Mountain Bru Posted July 14 Share Looks like the tour is overĀ š«¤ Vetplant 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselnDust Posted July 14 Share Legs are slowing ā¦..hips are rocking this is what it takes to get stronger in the third week. Bury yourself in the purpleĀ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselnDust Posted July 14 Share Chapeau Jonas. It was just a scratch yesterday and only a flesh wound today. roll on week3 cadenceblur, betaboy and Underachiever 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cadenceblur Posted July 14 Share Wow, what a combative ride from the man in yellow! Stamping his authority on the race, but still some riding to come. But for today Chapeau Tadej ! Edited July 14 by cadenceblur Vetplant and Meezo 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mountain Bru Posted July 14 Share 3 hours ago, J Wakefield said: 13 riders went faster than Lances 2001 time yesterdayĀ There was a strong tailwindĀ LR over estimate values when they try calculate them Looking at the VAM value and calculation this is more 6.6-6.7wkg which is still insane.Ā They have a whole system to try to account for altitude and wind conditions, and then to normalise the w/kg for a 60kg rider, and then arrive at anĀ įµW/Kg value, or etalon w/kg value.Ā https://lanternerouge.com/2023/02/07/watts-primer/ I think the idea is that if you can "normalise" for conditions and for rider weights, then you can actually compare climbing performances, even though the actual W/kg value might be different to what the rider actually did.Ā J Wakefield 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J Wakefield Posted July 14 Share 2 minutes ago, Mountain Bru said: They have a whole system to try to account for altitude and wind conditions, and then to normalise the w/kg for a 60kg rider, and then arrive at anĀ įµW/Kg value, or etalon w/kg value.Ā https://lanternerouge.com/2023/02/07/watts-primer/ I think the idea is that if you can "normalise" for conditions and for rider weights, then you can actually compare climbing performances, even though the actual W/kg value might be different to what the rider actually did.Ā Thanks, Everyone has a system. I can with full confidence say that they over estimate 9/10 times, especially when you have a file from a rider(s) they are reporting on. Sometimes it's fairly close but often it's pretty off.Ā I will stand with the 6.6-6.7wkg for yesterday, it's not 6.85.Ā JohanDiv, Rowl, Vetplant and 1 other 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cadenceblur Posted July 14 Share A summary of the Jonas attack? https://www.instagram.com/reel/C9aFyUtN9Kq/?igsh=eHo1ZXp1bHhzODg1 betaboy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselnDust Posted July 14 Share 17 minutes ago, Mountain Bru said: They have a whole system to try to account for altitude and wind conditions, and then to normalise the w/kg for a 60kg rider, and then arrive at anĀ įµW/Kg value, or etalon w/kg value.Ā https://lanternerouge.com/2023/02/07/watts-primer/ I think the idea is that if you can "normalise" for conditions and for rider weights, then you can actually compare climbing performances, even though the actual W/kg value might be different to what the rider actually did.Ā Still not sure what the point is youāre trying to articulate. I doubt LR has riders exact weight and power profiles, vo2 max etc. So their system is only an approximation at best.Ā love2fly 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jewbacca Posted July 14 Share 5 minutes ago, cadenceblur said: A summary of the Jonas attack? https://www.instagram.com/reel/C9aFyUtN9Kq/?igsh=eHo1ZXp1bHhzODg1 Isn't that what everyone is thinking? Pog has the lead. It's for everyone else to attack him and do the riding. This is one of the reasons his persistent attacks have been contrary to team orders. But ja, still a long way to go but yeah, it certainly doesn't look like Jonas 'is obviously in top form' after that and if he is, the Pog is on another planet currently Vetplant 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselnDust Posted July 14 Share 48 minutes ago, Jewbacca said: Isn't that what everyone is thinking? Pog has the lead. It's for everyone else to attack him and do the riding. This is one of the reasons his persistent attacks have been contrary to team orders. But ja, still a long way to go but yeah, it certainly doesn't look like Jonas 'is obviously in top form' after that and if he is, the Pog is on another planet currently It might be more reasonable to assume Jonas has been racing out of his skin, on the limit and over it which isnāt going to make the fairy tale āheāll be in form by week3ā¦ā come true.Ā he looked battered after yesterdays stage and after todays he looked worse on the bike. Baring a blood transfusion there is no way in clean sport he ācomes into form in week 3.ā Ā not quoting you, but a general sentiment that has been conveyed in the thread. i would not be surprised if he ships more time. His performance has already been miraculous basis the injuries he suffered in April. Hopefully he can stabilise his form Ā and defend second resolutelyĀ Vetplant, love2fly, betaboy and 2 others 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
