Is this the start of the end?

[Paul Ruinaard]

https://cyclingfly.com/are-specialized-bikes-so-expensive/

So after copious ramblings its all really in this article in one way or another.

BTW rough maths on Mike Sinyard's net worth is $ 989 million US $. FWIW Mike is the founder and ex CEO of our favourite love Specialized. So I think that answers where all the margin is going for at least Specialized.

Edited January 4, 2023 by Paul Ruinaard

[DieselnDust]

36 minutes ago, Shebeen said:

Cost of fuel is built into anything that moves, but the end product never seems to get cheaper when the pump price drops. At least farmers get a rebate on their diesel from SARS.

Rebate in the taxable elements but they still pay the BFP

[DieselnDust]

22 minutes ago, Paul Ruinaard said:

https://cyclingfly.com/are-specialized-bikes-so-expensive/

So after copious ramblings its all really in this article in one way or another.

BTW rough maths on Mike Sinyard's net worth is $ 989 million US $. FWIW Mike is the founder and ex CEO of our favourite love Specialized. So I think that answers where all the margin is going for at least Specialized.

R&D costs into a bicycle are minuscule. Any company claimin their R&D costs are high are in the same as those spending $100million to get 2 more dimples onto a golf ball. It’s a marketing spend and not a true E&D spend. The only safety standard they have to pass is a couple of EN standards for fork and frame impact resistance. They spend the big $ on using hours and hours of wind tunnel time trying to convince you that this years truck is more aero than last years brick.

 

[W@nted]

So when are the prices coming down? Just saw conti gp5000 TL tires advertised for R2k per tire? 🤷🏼‍♂️

[Wyatt Earp]

3 hours ago, Paul Ruinaard said:

https://cyclingfly.com/are-specialized-bikes-so-expensive/

So after copious ramblings its all really in this article in one way or another.

BTW rough maths on Mike Sinyard's net worth is $ 989 million US $. FWIW Mike is the founder and ex CEO of our favourite love Specialized. So I think that answers where all the margin is going for at least Specialized.

Yet one would never think it.

The man lives humble, with a humble home.

But then again, Specialized is an empire.

I wonder if that net worth is the business or Mike the individual?

 

But I digress, no doubt (and no one in particular here) some distributors are maximizing their profits 

 

[Wyatt Earp]

[Paul Ruinaard]

12 hours ago, W@nted said:

So when are the prices coming down? Just saw conti gp5000 TL tires advertised for R2k per tire? 🤷🏼‍♂️

Ed Zackery.

I was also going to post that one - from Evobikes. Now they are of course the new GP 5000 TL with Black Chilee compound so hey what do I know maybe hand bonded and rolled on the thighs of virgins in exotic places to achieve the smoothness they do. So the input costs must be really high....

FWIW, I used to complain when buying GP 3000 for R 300 per tyre which eventually went to R 599. Then GP 5000 TL comes out was now R 999. Then R 1299. Now R 2k. Even the gator used to be R 160 per tyre seems to have gone crazy.

So going on previous posts i see rubber prices have gone insane so maybe thats what we are seeing. But a 4 x 4 tyre for an amarok is R 4,5k. So I just don't get it cause theres a lot more rubber in a single 4 x 4 tyre than in say 2,5 Cont GP 5000s. 

Go figure.

Again do you see on Takealot you can get the Pirelli for R 899. 

Maybe a bike dealer would like to put up their costings and show where the margin is being added. BTW Exchange rates have recovered to R 16,89 - even fuel price is going down. And yes i get the input costs are locked in to the current production batch when they were made but then prices will fall as the new costs filter through - however that never happens.

 

[Paul Ruinaard]

12 hours ago, Wyatt Earp said:

Hey thats maybe his bank balance. Just like Jacob Zuma is bankrupt and has no money to pay for anything, you need to look through the veil  - none of these guys ever hold assets in their name. Not saying he isn't a good guy BTW but you dont start the biggest bicycle company in the world and run it for so many years to end up with a net worth of $ 2m. 

But we know you are a fan boy my son 🙂

 

[PhilipV]

18 hours ago, dave303e said:

The proverbial sh storm is well and truly on the way in other places as well. Most farmers planted Oct/November last year. November was the highest the diesel price has ever been. At 18-25l/hour you looking at R3600-R5000 for an 8 hour day per tractor vs the R2400-3400 it was a year ago. I watched my neighbor run the process from my office, 2 tractors worked for 8-10 hours a day(conservative) for nearly 3 weeks. That cost increase is going to destroy when it hits woolworths shelves. Remember if you not eating the maize, your milk, chicken, beef, laborers etc will all be caught by that. Sure it is all well and good the fuel price has dropped substantially since then so the transport is better now. But a crop planted in November is going to keep costing you for the next year, that ship has sailed. 

Farms are price takers. They can't exactly tell WW how much they want. 

9 minutes ago, Paul Ruinaard said:

Hey thats maybe his bank balance. Just like Jacob Zuma is bankrupt and has no money to pay for anything, you need to look through the veil  - none of these guys ever hold assets in their name. Not saying he isn't a good guy BTW but you dont start the biggest bicycle company in the world and run it for so many years to end up with a net worth of $ 2m. 

