forkie Posted February 28, 2019 Share no. you can use force when you feel your life is threatened.but you cant use force if your property is being threatened. And that is why criminals have more rights. Link to comment https://forum.bikehub.co.za/topic/102931-i-have-an-idea-for-a-new-thread/page/4227/#findComment-3466246 Share on other sites More sharing options...
MTBeer Posted February 28, 2019 Share but you cant use force if your property is being threatened. And that is why criminals have more rights. you can't kill somebody, but you can act against them physically. HDW 1 Link to comment https://forum.bikehub.co.za/topic/102931-i-have-an-idea-for-a-new-thread/page/4227/#findComment-3466257 Share on other sites More sharing options...
forkie Posted February 28, 2019 Share you can't kill somebody, but you can act against them physically.again thats a load of crap. Generally a criminal is a lot tougher stronger stupider and violenter than your normal middle class white guy. so you say i can act against them physically. what am i supposed to do? i am not allowed to pull a gun until i feel my life is under threat. so i have to wait until they are kicking my ass before i can defend myself. its stupid Link to comment https://forum.bikehub.co.za/topic/102931-i-have-an-idea-for-a-new-thread/page/4227/#findComment-3466261 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lotus Posted February 28, 2019 Share I see this line trotted out often on the interwebs. It's simply not true - everyone has the same rights. You might not like those rights when applied to criminals, but that is a different debate.It's been mentioned a few times before - the reason the victim gets charged for shooting a criminal is simply because that's how the police have to process the case. The investigating officer can't make a call on whether the shooter was an innocent victim or bystander. That's up to the prosecutor, based on evidence that the police will gather in a formal and methodical process. The reality is that the prosecutor will invariably look at the merits of the case and decline to prosecute. The "victim" is then informed, without going to court and no stain on their record. I may be mistaken on some of the details, but that's (largely) how it plays out. Anyone else know the facts about this? Ed-Zulu and Skylark 2 Link to comment https://forum.bikehub.co.za/topic/102931-i-have-an-idea-for-a-new-thread/page/4227/#findComment-3466266 Share on other sites More sharing options...
forkie Posted February 28, 2019 Share It's been mentioned a few times before - the reason the victim gets charged for shooting a criminal is simply because that's how the police have to process the case. The investigating officer can't make a call on whether the shooter was an innocent victim or bystander. That's up to the prosecutor, based on evidence that the police will gather in a formal and methodical process. The reality is that the prosecutor will invariably look at the merits of the case and decline to prosecute. The "victim" is then informed, without going to court and no stain on their record. I may be mistaken on some of the details, but that's (largely) how it plays out. Anyone else know the facts about this?agreed this would be the case in a life and death situation, but it would not be the case if i shot someone who was breaking into my house just to steal. this is where i have a problem. i cannot defend my property. Link to comment https://forum.bikehub.co.za/topic/102931-i-have-an-idea-for-a-new-thread/page/4227/#findComment-3466268 Share on other sites More sharing options...
MTBeer Posted February 28, 2019 Share again thats a load of crap. Generally a criminal is a lot tougher stronger stupider and violenter than your normal middle class white guy. so you say i can act against them physically. what am i supposed to do? i am not allowed to pull a gun until i feel my life is under threat. so i have to wait until they are kicking my ass before i can defend myself. its stupidok Link to comment https://forum.bikehub.co.za/topic/102931-i-have-an-idea-for-a-new-thread/page/4227/#findComment-3466275 Share on other sites More sharing options...
forkie Posted February 28, 2019 Share okwhy do i feel like you are just saying that to keep me quiet? Link to comment https://forum.bikehub.co.za/topic/102931-i-have-an-idea-for-a-new-thread/page/4227/#findComment-3466277 Share on other sites More sharing options...
MTBeer Posted February 28, 2019 Share forkie 1 Link to comment https://forum.bikehub.co.za/topic/102931-i-have-an-idea-for-a-new-thread/page/4227/#findComment-3466283 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lotus Posted February 28, 2019 Share agreed this would be the case in a life and death situation, but it would not be the case if i shot someone who was breaking into my house just to steal. this is where i have a problem. i cannot defend my property. Maybe that's where you have to decide whether your response is proportional to the threat. Odinson, Blackbeard and MTBeer 3 Link to comment https://forum.bikehub.co.za/topic/102931-i-have-an-idea-for-a-new-thread/page/4227/#findComment-3466311 Share on other sites More sharing options...
forkie Posted February 28, 2019 Share Maybe that's where you have to decide whether your response is proportional to the threat.i know - i get that. responsible firearm owner and all that. but I still feel that the deck is stacked in favour of the criminal and against the law abiding citizen. Link to comment https://forum.bikehub.co.za/topic/102931-i-have-an-idea-for-a-new-thread/page/4227/#findComment-3466319 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patchelicious Posted February 28, 2019 Share i know - i get that. responsible firearm owner and all that. but I still feel that the deck is stacked in favour of the criminal and against the law abiding citizen. Stop with the feelings Link to comment https://forum.bikehub.co.za/topic/102931-i-have-an-idea-for-a-new-thread/page/4227/#findComment-3466321 Share on other sites More sharing options...
forkie Posted February 28, 2019 Share Stop with the feelingssorry. its just so hard sometimes. Link to comment https://forum.bikehub.co.za/topic/102931-i-have-an-idea-for-a-new-thread/page/4227/#findComment-3466323 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fruity Posted February 28, 2019 Share Long Wheel Base, MTBeer and Allrounder 3 Link to comment https://forum.bikehub.co.za/topic/102931-i-have-an-idea-for-a-new-thread/page/4227/#findComment-3466325 Share on other sites More sharing options...
forkie Posted February 28, 2019 Share Maybe that's where you have to decide whether your response is proportional to the threat.just out of interest - and i am not trying to be patchelicious argumentative: I walk into my lounge. there are 2 guys helping themselves to my TV and hifi. they are both unarmed but substantially bigger than me. I have my firearm on me but have not drawn it yet. what would the correct / acceptible response be? Link to comment https://forum.bikehub.co.za/topic/102931-i-have-an-idea-for-a-new-thread/page/4227/#findComment-3466330 Share on other sites More sharing options...
fanievb Posted February 28, 2019 Share just out of interest - and i am not trying to be patchelicious argumentative: I walk into my lounge. there are 2 guys helping themselves to my TV and hifi. they are both unarmed but substantially bigger than me. I have my firearm on me but have not drawn it yet. what would the correct / acceptible response be? skiet altwee in hulle moer IMan777, forkie and BSG 3 Link to comment https://forum.bikehub.co.za/topic/102931-i-have-an-idea-for-a-new-thread/page/4227/#findComment-3466338 Share on other sites More sharing options...
forkie Posted February 28, 2019 Share skiet altwee in hulle moerand then plant a weapon on them... BSG 1 Link to comment https://forum.bikehub.co.za/topic/102931-i-have-an-idea-for-a-new-thread/page/4227/#findComment-3466340 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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