betaboy Posted July 14 Share Brutal stage todayā¦. JV should hold his head up high! This guy a few weeks back was in hospital for close on two weeks and now his fighting The Pog Machine! šš»šš»šš»This is one of the best comebacks ever and letās be honest here, his up against a well oiled UAE. Visma is just not the same since Jumbo exited. 2024 season has been a disaster as a collective. Meezo and Vetplant 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselnDust Posted July 14 Share 5 minutes ago, betaboy said: Brutal stage todayā¦. JV should hold his head up high! This guy a few weeks back was in hospital for close on two weeks and now his fighting The Pog Machine! šš»šš»šš»This is one of the best comebacks ever and letās be honest here, his up against a well oiled UAE. Visma is just not the same since Jumbo exited. 2024 season has been a disaster as a collective. In previous years Jumbo had 3 riders they could build a grand tour squad around, Steven Kruiswijk, Primoz Roglic, Tom Dumoulin before the emergence of Jonas in 2021.Ā then they lost Steven and Tom and became focussed on Primoz and now Jonas. They have lost the depth and flexibility they once enjoyed. Itās now all in for Jonas which means theyāve morphed from bring Grand Tour protagonists to Tour De France focussed.Ā Ā this year they have had bad luck but also a lack of depth for the Tour and when that doesnāt work out it looks like a rotten year. If they had more wins in the classics they wouldnāt look back and say , ā bad yearā. the all in for the your approach is high stakes because more teams have got the formula right but one of those has Tadej PogaÄar. They can use the same strategy next year and gave the same risks, or revert to previous years structures and take the heat off themselvesĀ Mook 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bub Marley Posted July 14 Share 3 hours ago, Mountain Bru said: They have a whole system to try to account for altitude and wind conditions, and then to normalise the w/kg for a 60kg rider, and then arrive at anĀ įµW/Kg value, or etalon w/kg value.Ā https://lanternerouge.com/2023/02/07/watts-primer/ I think the idea is that if you can "normalise" for conditions and for rider weights, then you can actually compare climbing performances, even though the actual W/kg value might be different to what the rider actually did.Ā Mate forget about the stats. You can immediately tell when Pog is over or under the limit just by using your eyes.Ā Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jewbacca Posted July 14 Share 2 hours ago, DieselnDust said: In previous years Jumbo had 3 riders they could build a grand tour squad around, Steven Kruiswijk, Primoz Roglic, Tom Dumoulin before the emergence of Jonas in 2021.Ā then they lost Steven and Tom and became focussed on Primoz and now Jonas. They have lost the depth and flexibility they once enjoyed. Itās now all in for Jonas which means theyāve morphed from bring Grand Tour protagonists to Tour De France focussed.Ā Ā this year they have had bad luck but also a lack of depth for the Tour and when that doesnāt work out it looks like a rotten year. If they had more wins in the classics they wouldnāt look back and say , ā bad yearā. the all in for the your approach is high stakes because more teams have got the formula right but one of those has Tadej PogaÄar. They can use the same strategy next year and gave the same risks, or revert to previous years structures and take the heat off themselvesĀ Add the loss of Kuss and the 'also returning from injury' van Aert and you have the two top domestiques 'MIA' while Vingo is also low on confidence, low on race time, unsure how his recovery has really gone etc.... Last season was 3 GT's and a whole lot of Spring wins. This year it could very well be zero GTs and less Spring wins... They won Omloop, Dwars Door and 19 other top tier wins... 21 isn't a poor season but it's not good by their standardsĀ Mook and DieselnDust 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F@yino Posted July 14 Share Jonas post race interview he says he did 1 of his best rides ever. I think Pogi has just reached another level this season. UAE undoubtedly have a stronger team in the mountains this year as well. Meezo and Vetplant 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselnDust Posted July 14 Share 19 minutes ago, F@yino said: Jonas post race interview he says he did 1 of his best rides ever. I think Pogi has just reached another level this season. UAE undoubtedly have a stronger team in the mountains this year as well. Damn right , today that too team was Visma lease a bike. pogaÄar probably made a call to the customer support and ordered a mountain team lead out and they sent Keldermann, Jorgenson and Vingegaardš Jewbacca 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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