But we know you are a fan boy my son 🙂

 

Ja let's not allow facts to get in the way of a good rambling.

[dave303e]

17 hours ago, DieselnDust said:

Not quite as simple as that as various supply chain costs kick in at different time s bit yes, a higher product direct cost will be transferred to the consumer.

the price of carbon bikes is not tied to the oil price though yet that is it’s main onoit cost. Everything from the PAN fibres to the resin is crude derived yet it is decoupled. That decoupling is perceived value and that is mostly ego driven.

nobody needs a R250K Mtb to ride the cape epic but somehow everyone believes they need the most expensive bike they can afford 

Ya it is a lot more complex, but it is a base cost that affects a huge area if it goes up.

16 hours ago, Shebeen said:

Cost of fuel is built into anything that moves, but the end product never seems to get cheaper when the pump price drops. At least farmers get a rebate on their diesel from SARS.

After Rebate you still paying nearly 50% more than you did the previous year. It is all relative.

 

29 minutes ago, PhilipV said:

Farms are price takers. They can't exactly tell WW how much they want. 

Ja let's not allow facts to get in the way of a good rambling.

Yes this is true, but I look at the small scale operation we have here, wholesale milk price went up for the first time in 3 years and we managed to get nearly a 25% increase per litre.

[Wyatt Earp]

2 hours ago, Paul Ruinaard said:

Hey thats maybe his bank balance. Just like Jacob Zuma is bankrupt and has no money to pay for anything, you need to look through the veil  - none of these guys ever hold assets in their name. Not saying he isn't a good guy BTW but you dont start the biggest bicycle company in the world and run it for so many years to end up with a net worth of $ 2m. 

But we know you are a fan boy my son 🙂

 

Far from being a fanboy.

Haven’t ridden a Specialized in years and have been badly done over by them, so no love lost.

I can assure you that Sinyard has nowhere near a net worth of almost a billion dollars.

Whoever wrote that article grabbed at stompies and applied it to the individual as opposed to the company.

And no I’m not defending him, but if he was worth almost a billion dollars as an individual, we would have seen nothing but Specialized all around us.

FWIW it was determined that Raleigh Bicycles has the biggest net worth. Which is estimated at $ 1.8 billion.

[The Ouzo]

15 hours ago, W@nted said:

So when are the prices coming down? Just saw conti gp5000 TL tires advertised for R2k per tire? 🤷🏼‍♂️

cant believe the cost of tyres. And thats if you can get the tyre in the size you want.

[W@nted]

5 hours ago, Paul Ruinaard said:

Ed Zackery.

I was also going to post that one - from Evobikes. Now they are of course the new GP 5000 TL with Black Chilee compound so hey what do I know maybe hand bonded and rolled on the thighs of virgins in exotic places to achieve the smoothness they do. So the input costs must be really high....

FWIW, I used to complain when buying GP 3000 for R 300 per tyre which eventually went to R 599. Then GP 5000 TL comes out was now R 999. Then R 1299. Now R 2k. Even the gator used to be R 160 per tyre seems to have gone crazy.

So going on previous posts i see rubber prices have gone insane so maybe thats what we are seeing. But a 4 x 4 tyre for an amarok is R 4,5k. So I just don't get it cause theres a lot more rubber in a single 4 x 4 tyre than in say 2,5 Cont GP 5000s. 

Go figure.

Again do you see on Takealot you can get the Pirelli for R 899. 

Maybe a bike dealer would like to put up their costings and show where the margin is being added. BTW Exchange rates have recovered to R 16,89 - even fuel price is going down. And yes i get the input costs are locked in to the current production batch when they were made but then prices will fall as the new costs filter through - however that never happens.

 

Exactly. The last set op gp5000 tires I bought 2 years ago for R700 per tire. Bought Pirelli pzero TLR tires last month for R900 per tire. Not sure what these gp5000 are made of.

 

anyway, prices are crazy

[warick_wrx]

10 minutes ago, W@nted said:

Exactly. The last set op gp5000 tires I bought 2 years ago for R700 per tire. Bought Pirelli pzero TLR tires last month for R900 per tire. Not sure what these gp5000 are made of.

 

anyway, prices are crazy

what shop did you dource the Pirelli pzero TLR tires from ?

Edited January 5, 2023 by warick_wrx

[W@nted]

5 minutes ago, warick_wrx said:

what shop did you dource the Pirelli pzero TLR tires from ?

I bought them from bikehubs campag man @JMK1

[The Ouzo]

17 minutes ago, W@nted said:

Exactly. The last set op gp5000 tires I bought 2 years ago for R700 per tire. Bought Pirelli pzero TLR tires last month for R900 per tire. Not sure what these gp5000 are made of.

 

anyway, prices are crazy

pirelli cinturato 28c tyres have been around R800 the last 2 times I've bought, now, if you can find them in 28c, they are the wrong side of 1k, pushing 1200 at some places.

I'm nursing the current set as long as possible hoping for a special somehwere or for prices to come down.

Edited January 5, 2023 by The Ouzo