Nutritional Supplementation - What are we really paying for?

[Carcarias1974]

Hi Hubbers,

I've been reading A LOT regarding supplementation over the last 2-3 weeks, and the more I read, the more I wonder if we are being taken for a very expensive ride...

My searches have been focused on the scientific literature, and looking in particular at supplementing with Glutamine, Creatine and supplementation as part of recovery strategies (e.g. high proteine high KJoule recovery drinks).

To be honest, I failed to find ONE reliable article that supports the use of these products / strategies.

So my question, I guess, is: Does anyone have any data that backs the use of anything more than a replenishment strategy for recovery, especially in endurance events such as the Cape Epic?

[Lucky Luke.]

I think the basic premise behind a recovery drink is that it is formulated to contain the stuff that is depleted by sustained and intense exercise - protein, carbs (in the correct ratio), vitamins and minerals etc.

 

If you're getting this stuff from your regular diet, no need for a recovery drink.

 

However, if you're at the Epic and too tired or pressed for time to think about it, or just concerned about getting the right balance of required nutrition - ie. you would prefer not to have to think about how to cook all that into a meal, then et voila, the recovery drink market has come to address your needs.

 

Personally I only use recovery drinks when I'm severely depleted - like after 5 or 6 hour rides, or very hard sessions of 3 hours or more, and usually only when I know I need to ride again the next day.

[Carcarias1974]

That makes sense, fortified drinks make lots more sense than eating 26 hamburgers!

 

There is still however a BIG question hanging over the head of Glutamine and Creatine in endurance sport.

[Louis for real]

i Can say this, stopped using sports drinks during rides-switched to grape juice, nougat, a bite every 20mins or so mixed with two safari trail bars a packet of nuts and water to thirst during long rides/race efforts and the king of all-Pacing your efforts...papya and beetroot also work wonders for me.dont know why?

I get the whole epic thing- being to pushed to even think of preparing food but to me i feel we are being brainwashed by companies into thinking that what they offer is what we need. same as a certain wheel debate.

Edited January 6, 2014 by eye i

[North Shore]

Let's pool together 127 anecdotal reports of the wonders of nutritional supplements and maybe we too can get published in SAMA.

[V12man]

The easiest reference set to decent literature is on the Cadence Nutrition web site - Jeroen Swarts products, but he has references to the science.

 

My opinion is that they have a place and a use, but for what they actually are internally, its a rip.

 

Most recreational cyclists are largely wasting their time and money using these products - but correctly applied they have a use - especially amongst elite athletes, but they will never replace Christoph Sausers much quoted ditty - eat less and train harder - in terms of performance improvement....

[BarHugger]

In most cases you are paying for hope, ideals, promises and a clever marketing strategy that promotes 10% potential as 100% fact. Supplements is a chemical dream in a bottle that requires a lot of ching-ching to give you the necessary dingaling.

[Cellar]

they will never replace Christoph Sausers much quoted ditty - eat less and train harder - in terms of performance improvement....

 

Where's that low carb high fat diet?

 

haha.

[I am not SomeBloke]

In most cases you are paying for hope, ideals, promises and a clever marketing strategy that promotes 10% potential as 100% fact. Supplements is a chemical dream in a bottle that requires a lot of ching-ching to give you the necessary dingaling.

 

Yup, it's almost powdered homeopathy, useful to about 5% of it's user base: those guys who are seriously depleting their reserves with very little time to solve it through just diet.

[Cellar]

Yup, it's almost powdered homeopathy,

 

Well, I take exception.

 

When I was a kid, I was allergic to a lot of things. I was sent from doc to specialist till the cows came home.

 

My dad sent me to a homoeopath. I went, the guy did his thing, and six months worth of bi monthly injections in my back, I am now nearly twenty years down the line, to experience any of the symptoms that led me there in the first place.

 

My daughter was born with an allergic reaction to rice. Google that ****. Less that 1% of people ever in the history of people have ever had that.

 

Docs said nothing.

 

Took her to homoeopath when she was around 18 months old. Gave course of "meds/supplements" and since then she eats rice no problem.

 

Psychosomatic my bum.

Edited January 6, 2014 by Cellar

[V12man]

Where's that low carb high fat diet?

 

haha.

 

funny that... some of the recipes in TDN's new book come straight from the hub...

[DJR]

You pay to make expensive urine.

[BarHugger]

You pay to make expensive urine.

 

One also needs to consider the effect of these chemical cocktails and the substances in them on specific organs such as the liver and kidneys.

[V12man]

Well, I take exception.

 

When I was a kid, I was allergic to a lot of things. I was sent from doc to specialist till the cows came home.

 

My dad sent me to a homoeopath. I went, the guy did his thing, and six months worth of bi monthly injections in my back, I am now nearly twenty years down the line, to experience any of the symptoms that led me there in the first place.

 

My daughter was born with an allergic reaction to rice. Google that ****. Less that 1% of people ever in the history of people have ever had that.

 

Docs said nothing.

 

Took her to homoeopath when she was around 18 months old. Gave course of "meds/supplements" and since then she eats rice no problem.

 

Psychosomatic my bum.

 

If she was really allergic to rice, she would not be able to eat it now without a response - even the best treatment's for allergies only reduce their impact - but you can still test the response in the lab.

 

Food sensitivities are another matter - especially in kids - as their intestines and intestinal flora matures, they flop in and out of short term responses - but they are not true allergic responses - any homeopath that can cure really allergies with meds/supplements needs a business manager - because the medical world would love to be able to do this

 

The important bit is that she is not suffering - and no matter how you got there, it's a good outcome....

 

Not all homeopathy interventions have good outcomes... unfortunately.... they have about the same cure rate as my local sangoma... who weirdly, despite being non conventionally medically trained, sometimes gets results, the good thing about her is that she refers people into conventional medicine often - especially for lumps and bumps.... she has a designer doorbell ring at my house for patients she brings with her.... who I usually send on to the Gen or Bara with a note - met her just after I moved in to this house trying to help someone who had collapsed on the sidewalk outside - (easy short term fix - coke - badly controlled diabetic who went too low) and we have been friendly ever since - I have even had some of her potions tested that she used on some patients with hypertension - aspirin... from the bark of some or other tree..

 

Never underestimate the power of a patients mind - I cured my daughters stomach pain tonight (that she has been complaining of since yesterday) with a nice looking pink pill - I guarantee the pill did nothing... physiologically anyway.... designer kiddies placebo... happy kid, happy parents...

[North Shore]

Homeopathy has either been proved not to work, or not been proved to work. Alternative medicine that has been proved to work is called medicine.

 

Homeopathy claims that a solution becomes more potent as the dilution increases (to the ppm where you are not consuming even a single molecule of active ingredient). This goes against all the laws of physics and our understanding of mammalian physiology.

 

Taking the placebo effect into account the only condition homeopathy could ever be relied upon to treat is dehydration, because the treatment is water.

 

Science adjusts it's views based on what is observed. Faith is the denial of observation, so that belief can be preserved.

[Lucky Luke.]

Most recreational cyclists are largely wasting their time and money using these products - but correctly applied they have a use - especially amongst elite athletes, but they will never replace Christoph Sausers much quoted ditty - eat less and train harder - in terms of performance improvement....

 

Exactly - amateur cyclists would all progress far, far more quickly by eating less and riding further. Train your body to burn fat stores, lose weight and you will go much faster and further much quicker.