Check wear on MTB 12 speed chain

[buckstopper]

I work on the 0.5% rule. I lay a new chain next to the old one and look at the difference over the same number of links. If the difference is more than 0.5%, replace. The chain is nearly 1.5m long so 0.5% is about 7mm.(Admittedly this is for road/gravel 11sp). 

[Wyatt Earp]

3 hours ago, mazambaan said:

To digress slightly, how does the PT item work and is it 100% on needing replacement?

I ask as previous experience of some bike shops is that a service and chain is like asking a barber if you need a haircut.

This is my one.

Quite old now, if I say 10 years I might even be lying, probably even older (can’t remember when they came out)

It’s a brilliant tool.

The most accurate of all chain checkers, and I have around 20 different ones.

 

To elaborate on the rest.

I’m not a big fan of changing a chain like underpants. My usual recommendation to people is to ride the drivetrain till it’s properly done.

There is really no financial rescue, nor an exponential wear gain by replacing the chain every now and then.

 

 

[DieselnDust]

It’s a brilliant tool but it’s not an accurate gauge for 12speed. Chains with oversize rollers .

[NotSoBigBen]

39 minutes ago, Wyatt Earp said:

This is my one.

Quite old now, if I say 10 years I might even be lying, probably even older (can’t remember when they came out)

It’s a brilliant tool.

The most accurate of all chain checkers, and I have around 20 different ones.

 

To elaborate on the rest.

I’m not a big fan of changing a chain like underpants. My usual recommendation to people is to ride the drivetrain till it’s properly done.

There is really no financial rescue, nor an exponential wear gain by replacing the chain every now and then.

 

 

Every now and then I read stuff from some hubbers and it reminds of that yellow 🤠 chap ... ek se maar net 😜

[Wyatt Earp]

1 hour ago, NotSoBigBen said:

Every now and then I read stuff from some hubbers and it reminds of that yellow 🤠 chap ... ek se maar net 😜

Indeed

I read, observe and smile, sometimes even chuckle

[DieselnDust]

1 hour ago, Wyatt Earp said:

Indeed

I read, observe and smile, sometimes even chuckle

Interesting that you do not include learn….

people who understand this drawing know why a cc-2 doesn’t work well and instead use a CC-4.

people that don’t understand it….promote the cc-2 and other inside checkers

[Steady Spin]

12 minutes ago, DieselnDust said:

Interesting that you do not include learn….

people who understand this drawing know why a cc-2 doesn’t work well and instead use a CC-4.

people that don’t understand it….promote the cc-2 and other inside checkers

CC-3.2?

CC-2 shows 0.25 on my XX1 chain and the CC-3.2 doesn’t even come close to going in. 

[Steady Spin]

Jeez. Good read 

https://bicycles.stackexchange.com/questions/47908/parktool-cc-2-chain-checker-incorrect-readings

[dasilvarsa]

12 inch Rule Works on 12 Speed as Well

 

Edited December 20, 2022 by dasilvarsa

[mazambaan]

Thank you guys. I used to always replace my own chains when "done". Recent experience with an LBS has been indifferent I think. A chain with no issues was replaced against my better judgement, and the new one broke after less than 600 or 700km (and I have never ever broken a chain except many, many moons ago on a Makro bike).  BUT, 12spd, so the article from Steady Spin will be most interesting.

Scary (to me anyway) to note that a good 12spd chain can set you back R1 000; about the same as a 520 O ring dirt bike chain.  Even an X ring is only R1 300 or so.

[DieselnDust]

24 minutes ago, Steady Spin said:

CC-3.2?

CC-2 shows 0.25 on my XX1 chain and the CC-3.2 doesn’t even come close to going in. 

All the checkers that measure the rollers inside distance are going to give variable and inaccurate feedback on chainwear. Variability is an issue already but inaccurate isn’t lekker. Rollers don’t stay round forever then plus the degree of wear and the the compounding effects of measuring the wrong dimension just make them pretty useless.

CC-2 also suffers from issues relating to the pins accuracy. They can get bent and then what? 
CC-3.2 is also an inside to inside checker but it’s only slightly better than CC-2 since it doesn’t have pins that can bend.

if you’re on 7,8,9,10 or 11 speed then these checkers are ok since the rollers on those chains were all the same diameter. With 12s and bigger roller chains your 0.5% is not the same pitch as a lower speed chain.

the only checkers that provide some degree of consistency are inside to outside checkers like the cc-4

[dave303e]

9 minutes ago, mazambaan said:

Thank you guys. I used to always replace my own chains when "done". Recent experience with an LBS has been indifferent I think. A chain with no issues was replaced against my better judgement, and the new one broke after less than 600 or 700km (and I have never ever broken a chain except many, many moons ago on a Makro bike).  BUT, 12spd, so the article from Steady Spin will be most interesting.

Scary (to me anyway) to note that a good 12spd chain can set you back R1 000; about the same as a 520 O ring dirt bike chain.  Even an X ring is only R1 300 or so.

yup, because a 520 chain is standard on all adult sized dirtbikes, across brands/countries etc. We are just lucky the mtb manufacturers haven't come up with their own measuring system because metric and imperial are too standard. Next they will create their own system and then they can then sell us a new tape measure.

[DieselnDust]

40 minutes ago, Steady Spin said:

Jeez. Good read 

https://bicycles.stackexchange.com/questions/47908/parktool-cc-2-chain-checker-incorrect-readings

CN42  and CC-4 work similarly and indicate roller wear. They don’t measure as they’re go-no go gauges 

[Steady Spin]

8 minutes ago, DieselnDust said:

All the checkers that measure the rollers inside distance are going to give variable and inaccurate feedback on chainwear. Variability is an issue already but inaccurate isn’t lekker. Rollers don’t stay round forever then plus the degree of wear and the the compounding effects of measuring the wrong dimension just make them pretty useless.

CC-2 also suffers from issues relating to the pins accuracy. They can get bent and then what? 
CC-3.2 is also an inside to inside checker but it’s only slightly better than CC-2 since it doesn’t have pins that can bend.

if you’re on 7,8,9,10 or 11 speed then these checkers are ok since the rollers on those chains were all the same diameter. With 12s and bigger roller chains your 0.5% is not the same pitch as a lower speed chain.

the only checkers that provide some degree of consistency are inside to outside checkers like the cc-4

So how far out are we talking here? 

CC-4 is cheap enough to buy at least.

[DieselnDust]

2 minutes ago, Steady Spin said:

So how far out are we talking here? 

CC-4 is cheap enough to buy at least.

That is very hard to quantify since we can't measure the wear on the internal diameter of the roller or the outside wear of the pin separately. With the CN41/42 and CC-4 we at least know that our gauge is not over reading the wear or underreading it (if pin and roller is ovalised)

[NotSoBigBen]

Sorry ou's but as a non "anorak" I'd rather take the Sheriff's advice and ride my stuff till it's dead .... but that's probably just me the "luddite"

 

These "micro millimeter" discussions go over my head