, Robbie Stewart said:

Using a firearm is a split second event broken down into moments so quick you blink and you miss what happened. In a fluid situation with multiple people doing different things it becomes increasingly difficult to unravel moment by moment who's right and who's wrong. Go watch some videos on self defence where guns are involved in YouTube. Pay particular attention to how fast things happened. Notice how quick off the mark the gun owner has to be to survive the ordeal. Notice how quick things can turn against you. 

Now take all you've just learnt and apply that logic to being on a bicycle. You still so sure you can do it?

The best defence is to be actively engaged in fleeing the situation. Have situational awareness and suss out the situation, and if things make you uncomfortable then leave. If you find yourself in the fight it's a different matter, at which point if you choose to fight back you'd better be convinced you have the greatest chance of overcoming your foe. And even then, neutralise the threat and get out of there. Don't hang around. Leave as soon as feasibly possible.

For reference go watch Active Self Protection on YouTube.

https://youtube.com/c/ActiveSelfProtection

 

 

I am no expert, but have used firearms quite a few times. To aim and hit your target as opposed to sending off stray shots that are likely to hit some random person will take a few seconds. In which case the scollie who was already prepared has shot you.

Also how many people would actually be able to live with the conscience that they killed a man?

I hate these scumbag pieces of sh*t as much, if not more than the next guy. But seriously I would not be able to live the next however many years with the thought that I shot someone.

 

The police will accuse you of being racist, killing for no reason and the list goes on... most of the time when something like this happens they will not be on the side of the oke riding a flashy bike.

Just my opinion and I am no expert on firearms by any means haha

Edited June 17, 2022 by MTBRIDER1234

[Robbie Stewart]

10 hours ago, MTBRIDER1234 said:

shots that are likely to hit some random person will take a few seconds. In which case the scollie who was already prepared has shot you.

This is the MOST important thing to avoid. Firing a gun requires precision. You need to assess your surroundings and ensure that your backstop is not filled with innocent people. If you miss your target you had better be sure that there is no one behind your intended target. 

[Jewbacca]

10 hours ago, Oli4 said:

Was this incident on Main Road between the Disa river turnoff and the township? Or higher up towards Constantia Neck? 

As far as I know, between the Disa turn off and the police station

[SwissVan]

Ai reading this thread…. Some of us are really privileged not to have to think about self defense when we go out riding…. Other than what SPF (sun protection factor) to use.

 

[Robbie Stewart]

24 minutes ago, SwissVan said:

Ai reading this thread…. Some of us are really privileged not to have to think about self defense when we go out riding…. Other than what SPF (sun protection factor) to use.

 

Nevermind considering safety while cycling. Earlier this week a guy in the neighborhood took a brick to the face while driving past Dunoon...

Luckily he came away from it with only bruises and scarring to his face... And therein lies the tragedy. That it's considered lucky to take a brick to the face while driving and not dying. 

Not sure how a gun could have prevented that.

[porqui]

5 hours ago, Jewbacca said:

As far as I know, between the Disa turn off and the police station

It usually happens in front of the graveyard and lower down to the circle at the police station. Most happen within 100m of the entrance to the settlement at the graveyard. It is scary how often it actually happens and most cyclists are not aware of the danger in that area.

[Jewbacca]

1 minute ago, porqui said:

It usually happens in front of the graveyard and lower down to the circle at the police station. Most happen within 100m of the entrance to the settlement at the graveyard. It is scary how often it actually happens and most cyclists are not aware of the danger in that area.

Yeah

Our normal loop involves going right at Disa, then right at world of birds up Ruyteplaat then back to the bottom of chappies to avoid that stretch

[porqui]

4 minutes ago, Jewbacca said:

Yeah

Our normal loop involves going right at Disa, then right at world of birds up Ruyteplaat then back to the bottom of chappies to avoid that stretch

I live at the graveyard and mostly I cycle up towards Disa and then down Valley (But that is also to add 10 km to my ride)

Do you go through Ruyterplaats and can that be done with a road bike?

Edited June 18, 2022 by porqui

[MTBRIDER1234]

4 minutes ago, porqui said:

I live at the graveyard and mostly I cycle up towards Disa and then down Valley (But that is also to add 10 km to my ride)

Do you go through Ruyterplaats and can that be done with a road bike?

Pretty sure the Ruyteplaats route that Jewbacca is talking about (if we are thinking of the same one) is offorad, so if you have a road bike, you will have to carry it a few hundred meters till you get back to the road.

[Jewbacca]

17 minutes ago, porqui said:

I live at the graveyard and mostly I cycle up towards Disa and then down Valley (But that is also to add 10 km to my ride)

Do you go through Ruyterplaats and can that be done with a road bike?

We call it 'spicy Gravel' and we do it on road bikes. 

The section that has the gate in the middle and then climbs up to the mossy red brick paving. We pop out the boom, head up towards the restaurant gates then hang a left to join the top of suikerbossie. It's very rideable on road bikes. 

Descend suikerbossie and head on to chappies. Job done

[tinmug]

I got lucky once: on hike with wife – nobody around for miles – then saw someone running in corner of eye to intercept us a 100-or-so feet ahead. Sent wife running back to car park, and I  started running towards the attacker. He stopped immediately, turned and ran away from me. 

But an utterly stupid thing to do, as most attackers would be armed. Avoidance is the best option. But the cable Roodie Sjambok™️ is a very good idea. 

[Jewbacca]

34 minutes ago, tinmug said:

I got lucky once: on hike with wife – nobody around for miles – then saw someone running in corner of eye to intercept us a 100-or-so feet ahead. Sent wife running back to car park, and I  started running towards the attacker. He stopped immediately, turned and ran away from me. 

But an utterly stupid thing to do, as most attackers would be armed. Avoidance is the best option. But the cable Roodie Sjambok™️ is a very good idea. 

I run up the mountain alone a lot. 

If you encounter anyone you are unsure of, leave the path and go about 10m off to the side. If they walk past and wave or walk past you're gold. If they wait/loiter or leave the path towards you, run away. 

They have no business following you to where you are.